The Joys of a High-Maintenace sub

[Rhabbi]

Apparently subs think that we Doms want doormats. Let me tell you, if I want a doormat I will go to Home Depot and pick one up.

I was having a discussion today with one of my subs and she asked me if she was high-maintenance. It came about because she had been going through some rough times and was worried that I was getting a bit tired of the emotional roller coaster. I told her that Doms expect subs to be high-maintenance, and that it is the basic definition of a sub.

It actually got me to thinking about this, and although it was said as a jest and to reassure her that I am not upset about the need to reassure her, I realized that I do expect this type of thing from a sub. I do not see them as high-maintenance in the sense that they are needy or clingy, but in the sense that I, as a Dom, expect to help them adjust to my style and temperament.

This process is often a drawn out one, and involves adjustments on my part as well. And this actually is even more difficult and prolonged. Walking a sub through this journey is a life time commitment, and requires a firm hand and a soft touch.

Personally, I am glad that subs are high-maintenance. This makes my life interesting and allows me to learn about them and myself as I go along. This makes me a better Dom, and a better man.

I propose that we honor all the high-maintenance subs here, and even have a contest to find the one that is the most challenging.

[Arria]

Kiss.

*wipes tear from eye*

[angelic.zest]

hmmmm? *thinks if im high-maintance or not*...well i consider myself to be abit high-maintance maybe because i know my self worth and want to be appericated for my submission to that "right" Dom, and not just be grouped into a sub who is clingy,needed ...because all know im neither ..so i guess i am abit "high-maintance"..

[Rhabbi]

hmmmm? *thinks if im high-maintance or not*...well i consider myself to be abit high-maintance maybe because i know my self worth and want to be appericated for my submission to that "right" Dom, and not just be grouped into a sub who is clingy,needed ...because all know im neither ..so i guess i am abit "high-maintance"..

C'mon zest, you know you are definately high-maintenace.

[kestrel]

~smiles all high maintenance like~

Seriously though, I know that I am mental and emotional high maintenance but that is far from being clingy and needy. I am fortunate to have a Master that is caring and understanding and willing to let me be high maintenance. It's a two way street. He's a high maintenance Master. ~grins~ The differences between Mishka and I make it so that where one falls short the other picks up the slack so it all works out and everyone is happy. I reckon you could call us a high maintenance family that works.

[Rhabbi]

~smiles all high maintenance like~

Seriously though, I know that I am mental and emotional high maintenance but that is far from being clingy and needy. I am fortunate to have a Master that is caring and understanding and willing to let me be high maintenance. It's a two way street. He's a high maintenance Master. ~grins~ The differences between Mishka and I make it so that where one falls short the other picks up the slack so it all works out and everyone is happy. I reckon you could call us a high maintenance family that works.

Well put kestrel.

[princess_of_pain]

This should be an interesting contest. I'm wondering exactly what criteria the subs will need to meet in order for us to suss out the highest of high maintenance submissives.

*Watches with anticipation* :popc1:

[Flaming_Redhead]

I propose that we honor all the high-maintenance subs here, and even have a contest to find the one that is the most challenging.

Here here! Not that I'd be eligible for the contest if there was such a thing.....*smiles sweetly* Maybe I'd qualify for "most likely to be spanked...often" or "most bratty." *ggls*

[Ozme52]

I guess I kind of disagree. But it may be due to semantics. If you define high maintenance as requiring lots of love and attention, then who can argue.

But high maintenance in the vanilla world, imo, means someone who is so self centered that they must be the center of attention and they're never satisfied when they get it. Sounds like the opposite of a sub to me.

[Mishka]

But high maintenance in the vanilla world, imo, means someone who is so self centered that they must be the center of attention and they're never satisfied when they get it. Sounds like the opposite of a sub to me.


It can be, but I would make that the definition of a "pain in the ass". "High maintenance" might be the pretty word that is used to cover up the gritting teeth.

I see it as a matter of patience. Committed couples eventually (maybe not right away) accept that the other person has certain qualities and quirks that, no matter how long you live together, no matter how much they challenge and irritate you, won't be something they can really improve, help or fix.

A physically high maintenance vanilla wife takes the 45 minutes to preen and fluff herself before going out, or she needs a great deal of foreplay and comfort for sex, or she is extremely picky with food, etc. Her husband sits patiently, accepting that this is his wife, he loves her, and these particular traits can be infuriating and endearing all at the same time. The maintenance is knowing when to be patient, when to reassure and when to push her ass out the door.

I am lumped in the other category of an emotionally high maintenance wife. I cannot fix my "brain chemistry" to rid me of certain "disorders"; the meds help, but I will always challenge the patience of my loved ones in this area. If I get out-of-control upset I can be talked down it just takes a little while, sometimes i need a smack in the head (figuaratively speaking) to "snap out of it" (for the moment) and sometimes my panic attacks need calm reassurance.

Make sense?

[Logic1]

makes sense Mishka

[princess_of_pain]

It can be, but I would make that the definition of a "pain in the ass". "High maintenance" might be the pretty word that is used to cover up the gritting teeth.

Just wondering what that makes me...high maintenance, pain-in-the-ass, or the dreaded "combo pack?" :)

[Logic1]

I bet you are the loved combo pack ;)

[gagged_Louise]

How about a contest "most demanding Dom/me?"

[kestrel]

I guess I kind of disagree. But it may be due to semantics. If you define high maintenance as requiring lots of love and attention, then who can argue.

But high maintenance in the vanilla world, imo, means someone who is so self centered that they must be the center of attention and they're never satisfied when they get it. Sounds like the opposite of a sub to me.

I believe in this case high maintenance means requiring lots of love and patience as well as understanding. Yes, I can be a huge pain in the ass and the brat from hell should I choose to but that is only a momentary thing. {Master won't tolerate it for long....~grins~} When we refer to high maintenance it isn't in a bad way.........this time!

~ponders starting a thread about how high maintenance some Dom types can be~

[Warbaby1943]

High maintenance? Don't know if I would call it that. Needing attention and reassuring to me doesn't necessarily mean high maintenance. I would never enter AG in any contest but she certainly is not a doormat and I would not want her to be. She has at times and still does require a lot of reassuring but I wouldn't call that high maintenance but as Oz said, maybe it is just semantics.

[Hime]

I'm definitely high-maintenance in the sense of needing a lot of attention and reassurance. I think it's important for anyone in a BDSM relationship to be able to speak up when he/she needs to be reassured or comforted, because what is obviously joking or playful to one person could touch on a sore spot for someone else, and we don't know until someone tells us where those lines are. This is especially important in my relationship because we both have more baggage than a 747. :) Both of us would prefer being told "hey, quit saying that, it's upsetting me" or "um, you don't *really* think I'm a slut, do you?" to being told "I think I need to go back to therapy." Know what I mean?

[Rhabbi]

High-maintenance = love and attention.

I guess it is a bit late to quibble about the definition here, but this thread is sorta my attempt to lavish some love, attention, and reassurance on my subs. They need it at times, and at times they feel they are a bit too much trouble. I want them to know that I consider them to be worth the trouble. After all, if they were not, I could be a bad Dom and simply go find one of those doormats.

[wingsofanangel]

I am high maintenance for sure!

I am an attention whore... and I whine and pout and throw temper tantrums... I love to be cuddled and loved.. and I act out for attention.. yes.. I am a brat too..

But thats me... and I'm loveable and mostly a good girl... and My ex online Doms seemed perfectly happy in pleasing me and vice versa...

Ocean.. do you agree? I'm fairly clingy, aye?

[sassycat4him]

i'm ready for the challenge to prove

[Warbaby1943]

I am high maintenance for sure!

I am an attention whore... and I whine and pout and throw temper tantrums... I love to be cuddled and loved.. and I act out for attention.. yes.. I am a brat too..

But thats me... and I'm loveable and mostly a good girl... and My ex online Doms seemed perfectly happy in pleasing me and vice versa...

Ocean.. do you agree? I'm fairly clingy, aye?What was your name again? I think I vaguely remember someone with the same name as you use only she used to post an occasional picture of herself.

[wingsofanangel]

-giggles-

Same person... different day.

[princess_of_pain]

I bet you are the loved combo pack ;)

LOL Why thank you Logic1. You sure know how to make a girl feel special! :rose:

[Rhabbi]

I am high maintenance for sure!

I am an attention whore... and I whine and pout and throw temper tantrums... I love to be cuddled and loved.. and I act out for attention.. yes.. I am a brat too..

But thats me... and I'm loveable and mostly a good girl... and My ex online Doms seemed perfectly happy in pleasing me and vice versa...

Ocean.. do you agree? I'm fairly clingy, aye?

We have the beginnings of the criteria for our contest then.


Attention Whore
Whine
Pout
Temper Tantrums
Desires Cuddling
Desires loving
Acts out to get Attention
Bratty
Lovable
Good Girl/Boy
Worth it to their Dom/mes


Although this list is long, I am not sure it is comprehensive. Does anyone else have anything to add?

BTW wings, as one of those who had the pleasure of being your online Dom, even if for only a short time, it was definitely worth all of the effort.

[princess_of_pain]

Demanding? Although that may already be covered by "attention whore" and "tantrums."

[wingsofanangel]

We have the beginnings of the criteria for our contest then.


Attention Whore
Whine
Pout
Temper Tantrums
Desires Cuddling
Desires loving
Acts out to get Attention
Bratty
Lovable
Good Girl/Boy
Worth it to their Dom/mes


Although this list is long, I am not sure it is comprehensive. Does anyone else have anything to add?

BTW wings, as one of those who had the pleasure of being your online Dom, even if for only a short time, it was definitely worth all of the effort.


why thank you! -kissies- I take honor in being high maintenance... :)

[Warbaby1943]

why thank you! -kissies- I take honor in being high maintenance... :)
Do you come with a comprehensive warranty? If so, how long does it last and what all does it cover? Is it bumper to bumper, err I mean head to toe? Is there an extended warranty that is offered?

[wingsofanangel]

Uhmm..

-scratches head-

I need a dictionary.

Whats comprehensive mean in this context?

-feels dumb and runs off to pout!-

[Warbaby1943]

Uhmm..

-scratches head-

I need a dictionary.

Whats comprehensive mean in this context?

-feels dumb and runs off to pout!-
So large in scope or content as to include much. In other words covers any thing that could possibly go wrong with you. You should always look of that type of warranty with anything that could be high maintenance.

[wingsofanangel]

Ugh! Nothing will go wrong with me -smiles innocently-

You wanna buy?

-bats eyelashes-

[Warbaby1943]

Ugh! Nothing will go wrong with me -smiles innocently-

You wanna buy?

-bats eyelashes-
I will need that comprehensive warranty. LOL

[wingsofanangel]

Sold!

To the only bidder...

I must warn you.. I lose 70% of my value when I am driven from the lot...

I will slave for you 70% of the time and only be bratty and defiant 30% of the time... its exhausting.

[Slade]

I've found high maintenance subs to be some of the more enjoyable people to train and teach. I remember in the case of one I had to all but program out her entire day, at times it added up but I did take a great amount of enjoyment in deciding things from what she wore to what she did, so did she. It was what she wanted and needed.

[Mishka]

High-maintenance = love and attention.

I guess it is a bit late to quibble about the definition here, but this thread is sorta my attempt to lavish some love, attention, and reassurance on my subs. They need it at times, and at times they feel they are a bit too much trouble. I want them to know that I consider them to be worth the trouble. After all, if they were not, I could be a bad Dom and simply go find one of those doormats.

Thank You, Sir.

You're worth the trouble, too, Master. i mean that in the most endearing way possible. :gag:

[Ozme52]

High-maintenance = love and attention.

I guess it is a bit late to quibble about the definition here, but this thread is sorta my attempt to lavish some love, attention, and reassurance on my subs. They need it at times, and at times they feel they are a bit too much trouble. I want them to know that I consider them to be worth the trouble. After all, if they were not, I could be a bad Dom and simply go find one of those doormats.

Den ya shudda called da t'read "The Joys of Lavishing Love and Attention" :rolleyes:

[pixie_dust]

Den ya shudda called da t'read "The Joys of Lavishing Love and Attention" :rolleyes:

Oz, I think perhaps you've spent too much time up north. *giggles* You're sounding like a "yooper".

[Warbaby1943]

Sold!

To the only bidder...

I must warn you.. I lose 70% of my value when I am driven from the lot...

I will slave for you 70% of the time and only be bratty and defiant 30% of the time... its exhausting.Maybe needs a muffler then. Hope that is covered by the warranty.

[kestrel]

We have the beginnings of the criteria for our contest then.

1. Attention Whore...nope, not me
2. Whine...yep, have been known to
3. Pout...been known to do this too
4. Temper Tantrums...I wouldn't call them tantrums.....just artistic expressions of my anger.....yeah, that's it
5. Desires Cuddling...most definitely!!
6. Desires loving...who doesn't?
7. Acts out to get Attention...Now would I do something like that?
8. Bratty...I would never dream of being a brat.
9. Lovable...why of course, and cute too.
10. Good Girl/Boy...I'm always a good girl, even when I'm bad.
11. Worth it to their Dom/mes...He says I am

[Warbaby1943]

We have the beginnings of the criteria for our contest then.

1. Attention Whore...nope, not me
2. Whine...yep, have been known to
3. Pout...been known to do this too
4. Temper Tantrums...I wouldn't call them tantrums.....just artistic expressions of my anger.....yeah, that's it
5. Desires Cuddling...most definitely!!
6. Desires loving...who doesn't?
7. Acts out to get Attention...Now would I do something like that?
8. Bratty...I would never dream of being a brat.
9. Lovable...why of course, and cute too.
10. Good Girl/Boy...I'm always a good girl, even when I'm bad.
11. Worth it to their Dom/mes...He says I am9 out of 10 on the surface appears very good, at least to the untrained eye.

[Rhabbi]

Den ya shudda called da t'read "The Joys of Lavishing Love and Attention" :rolleyes:

Two points.
It is my thread.
I thought this sounded better.

Plus, it got your attention.

[Rhabbi]

9 out of 10 on the surface appears very good, at least to the untrained eye.

She is subtle in her answers WB, trust me that she nailed all 10.

[Warbaby1943]

She is subtle in her answers WB, trust me that she nailed all 10.LOL I believe you because you should know.

[kestrel]

~adds subtle to me list then grins all cute like at Warbaby and Rhabbi~

[Ozme52]

Oz, I think perhaps you've spent too much time up north. *giggles* You're sounding like a "yooper".


:hubba: :hubba:

[Ozme52]

Two points.
It is my thread.
I thought this sounded better.

Plus, it got your attention.

Then you gotta define your terms or expect dissent.

[Rhabbi]

Then you gotta define your terms or expect dissent.

Dissent away, it keeps the thread up.

[thrall]

One of my favorite movie is...When Harry Met Sally....there is a quote in that movie that I have always loved..........



Harry Burns: There are two kinds of women: high maintenance and low maintenance.
Sally Albright: Which one am I?
Harry Burns: You're the worst kind. You're high maintenance but you think you're low maintenance.


ROTFLMAO............So I guess this makes me the worst kind.......*wink*

[Rhabbi]

One of my favorite movie is...When Harry Met Sally....there is a quote in that movie that I have always loved..........



Harry Burns: There are two kinds of women: high maintenance and low maintenance.
Sally Albright: Which one am I?
Harry Burns: You're the worst kind. You're high maintenance but you think you're low maintenance.


ROTFLMAO............So I guess this makes me the worst kind.......*wink*

Definately.

[Ozme52]

It seems counter productive to encourage subs to think of themselves as high-maintenance.

But then... you insist on defining it to suit your own needs. And will probably continue to do so until you meet a high maintenance chicklet who thinks that's what you want.

'Nuff said.

[thrall]

It seems counter productive to encourage subs to think of themselves as high-maintenance.


...................Exactly!.............lol


I don't think of myself as high-maintenance......... and an a normal basis I'm not. And I certainly don't ever want to be considered high-maintenance.

Good Doms however, encourage us to feel our emotions and show them, which in turn makes, ...or at least makes me

.........somewhat........ sad to say......high-maintenance.......LOL

A good Dom wants to know if you are happy or sad. A good Dom wants to know exactly how you are feeling, good or bad. A good Dom wants to know how your day was, and how it is going at the moment. A good Dom wants to know the what is going on inside your head.......

Sometimes the answers are not always the warm fuzzy things in life...........

When I'm crying and sad, I need comfort and love.
When I'm being crazy and unreasonable, I need talking back from the edge.

That is what I consider to be high-maintenance, and not something that I enjoy at all. But they are parts of me. They are the parts that a good Dom should want to see.........and feel

.........which unfortunately sometimes makes me........well you know...........LOL

[Aussiegirl1]

Good Doms however, encourage us to feel our emotions and show them.

A good Dom wants to know if you are happy or sad. A good Dom wants to know exactly how you are feeling, good or bad. A good Dom wants to know how your day was, and how it is going at the moment. A good Dom wants to know the what is going on inside your head.......



I agree. In most situations I am what I consider to be low maintence, but when it comes to D/s and baring my emotions.......... things are different.

I have been taught to accept that all feelings are good, so long as I take the time to explore them. As someone who was very good at burying my feelings, this has been a life changing thought for me.

So if being emotional makes me high maintanence, then that is what I am. I am lucky I have WB to support me in every way I need. :)

As to the name of the thread, I don't care what it is called, it is the content that is important to me.

[Warbaby1943]

I agree. In most situations I am what I consider to be low maintence, but when it comes to D/s and baring my emotions.......... things are different.

I have been taught to accept that all feelings are good, so long as I take the time to explore them. As someone who was very good at burying my feelings, this has been a life changing thought for me.

So if being emotional makes me high maintanence, then that is what I am. I am lucky I have WB to support me in every way I need. :)

As to the name of the thread, I don't care what it is called, it is the content that is important to me.So you know there is no way I consider you high maintenance at all.

[Aussiegirl1]

So you know there is no way I consider you high maintenance at all.


:bigkiss: Thank you Master

[Rhabbi]

It seems counter productive to encourage subs to think of themselves as high-maintenance.

But then... you insist on defining it to suit your own needs. And will probably continue to do so until you meet a high maintenance chicklet who thinks that's what you want.

'Nuff said.

I believe the term you are looking for is tongue in cheek. I am willing to stick by my definition here. Also, I would like to point out that I am not encouraging subs to be high-maintenance, I am simply pointing out the fact that they are.

Since you seem to prefer the type of sub who does not get emotionally involved, or who allows a Dom to treat her any way he likes, you are free to find that type. As I said before, I prefer a bit of a challenge.

[wingsofanangel]

Sooo this is getting a lil heavy..

how about we go back to focusing on me :)

[Ozme52]

I believe the term you are looking for is tongue in cheek. I am willing to stick by my definition here. Also, I would like to point out that I am not encouraging subs to be high-maintenance, I am simply pointing out the fact that they are.

Me looking for a term? My vocabulary is quite fine thank you very much.

Are you now claiming you've said this as tongue in cheek? Or just confused about my comment?





Since you seem to prefer the type of sub who does not get emotionally involved, or who allows a Dom to treat her any way he likes, you are free to find that type. As I said before, I prefer a bit of a challenge.


You obviously know nothing about me. Tell you what. I'll refrain from making further comments on your opinions as I seem to make you uncomfortable.

[Warbaby1943]

Sooo this is getting a lil heavy..

how about we go back to focusing on me :)And what should that focus be?

[Hime]

Oz --

I can see where you're coming from. It actually reminds me of something my grandmother used to say -- that you shouldn't tell children that they're cute, because then they'll learn how to use it to their advantage. :) If a Dom took too much care to reassure his/her submissive that it's ok to be high maintenance and that it's good to be a challenge, that could easily turn into a frustrating situation where it was impossible to maintain discipline.

However, I have seen plenty of women in vanilla relationships forcing themselves to put up with neglect and downright bad behavior from their SOs because they "don't want to be high-maintenance." A lot of women seem to want to be "low-maintenance" so much (because they think it's the only way to be attractive to men) that they ignore their own warning signs and limits. In a vanilla relationship, that can lead to a lot of pain, but in a BDSM relationship it could be even more serious. I don't want to see women coming into this community thinking that it's not ok for them to ask for reassurance, aftercare, or even respect for what they will and won't do, you know? You can say that a good Dom will know when to provide care and attention, but honestly, even the best Dom will sometimes have a moment of distraction or self-absorption* and not notice that his sub is struggling in a way that isn't positive or healthy.

So it seems to me that whether you glorify high- or low-maintenance, the terminology still presents a lot of problems. My opinion, which may or may not be welcome, is that that's because it's an essentially sexist idea -- that women are like cars, which provide certain benefits in return for a level of "maintenance" that is ideally kept as low as possible. In other words, the sex (and presumably cooking, child-raising, etc) are the "ride" and the time you spend talking, cuddling, and bonding are like, say, changing the oil. Having to maintain a relationship is the price you have to pay for regular pussy. Considering the value that people in this lifestyle (and on this forum!) put on their relationships, it's not surprising that using this kind of terminology, even jokingly, would lead to conflict.

[seriouslynosn]

I consider myself to be high maintenance. Not because I have to have my own way or I need things or I primp but because I tend to be a little too self centered. And not in a egotistical sense (boyfriend would laugh if he read this), but in the sense that I worry constantly about my actions. This might seem self-conscious, but that's just because I can't seem to explain what the hell I'm trying to say...*takes deep breath*

I try to control everything. EVERYTHING. From the cleanliness of the house to the emotional state of my man. I'm constantly needing him to take that control away from me. I guess that's what I mean.

[Rhabbi]

Oz --

I can see where you're coming from. It actually reminds me of something my grandmother used to say -- that you shouldn't tell children that they're cute, because then they'll learn how to use it to their advantage. :) If a Dom took too much care to reassure his/her submissive that it's ok to be high maintenance and that it's good to be a challenge, that could easily turn into a frustrating situation where it was impossible to maintain discipline.

I would see that as a definite problem, but a balance between the need to reassure and discipline should be maintained. And the type of sub that actually attracts me tends to look on discipline as part of the maintenance routine.


However, I have seen plenty of women in vanilla relationships forcing themselves to put up with neglect and downright bad behavior from their SOs because they "don't want to be high-maintenance." A lot of women seem to want to be "low-maintenance" so much (because they think it's the only way to be attractive to men) that they ignore their own warning signs and limits. In a vanilla relationship, that can lead to a lot of pain, but in a BDSM relationship it could be even more serious. I don't want to see women coming into this community thinking that it's not ok for them to ask for reassurance, aftercare, or even respect for what they will and won't do, you know? You can say that a good Dom will know when to provide care and attention, but honestly, even the best Dom will sometimes have a moment of distraction or self-absorption* and not notice that his sub is struggling in a way that isn't positive or healthy.

So it seems to me that whether you glorify high- or low-maintenance, the terminology still presents a lot of problems. My opinion, which may or may not be welcome, is that that's because it's an essentially sexist idea -- that women are like cars, which provide certain benefits in return for a level of "maintenance" that is ideally kept as low as possible. In other words, the sex (and presumably cooking, child-raising, etc) are the "ride" and the time you spend talking, cuddling, and bonding are like, say, changing the oil. Having to maintain a relationship is the price you have to pay for regular pussy. Considering the value that people in this lifestyle (and on this forum!) put on their relationships, it's not surprising that using this kind of terminology, even jokingly, would lead to conflict.

Terminology and semantics often leads to misunderstandings. This is something I fully understand, which is why I try to look at everything someone is saying before judging what they mean. Why quibble over semantics if the important thing is the idea?


I consider myself to be high maintenance. Not because I have to have my own way or I need things or I primp but because I tend to be a little too self centered. And not in a egotistical sense (boyfriend would laugh if he read this), but in the sense that I worry constantly about my actions. This might seem self-conscious, but that's just because I can't seem to explain what the hell I'm trying to say...*takes deep breath*

I try to control everything. EVERYTHING. From the cleanliness of the house to the emotional state of my man. I'm constantly needing him to take that control away from me. I guess that's what I mean.

I think this is a good example of high-maintenance in a sub. No way would I encourage this behavior, but simply punishing you every time you slipped into wanting control would be counterproductive in the long run. It is better, IMO, to reassure and cajole the appropriate response, with an appropriate mix of discipline. I find that talking about these things and explaining how disappointed I am that you continue to not trust me to manage them is very effective. This will make your eventual submission more complete and meaningful.

[Uncle_Ed]

Interesting thread. I have been thinking about this question of "High maintenance" subs quite a bit. I don't believe that I am as qualified as some here to make a definition as I seem to find most subs; Doms; men; women and children *high maintenance"-that is, for me, I have to work bloody hard to cherish those who mean something to me. I regularly fail, like today, but it doesn't prevent me from trying.

I suppose it is because I am sensitive to people's feelings and have an inbuilt desire to care. Some folk clearly like more attention than others, but I've learned that the quiet, undemonstrative ones crave that attention too. They are probably the ones who seldom get it-but who need it the most.

Of course, I agree that some people just wallow in the constant fawning of others. They are the shallow ones as are those who cater for them. I won't class them as requiring my maintenance at all-I just ignore them.

Can I add that I am a fluffy pink high-maintenace Dom?

Thought not...

[Rhabbi]

Interesting thread. I have been thinking about this question of "High maintenance" subs quite a bit. I don't believe that I am as qualified as some here to make a definition as I seem to find most subs; Doms; men; women and children *high maintenance"-that is, for me, I have to work bloody hard to cherish those who mean something to me. I regularly fail, like today, but it doesn't prevent me from trying.

I suppose it is because I am sensitive to people's feelings and have an inbuilt desire to care. Some folk clearly like more attention than others, but I've learned that the quiet, undemonstrative ones crave that attention too. They are probably the ones who seldom get it-but who need it the most.

Of course, I agree that some people just wallow in the constant fawning of others. They are the shallow ones as are those who cater for them. I won't class them as requiring my maintenance at all-I just ignore them.

Can I add that I am a fluffy pink high-maintenace Dom?

Thought not...

Excellent point Ed, thank you for the input. the whiny, pouty, needy people are not who this thread is about, it is about the people we care about who we want in our lives.

And, since my subs assure me that I am a fluffy pink high-maintenance Dom, welcome here as well.

[Logic1]

Interesting thread. I have been thinking about this question of "High maintenance" subs quite a bit. I don't believe that I am as qualified as some here to make a definition as I seem to find most subs; Doms; men; women and children *high maintenance"-that is, for me, I have to work bloody hard to cherish those who mean something to me. I regularly fail, like today, but it doesn't prevent me from trying.

I suppose it is because I am sensitive to people's feelings and have an inbuilt desire to care. Some folk clearly like more attention than others, but I've learned that the quiet, undemonstrative ones crave that attention too. They are probably the ones who seldom get it-but who need it the most.

Of course, I agree that some people just wallow in the constant fawning of others. They are the shallow ones as are those who cater for them. I won't class them as requiring my maintenance at all-I just ignore them.

Can I add that I am a fluffy pink high-maintenace Dom?

Thought not...

hmm Ed
are you sure you arent talking about me? Because that sure sounds exactly like me.
pink fluffy high-maintenance Dom? lol yeah why not lol
As long as you stand up for who you are you can be both pink and fluffy in my book.

[thrall]

I think the difference here that everyone is trying to make is

Drama/spoiled........very,very,very bad

...to

"High maintenance"......semantics here....but.........good


LOL

[wingsofanangel]

Did no one get the memo that I wanted this thread to return to being about me?


-snickers and runs off-

[Rhabbi]

Did no one get the memo that I wanted this thread to return to being about me?


-snickers and runs off-

Watch it girl, this is my thread and it is about who I say it is.

[wingsofanangel]

-pouts and bends over-

sorry.. it is just my high maitenance needy ways.. -smirk- Forgive me , Sir?

[Hime]

Terminology and semantics often leads to misunderstandings. This is something I fully understand, which is why I try to look at everything someone is saying before judging what they mean. Why quibble over semantics if the important thing is the idea?


Because the words have sexist connotations that can't be ignored. I don't see anyone here talking about male submissives being high-maintenance, you know? :)

p.s. when I mentioned the title of this thread to my husband, he said "High-maintenance submissives? You mean, all of you?" :D

[Rhabbi]

Because the words have sexist connotations that can't be ignored. I don't see anyone here talking about male submissives being high-maintenance, you know? :)

I have to admit that I do not, and that may be my fault. I spoke from personal experience in starting this thread. I have never had a male sub myself, but I would assume that the same type of dynamic applies in the adjustment phase. this, by my definition, would make them high-maintenance.

Also, as no less than three Doms, including myself, have weighed in and called themselves high-maintenance, I think that we are covering the sexist angle.


p.s. when I mentioned the title of this thread to my husband, he said "High-maintenance submissives? You mean, all of you?" :D

Exactly the point I wanted to make with this thread.:bdsmsmile

[Dragon's muse]

i am happy to say that according to the defined terms of this thread, i am definitely not high maintenance.

Attention Whore -- maybe once upon a time, but i have outgrown that phase
Whine -- nope
Pout -- nope
Temper Tantrums -- nope
Desires Cuddling -- yes
Desires loving -- yes
Acts out to get Attention -- nope
Bratty -- nope
Lovable -- yes
Good Girl/Boy -- yes
Worth it to their Dom/mes -- Coming up on 20 years together, so i would say so.

[Rhabbi]

i am happy to say that according to the defined terms of this thread, i am definitely not high maintenance.

Attention Whore -- maybe once upon a time, but i have outgrown that phase
Whine -- nope
Pout -- nope
Temper Tantrums -- nope
Desires Cuddling -- yes
Desires loving -- yes
Acts out to get Attention -- nope
Bratty -- nope
Lovable -- yes
Good Girl/Boy -- yes
Worth it to their Dom/mes -- Coming up on 20 years together, so i would say so.

One of the things about a high-maintenance relationship is that it eventually grows into a strong and lasting one if both parties are dedicated to making that happen.

[Whippett]

I just found this thread in reading through threads before I joined the Library.

There's another aspect to the "high maintenance" issue, as I see it. And to address the sexist side first - I have never had a male sub - but consider myself a fluffy pink high maintenance Dom as well - lol.

We all talk about the gift of submission - and I imagine we all mean slightly different things when we say that. For me, submission isn't complete unless a girl can give me her spirit as well. I start with her head - taking that brings the body...with the body comes the heart, not necessarily immediately, but if the relationship is to last, her heart must come as well...and finally - when she has learned to trust me fully - when she truly knows at an almost instinctive level that she can be totally vulnerable with me and that I will hold her safe and warm and loved - the final depth of her submission is the submission of her spirit - her soul.

The legs aren't what get spread widest when a girl submits fully - her very being is. This makes her incredibly vulnerable to me - and - where she may need reassurance that her gift is valued and respected because of that vulnerability - I find that there is an equal need in me to reassure her that I do value her submission very highly. Caring takes effort - her need to be reassured that I care requires effort. The effort in either case is trivial in one sense, since anything worth having - truly worth having - is worth working for.

My girl's submission to me is truly worth having, and the more highly I value her submission, the more effort and attention I will want/need to show her...but then...caring for her is something I enjoy, so it isn't work at all. And just as she gives me her heart - she always receives mine - I can't stay aloof when I care - and love makes the relationship so much more profound, at least it's that way for me.

[sisterhoney61 {RW}]

If W/we are going by the above criteria of being an attention whore, bratty, acting out, etc., then, no, I am not a high maitenance sub. However, I do rely emotionally on my Master and lean on Him quite a bit. I'm doing that especially since I have (so far) four chronic illnesses that can prevent me from completely serving Him as W/we would both like me to do. So I suppose in that sense I am high maitenance because so much of His attention is now focused on me to make sure that I am doing ok.

[gemmy]

I just found this thread in reading through threads before I joined the Library.

There's another aspect to the "high maintenance" issue, as I see it. And to address the sexist side first - I have never had a male sub - but consider myself a fluffy pink high maintenance Dom as well - lol.

We all talk about the gift of submission - and I imagine we all mean slightly different things when we say that. For me, submission isn't complete unless a girl can give me her spirit as well. I start with her head - taking that brings the body...with the body comes the heart, not necessarily immediately, but if the relationship is to last, her heart must come as well...and finally - when she has learned to trust me fully - when she truly knows at an almost instinctive level that she can be totally vulnerable with me and that I will hold her safe and warm and loved - the final depth of her submission is the submission of her spirit - her soul.

The legs aren't what get spread widest when a girl submits fully - her very being is. This makes her incredibly vulnerable to me - and - where she may need reassurance that her gift is valued and respected because of that vulnerability - I find that there is an equal need in me to reassure her that I do value her submission very highly. Caring takes effort - her need to be reassured that I care requires effort. The effort in either case is trivial in one sense, since anything worth having - truly worth having - is worth working for.

My girl's submission to me is truly worth having, and the more highly I value her submission, the more effort and attention I will want/need to show her...but then...caring for her is something I enjoy, so it isn't work at all. And just as she gives me her heart - she always receives mine - I can't stay aloof when I care - and love makes the relationship so much more profound, at least it's that way for me.

can I please have this on a plaque to the entrance of every BDSM site hehe - very, very well stated Whippet - Thank you!

[icey]

i have a lot of respect for Whippet and always take notice of anything he has to say,so thankyou from me too Whippet :)
maybe i should take more notice and not be quite so high maintinance myself lol



The legs aren't what get spread widest when a girl submits fully - her very being is. This makes her incredibly vulnerable to me - and - where she may need reassurance that her gift is valued and respected because of that vulnerability - I find that there is an equal need in me to reassure her that I do value her submission very highly. Caring takes effort - her need to be reassured that I care requires effort. The effort in either case is trivial in one sense, since anything worth having - truly worth having - is worth working for.

i dont think the effort is trivial in any sense, it takes a lot of patience, time and understanding, its what makes a good Dom (that should read person really) one who actually knows themself. they stand out from all the rest and thats exactly what the 'high maintenence sub' is asking for.

[Isabella King]

The Whippett is very wise :cool:

[Whippett]

i have a lot of respect for Whippet and always take notice of anything he has to say,so thankyou from me too Whippet :)
maybe i should take more notice and not be quite so high maintinance myself lol



i dont think the effort is trivial in any sense, it takes a lot of patience, time and understanding, its what makes a good Dom (that should read person really) one who actually knows themself. they stand out from all the rest and thats exactly what the 'high maintenence sub' is asking for.

icey - I don't have personal experience with you - but we've known each other on-line for a few years - and I really would never consider you a "high maintenance" sub in a bad way - you have needs - as all people do. And I think Hawk would agree whole-heartedly.

I used the word trivial in a very particular sense, icey. Some effort takes real grab yourself by the bootstraps and haul yourself to do the job work - things like going to a job you don't like, or a social gathering you'd really prefer not to go to - but family obligations intrude. That's work - real grunt work.

Other things may require as much or more effort - or patience or time or understanding - but with those things, you go at it with a light heart because expending effort on those things is a joy and a fulfillment.

And that's why I see the effort as trivial - because it is something that I truly enjoy. There is no effort in making myself pay attention to my girl - none at all. She's my slave - and she's the centre of my universe as well. And my need and desire that she be truly happy make any effort for her sake a pleasure, not a chore, regardless of whether it's the firm whipping she needs so much, or being held and cuddled and allowed to cry her heart out over some past hurt, or showing her in word and action that no matter how ugly and unwomanly she might feel herself to be - she is a truly beautiful and dearly loved woman in every sense.

There was a comment above - I can't remember who made it - and I'm not going to look - it was likening maintenance of a submissive to the routine of maintaining the running order of a car.

That aspect is true (as analogies go) - but I thought about that analogy overnight - and I think it goes further. A good friend of mine had a rare and classic car (a 1929 Dusenberg if you must know) in pristine condition. He spent hours tinkering with that car - keeping it in immaculate shape, keeping it tuned and in perfect running order. He'd think nothing of putting his business on hold for a time to do that either. That car was his passion and it consumed him - in a good way.

In many respects, providing maintenance to my submissive - to my slave - feels very much like how my friend felt about that car...she is my consuming passion.

[thrall]

i just love you Whip!!!!


Yes, i guess i am still high maintenance then........and getting worse!!!!!!...........*wink*..what the heck is up with that........lmao



And.... sorry i couldn't resist this one......guess you can call it "junk in the high maintenance trunk"

[Whippett]

lol - no - you're not bad high maintenance either thrall - but the junk in the trunk sure is - lol