victims of abuse support for submissives

[denuseri]

well here goes

i have noticed that there are a lot of victums of abusive relationships(some even on this site), sexual and otherwise, and that there are a wide variety of support groups out there for all the different types of victums ,,,,except one group, ours

where is the help for submissives that have been abused?

its right here, we are the ones that should support our own

most all suport groups outside the comunity dont address the needs of our own people, in other words they are vanilla, and lack the understanding that we as submissives and doms/ dommes share in our way of life

i am not advocating the exclussion of outside scorces for support(in fact i strongly reccomend seeking medical and spiritual support) i am, simply saying that we have a unique perspective to help abuse victums within our range of expertise

that is the reason i am posting this thread,

part of my own therapy was seeking out this site so i could talk with people within my peer group that would accept my way of life

yes i was a victum of sexual abuse in a bdsm context,
it has taken many years of hardship to reach the place i am at today, to be able to speak and share about it with others and i am very thankful to the people at this site for all the catharic help they have given me

yet i feel that as a recovering abuse victum its not enough that i help out the occasional girl or two i come accross in chat or the forums thats on the cusp of abuse or has been abused,(my owner supported me, who supports those subs without owners)

thats why i have posted this thread,, anyone that wishes should reply here with thier story of recovery, questions,or conserns,advice etc: or pm me if you wish for privacy i will make every effort possible to help you

perhaps if we all work together in this we may be able to really help a lot of submissives that are having trouble recovering from thier tramatic experiences


:my ordeal:lasted for three months, i suffered through pure hell at the hands of a pedator i wouldnt call a dom and his accomplices that i went to meet from an online chat,(not this one), without taking the proper precautions:
it took six months of corrective surgey to physically repair what was done to me, including dental work etc, i shall never have children because of them, it took allmost six more months before i could even step outside my house on my own, let alone be touched or have sex etc, i am very lucky to be alive, with my owners help ( he has litterally saved me) doctors , therapists, support groups, and this site, including many individuals here have helped me a great deal

i am not telling you this seeking sympathy, i am doing this for the benifit of others that have been abused, if they read it they may garner some hope of recovery for themselvesso i know from personal experiences what kind of things some of you that have been abused are going through

i once heard a dom refer to us as "the broken ones" well we dont have to remain broken,, we can heal, we can be fixed, we can recover, grow, and thrive (even enjoy bdsm again) with the right help,and the best help we may find just might be from each other


hugs and kisess for all conserned,

[gemmy]

*hugs* hunnie

You're right, none have to remain broken if they choose help and you're a doll for wanting to help xoxo

[ashtonDs]

While my abuse was long ago and not related to BDSM, I have to agree with gem. No one has to remain broken.

Talking with others on this forum helped me a lot. Even though I went to a therapist, it's not the same as talking to people who went through it.

When a therapist says, "you have to be a survivor," that's one thing, hearing it from someone who did survive is more likely to bring up the, "hey, if they can do it, I can too!"

ash

[neitsyst2]

No one is broken...there is always a light. So glad for denu and her brave post. Thank you for speaking out on this issue.

[denuseri]

wow that was like light speed quickness,, thanku all for the support,, i only hope we can keep this thread open to help those in need

[crazy_grrluk]

plenty out there who has been abused in some form or another.. is just getting them to speak up and made to feel and understand that they are not alone in this matter.

we all ahve ways to deal with it... mine occassionaly comes back to haunt me and Master has taken a lot of time and patience to get me to where I am now.

my stories are around these forums somewhere both D/s and nilla.

cg

[butterflySlave4u]

When a therapist says, "you have to be a survivor," that's one thing, hearing it from someone who did survive is more likely to bring up the, "hey, if they can do it, I can too!"

ash


the other thing to remember is that we DID survive, ashton...and you/we owe those that went before us and DIDN'T survive, to be strong, and to carry on, and help those others that are going through it now...


thank you, denuseri for beginning this thread....your strength is amazing to those of us that are just getting around to living again....


Karen

[sisterhoney61 {RW}]

Yes, we CAN be strong and move on with our lives. We can learn to not allow our abusers to continue to have power over us. My own abuse was over a span of 10 years and ended 10 years ago. I'm also lucky to be alive, after a suicide attempt and a murder attempt upon me. And this was in a vanilla relationship. I think that if I had insisted upon making it a BDSM relationship (which I did consider for awhile) then I would be six feet under right now.

I probably should have gone to therapy for my abuse, but I chose to do what I have always done in a crisis. I chose to withdraw and focus on myself and my own survival and not to involve anyone else (my family would not have been there for me), though a couple of friends knew what I was going through. It was my Master who has helped me the most and has helped to heal me the most. I do still suffer from PTSD, nightmares, panic attacks, etc. But this time I am no longer alone and that really helps. And it also helps that this board is here with all the wonderful people whom I have been chatting with and posting with the past couple of months. Sometimes we all need someone to talk to, to listen to us, to help us find our way back to the light.

[newslave]

Thank you so much for this, den, gem, ashton, neit, Karen, cg, sister....

It is a constant shock to me the things that we as human beings, as women (though I would never leave our brothers in survival out of this) have to struggle through at the hands of others. It is beyond comforting to know that there are others who can share our experiences and that can understand the symptom of our terror. Our loving partners, even as they serve to help us heal, can never truly understand like another survivor can.

I take wonderful comfort in this thread as I did in confiding in my peers, in art, and in other things and, while I still hate and condemn the reasons for our connection, I see it as a huge blessing from something above that everyone feels comfortable sharing here...giving strength to everyone who has yet to find their voice.

Love and hugs to all...here and elsewhere

[bellelapine]

I think, in all honesty, that it helps a great deal to know there are other people who have survived. Many have lived through abuse in such ways that I could not begin to concieve of it. I believe one of the things that helped me was the fact my own mother had been raped by someone she trusted and survived. She was also mentally and emotionally abused by her family before this. This happened during a time and a location in the country in which if a woman was raped not only did she deserve it but she was a whore for allowing it to proceed.
My mom made it clear to me, when I was very young ( I developed way too early for my own good I think) that no man/woman has a right to do that to you. It is your right to say no (I made my choice not based on what my mom taught me but on the fear that I felt at the time). I think the fact I saw my mom survive and overcome it (she still has nightmares and some other issues) but she survived and LIVED. So often those who survive do just that until someone or something triggers in them that they have to do more than just be a survivor.
I realized myself that letting someone have that power over you (even after the initial incident) and let them dominant your life long after the abuse has occured is letting them win. Life is living, not just surviving. I'm glad to see so many of those of us who have been abused willing to step up to live to show their abusers that they are still alive and a little beaten but stronger for the ordeal.

[Euryleia]

Excellent idea, denuseri. I applaud your bravery in coming forward. You are so right that is hard to heal alone. It's great to find support that won't have the whiff of judgement that a lot of therapists and crisis workers have about BDSM.

I'm willing to offer what helped me for any who need it. Recovery is a long process that takes time but it does happen. It helps when you have people you can talk to about the event. Those who have survived can be a wonderful resource for those still making the healing journey.

[luv2havfun]

Wow! I think you are truly a wonderful, strong person for wanting to help others after going through what you went through. You have amazing strength...thank you

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by bellelapine:
I would never leave our brothers in survival out of this

bellelapine, I really do appreciate that. Often we suffer continued abuse at the hands of those who follow the abuser. Like what your mother went through when told she deserved what she got. Well, men are no different.

My abuse (verbal and emotional) happened to me in school by a teacher in front of a room full of classmates, over the course of a whole school year. For many more years I was haunted by what happened and lived in dread that any new friends I met would find out. Men are supposed to "be tough" and "get over" stuff like that. We learn not to say anything about it to anyone. It was years before I told my wife.

And then a former friend of mine, who upon returning from college on winter break, told me in no uncertain terms that only women are abused, men are abusers. Therefore, if anything happened to me I deserved it because the teacher being female could not be an abuser.

Although sex enters into this many times, it's really about power. The abuser chooses someone weaker than they are as their victim. It's safer for them that way.


Originally posted by butterflySlave4u:
the other thing to remember is that we DID survive, ashton...and you/we owe those that went before us and DIDN'T survive, to be strong, and to carry on, and help those others that are going through it now...

You're absolutely right. But sometimes when you're trying to deal with it and it seems to be getting the upper hand, hearing from someone who went through it and survived has more impact than hearing it from someone sitting in an office safe and insulated from all your torment.

Between this thread and the one on abuse shaping your BDSM I mentally feel like I've lost weight. (it's weird but I don't know how else to describe it) I feel lighter. Being able to share this and hear from folks who understand as well as from folks who draw a bit of strength from it is incredible.

I never felt like it was something I survived even conquered, until now. :)

Great thread denuseri, thanks.

----------------------------------
Oh, almost forgot...
Sometimes we do need professional intervention. Try the National Coalition for Sexual Freedom. http://www.ncsfreedom.org/kap

They can refer you to "bdsm friendly" psychological, medical and legal professionals near you.

[Mr.FixIt]

Wow, you are awesome, denu! You and I have only met recently. I have read your posts, and have chatted with you online. I have held you in high regard since I have met you becuase of the boldness and strength that you speak with, and I never would have supposed that you had been a victim of such attrocities. You seem to have done well in your recovery, and I applaud you for your courage. stripey had also been through a long period of abuse in her life before I met her, and I understand, somewhat, what you've been through. But I would be out of line describing her personal matters here and I'll let her post on her own if she so chooses. I feel that I have been a supporting factor in her recovery from her history though, and want to add that I intend to support your efforts here in any way possible.

Thank you, sincerely, for your bravery, boldness, and kind heart.

[babypup]

thank you denuseri for starting this thread.

i feel like i should share my experiences.

like ashton, my abuse was also verbal and emotional but it was from the hands of my father.
he's a perfectionist who would rather try to "perfect" someone else's life than his own.

the abuse led me to be anorexic from the age of 9 to 15, and after four suicide attempts i was forced into recovery.

i was also raped quite recently, and i was told, by afew people who are close to me, that i should "consider myself lucky because i deserved more than what i got."

i would love to say that i have taken something from those experiences, and that they have made me stronger....
but i honestly cant, its something that i struggle with everyday and a good amount of time i dont think things will ever get better.

Master has been a huge support system for me, and i honestly dont think i would be here talking about this right now if it werent for Him.

[denuseri]

here are some other web sites that may help some in thier time of need:

www.SunrisePasco.org

www.paltalk.com

www.WADT.org

www.WIIT.com

i and my owner would like to thank everyone for showing such strong support for this effort, you are all very brave people for coming forward, i know how tough it was for me , the first time i did it right in chat, i litteraly broke down in the lobby, the very special people in the room that nite really really helped me alot, and special hugs for my fellow subbie sista that helped give me the strength and inspiration to begin the thread you are all very great people

hugs and kissess, i hope that the many subs out there will view our stories and gain some small spark of hope in the very least, especially when they are feeling the burden of thier struggle to become whole once more

you dont have to do it alone, there are others like just like you, the twists and turns of the journey we all must make may be many and varied, fraught with difficulty and anguish but that is why those of us farther down the path should and will reach back to help our sisters and brothers find the way

remember each day is a victory

[good_girl]

Like many others, the abuse I endured...and survived...was verbal and emotional, very different but certainly not less damaging than physical.
My spirit was broken, my self esteem gone, I didn't know who I was, I felt worthless. I have come a very long way since then with the help of counselors, self esteem workshops and friends (some from here) I am at a point now where I know who I am, and for the first time in a very long time I like who I am. There is till work to be done but I am now on the right path, this site and the people here have definitely been part of the path I needed to find.
Thank you to those who have been there for me...you know who you are *smiles and hugs* I hope one day I will be of help to someone in need

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by babypup:
i would love to say that i have taken something from those experiences, and that they have made me stronger....
but i honestly cant, its something that i struggle with everyday and a good amount of time i dont think things will ever get better.

I must speak for myself when I say that I can't take anything positive away from my experiences either. The things that give you strength sometimes are little day to day things. Looking back, over time, you see that you are different, stronger.

What you are saying here is almost exactly what I said years ago. (I didn't have a Master ;)) It will come. Don't bottle up your feelings. Don't just dump indiscriminately on whoever is closest either. Find partners in healing. Your Master sounds like one. Maybe this thread is another. If you need to talk but don't want to publicly PM someone. I'm sure anyone here would be happy to help.

[ShaynaTiedDown]

den your amazing! -hugs you-

[newslave]

This thread has power....and I can think of nothing but that to say

[stripedangel]

i think this is a wonderful idea...denu, you are such a thoughtful gal!

i must say, though, that i've seen issues arise in forums because of what we kindly refer to as trollers. We should have a system in place, and i do believe it should be a private forum. There should be a way to insure that abusers don't have this info at their beck and call. These trollers use the information to get into the chats, etc and bring great pain to those who have posted their innermost thoughts, fears, etc. i've seen this happen, and it's very traumatic when you're not expecting it and someone uses the story that bled from your heart to berate you. Of course, such a bastard would not be tolerated, however, the damage is already done...

Another advantage to the privacy idea is that we can all feel comfortable in the knolwedge that they can say whatever they wish, whatever they feel comfy in sharing and still be supported.

i know that most on this site would never do such awful things to us, but i also know that there are those who would reslish the opportunity.

If we could find a way to do this sort of thing, i would be willing to volunteer as someone to help monitor it.

This is how they did it on another forum and it worked out well, though it would need to be adjusted for our site, our use, and our ways...

1. They had separate men's and women's private forums. Men who have been abused generally don't want to talk about their experiences publicly, and i have noticed that with the exception of ashton (thanks btw hun for sharing), there are no men doing so here...though i understand that this thread is still very new. Some Women may not feel comfy sharing in front of men and vise/versa too...
2. If someone wanted to be admitted, they had to PM the owner of the site, with their real name and phone number-the name and number was used one time, to call and be sure that the person who answered was of the gender which they claimed, and to advise on the ways of that forum. This was to insure that there was no chance of a troller man to get into the women's private forum, etc....
3. It was a rule- whatever you wish to say, no matter what, as long as you're not criticizing anyone in there...be supportive in all posts when replying to someone else's thread.
4. Most importantly, what was said in the privacy of that forum and who goes there is never, ever discussed outside that forum. Of course, this didn't apply if you told your own story...but you couldn't mention others' stories, etc.

Some people aren't ready to make their experiences public, so those folks would not feel comfortable sharing in the main forums.

Also, since we have rooms in chat, we could have meetings to handle immediate needs, the idea being similar to a support group meeting in R/L.

As i said above, i am willing (chomping at the bit) to volunteer in whatever capacity in which i may be of service, and would like to ask miss denu to volunteer as well (teehee put ya on the spot), if we can get this off the ground.


xxxx stripey

[butterflySlave4u]

i have posted a link to this thread at the H&HSC, and will post it at the Sanctuary....this word needs to get out....

[stripedangel]

Originally posted by babypup:
i would love to say that i have taken something from those experiences, and that they have made me stronger....
but i honestly cant, its something that i struggle with everyday and a good amount of time i dont think things will ever get better.

I must speak for myself when I say that I can't take anything positive away from my experiences either. The things that give you strength sometimes are little day to day things. Looking back, over time, you see that you are different, stronger.

What you are saying here is almost exactly what I said years ago. (I didn't have a Master ;)) It will come. Don't bottle up your feelings. Don't just dump indiscriminately on whoever is closet either. Find partners in healing. Your Master sounds like one. Maybe this thread is another. If you need to talk but don't want to publicly PM someone. I'm sure anyone here would be happy to help.


ashton, you can take positives away from your experiences. Please remember that you are an important part of this community. You came here on a journey that crossed through your abuse. You are who you are because of the life you have lead and if you had never suffered, you wouldn't be the person that you are now, and i happen to like you!

Horrific as our experiences are/were, there were lessons learned. That in itself can't be negative. We survive, then we help other survivors. Everything happens for a reason, i believe. You have your own unique experiences that will help others...that can't be negative either.

xxx stripey

[denuseri]

well i am certianly open to whatever ideas everyone has for this thing,, i think we should keep this thread open to the general public though,, and mabey put up links for more private venues to help those that are not comfortable talking openly,

i really belive that even people that havent experienced abuse can help here too

i know that exposing ourselves is difficult, it may indeed bring on some trolls, but they better have brass ones if they come trolling here on this forum ,,winks weg

we can also arrange a few meetings between us, in a private chat room at any time convienent for us,,

kinda like a conference call lol,

also, i am open for anyone that wants to pm me for help,, i fully understand some people will want (paticularlly this topic) kept private

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by stripedangel:
you can take positives away from your experiences

What I was trying to say is that I can't take positives away from my abuse experience. Now I can, and do, see positives in what happened after, and one of them is meeting all you good folks here, and sharing stories and support together.

You all can't (well some of you can, now that I think about you) imagine how much better I feel since coming to this forum. All this was bottled up for so long and I kept it hidden. It's the first time I feel like I have someting to say, something that's important and can help other people who suffered abuse.

And to anyone who can't bring themselves to speak up. Just follow the thread and see you are not alone. When you are ready to speak you won't be able to shut up. (It happens to me on this subject all the time now. I was just going to post an, "aw shucks, thanks," to stripedangel and I'm still typing away...lol) Anyway, when you are ready to speak, we will be here to listen.

stripedangel, (oops, I mean stripey) thanks. You are very special.

[butterflySlave4u]

and please remember, that the "Sanctuary" (not the H&HSC, but the Sanctuary, a members only group, PM lilangel (http://www.bdsmlibrary.com/forums/member.php?u=40485) or any moderator for info) IS, in fact, a private closed group....

[stripedangel]

Oh, butterfly, i wasn't aware of the sanctuary, guess i hadn't paid much attention, thanks for pointing it out! Well, then it looks like we're in business!

........thanks ashton for the complement, you're a sweety! i believe that helping others through their issues is very theraputic. We're all able to see the progress of each other and can take encouragement from it.

denu, i totally agree!! u so smart sista!

Huggles y'all!

[denuseri]

ok well do yu all think we should like have a private room meeting in chat or somthing to disscuss how to organize our efforts?

[sisterhoney61 {RW}]

I myself HAD to find positives from being abused or I would not have survived it. I could not roll over and play dead. That would be giving power over to my abuser. He'd already had too much power over me. I couldn't let him ruin the rest of my life. I wouldn't let him have anymore power over me. I got stronger from that experience. I was a survivor. I lived to tell the tale. That has to account for something. Yes, I still suffer from it, but I am no longer alone. Master has been there for me, so that when I have someone to lean on, He is there. And now I have this wonderful group of subs that understand where I've been, because they have also been in my shoes.

[stripedangel]

Friday Night June 13, y'all.

PM either denuseri or myself with a time that you can meet, if you would like to attend. The invitation is open, and the meeting will be in a separate room in the chats. The time we can all compromise on will be posted here.

We will discuss the details of having meetings in the chats on a regular basis.

This will serve as a sort of support group for all who wish to attend. This group chat could also be helpful for those who have relationships with survivors of abuse, BTW. You can participate or listen, whatever you feel comfy with, there is no pressure.

So be thinking about what you would like to see in such a group meeting, so that we can set it up to be of the best service to those who need it.

As i stated above---all are welcome. Hope to see you all there!
xxx stripey

[angelic.zest]

HuGs to you all!!! oh my den *hugs tight*

[denuseri]

from the number of responses so far it looks like we shall need two meetings on or about friday to accomadate the sites international demographics. eaither way as we get closer to the day/nite we shall update everyone with a time for the perspective meetings, just come into chat around then and we will do the rest,

thanks everyone for the support we can use all the help we can get, and its perfectly ok to lurk at the meeting , no one has to speak, but everyone shall feel the love

hugs and kissess,,

Girl Up!!! my sistas~!

[TomOfSweden]

I think this is more important for this community than any other community. As we all know, submissiveness has both a good and bad facet. And I love submissiveness.... so I want to protect all those souls.

When I originally started writing in this forum it was just that. To offer support to abused submissives. I forget who it was, or even if I said anything. But women being abused touches my heart so much more than could be called rational. So I can't really think straight.

Love you all.

[gemmy]

Hmmmm I posted here yesterday?? Weird :(

Anyway, my best wishes to your effort and success on the meeting - I'm sure many will be helped with your kindness :)

[stripedangel]

Hmmmm I posted here yesterday?? Weird :(

Anyway, my best wishes to your effort and success on the meeting - I'm sure many will be helped with your kindness :)
i saw it, i saw it!! i dunno, that is weird!! you have a witness, gem...

Thanks to everyone for your suppot in this new venture!

If need be, i can be available for another meeting at any time, if another day would be better for some, PM and let me know, right now it's all in the works so adjustments can be made.

xxxx

[denuseri]

ok i think i will be off work for that friday, so anyone have a special time or somthing just pm us and let us know (me or stripey) and thanku so much Stripey for helping organize this thing, i would be lost with out cha,,

hugs and kissess all,,
be strong, girl up! my sistas!

[stripedangel]

Yaaaaaaaaaaaaay!!

[icey]

i think its a lovely idea and will hopefully help many people but what exactly do you do? (i know dumb question sorry) is it only for subs who have been abused in d/s r/ships?
i wasnt in a r/ship i was age 5-14,then raped at 17 always seemed to be in the wong place at the right time lol then some other not so major stuff until i met Icehawk,
the stuff while i was a kid was what you'd call bdsm (light) i know that now looking back (wont go into detail) but its a bit complicated i cant really call it bdsm i didnt even know what that was lol and it certainly wasnt a r/ship.
so would i 'qualify' to help in anyway? where would i stand in this.
it doesnt hurt me and ive never let it and i dont think id need help for myself,but id like to help if i can.

babypup,i hope alls ok with the anorexia and that it's under control :) im ana too which im kind of struggling with atm so i know what you've been through,you've done really well ...give yourself some credit, you'e stronger than you realise! so well done you for being so brave *hugs*

[butterflySlave4u]

aww, icey, i'm thinking abuse is abuse....whether verbal, emotional or physical....IN the Life, or out...we're all bonded here, now...and i think for so many of us to be able to meet together this way is amazing....so gawd yes woman....join us!

[denuseri]

^definitly what she said boo

the only thing we dont want coming to the meeting would be a troll, and unless someone took exception to it i imagine even a dom or domme would also be acceptable, they can be a victum of abuse too even if only by proxy or as a sign of support for thier sub or all subs,

as for what do we do at the meet:
thats one thing the meeting is going to be all about, i know we can all discuss these things here in the forum, but this medium is far slower when it comes to organizing some kind of effort,which i hope a face to face chat can kinda help with( and i hope the gals who organized the H&H Subs Club can give us a big hand in that),
another thing> no trolls will be in the private chat room with us, the only people there that will know what we say to one another will be us. so its an even safer enviroment especially for people that are not ready to come out about thier abuse situations in an open forum like this one.
as well as a more personal meet, all that want to in the private chat room, where we can talk openly about ourselves , share what has worked for us in the past, find out what may work in future
in addition to which we can allways:
show our compasion for one another,
we can share and grow together,
we can lend our strength to our sisters and brothers

i have seen the subs at this site show amazing strength
especially when we are helping each other

peace out,, "girl up! my sistas!"

[sisterhoney61 {RW}]

aww, icey, i'm thinking abuse is abuse....whether verbal, emotional or physical....IN the Life, or out...we're all bonded here, now...and i think for so many of us to be able to meet together this way is amazing....so gawd yes woman....join us!

Definitely, butterfly! Any kind of abuse is abuse. It doesn't matter the form. I remember once I had Oprah on when I cooking dinner and this woman was on there talking about the abuse she had suffered from her husband. Then Oprah put her foot in her mouth when she made the comment that the woman had suffered "only" verbal abuse. I am assuming that Oprah doesn't think abuse is bad unless it is physical. The audience and other panel members really came down Oprah (as well they should have) for saying something like that. In fact, throughout the show, they kept making little jibes about it being "only verbal abuse."

It doesn't matter if the other person is throwing insults at you or throwing you against the wall. It is abuse, plain and simple.

[stripedangel]

Abuse is abuse, folks. your experiences were as bad on you as mine were on me. it all does the same to us, making it hard to trust and hard to love. Sometimes, it makes us just feel worthless. Abuse causes us to carry baggage around that others must deal with if they want to be a part of our lives...so the victim list may start with the abused, but it doesn't end there. We are all changed by it.

We definitely want to see you all there, no matter what abuse you've survived, or what the situatuion was....or what the situation is. No one will be judged, i would hope we all speak freely, and be honest. Cuss, cry, throw a frikkin fit, y'all, that's all a part of healing and helping.

If you're just curious....show up.
If you're a survivor or currently abused now...show up.
If you've been abused in the scene...show up.
If you're attached or attracted to a survivor......show up.
If you don't have anything to share...show up.

We're all here to support one another, that's the main idea. i believe that everything happens for a reason.... When we cannot find strenth in ourselves, we can find it in others, and borrow it...right? One day, hour, minute, second, or breath at a time. We all support one another in our lifestyle and the journeys that are included in it. This is another journey, and we should have a path and location for that support as well...as it applies to our community, and our families, friendships and relationships.

[Kuskovian]

This goes without saying; but, I just want all of you to know, I will allways stand with you, vigilant to the end.

Even before I saw first hand the kind of trauma the sick fucks in this world can cause, I was strongly biased against abusing another human being for any reason.

It filled my heart with rage beyond discription when I found Seri had been in a living hell.

I had allways blamed myself for loosing contact with her after my first wife and I were stationed away from her overseas. I should have found a way to bring her with us. I was her first Master, to me fell the gift, the responsibility to see her well kept.

I had failed.

Never again; I vowed.

Never again would I allow harm to come to her.

Fate, fortune, the will of the God or Godess, I know not what touched my heart when I looked into her eyes that night.

All I do know is it burns within me still to this day.

[stripedangel]

Thanks for that.


xxx stripey

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by sisterhoney61:
It doesn't matter if the other person is throwing insults at you or throwing you against the wall. It is abuse, plain and simple

I think anyone who was emotionally and/or verbally abused has had at least one person say that they "had suffered 'only' verbal abuse." Shame, humiliation (malicious humiliation!) and degredation take longer to heal because even sometimes the victims are really hard on themselves (like me). Saying things like "why do I feel this way, at least I wasn't beaten!"

It took me a long time to see what happened as "real" abuse. It wasn't until a therapist gave me a rather incredulous look and told me in no uncertain terms, "You feel that way because you suffered abuse!" That was quite a revelation. It was difficult to accept. Abuse only happens to others, not me. Well it did happen. Now I'm able to work through it.


Originally posted by icey:
always seemed to be in the wrong place...

Please think about joining the discussion. Your comment almost sounds like you are placing the blame for the rape on you. Rape is wrong no matter where you are and what place it is. If you feel like you can't say anything just listen.

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by newslave:
though I would never leave our brothers in survival out

oops! I think I attributed this quote to the wrong person...sorry.

and, thanks for the thought!

ash

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Kuskovian:
All I do know is it burns within me still to this day

Kuskovian, I don't know your whole story but you can only protect someone so far. If some idiot is going to do something totally wrong and stupid, they will find a way no matter what you do.

Don't beat yourself up. If you can be a support now be that. And what I have to say next is something that all who have suffered abuse have to deal with: Look forward. There is little to be gained by fixating on the past. Let the past strenghen your resolve for the future, that's where life is.

[denuseri]

Master: (with tears in my eyes) i just read your post,,omg i love yu so much, i am the luckiest girl in the world to have you as my husband,friend,mentor,master,owner and protector, my one my all.

Please know it wasn't your fault, never your fault what happened,how could it be i was the one that fell out of touch, went my own way,got into trouble

you saved me that nite,

your still saving me every day

[stripedangel]

Y'all we're all set! subbie talkstarts around 12 noon (i'm central time US) i will be online until midnight if need be...denu will be on around the same time, so if you don't catch us, we'll be back real soon! Everybody's welcome to join in and share!

Can't wait to see you all there!

xxxx

[butterflySlave4u]

ok, ignore my post in the Mentoring Program thread, denuseri....Central time, people!!!

[butterflySlave4u]

went in and sat for a while...have to go for a few hours....but will bbl.....

[denuseri]

the support meeting is todayfriday the 13 in chat, centeral standard time between the hours of noon and midnite to any that are interested, just come to the lobby and pm me for details i will be in and out all day

thanku all for yur support hugs and kissess

[butterflySlave4u]

:bump:

[Kuskovian]

I would like all interested to know, that the support group meeting went very well indeed and we all thank those that participated.

A special invite only social group has been developed for the purposes of continuing the groups efforts in a more private venue to help survivors of abuse.

This group will allow those of us wishing to help a way of further organizing our efforts.

Information on who to contact for membership shall be presented by the group here in the near future.

Thank you all for your continued support and interest.

[Trina]

Hi Everyone,

I think abuse comes in many forms. My father was also verbaly abusive and a prefectionist whom nothing was ever good enough. I've recently engaged in a relationship with a man whom, I can never seem to be good enough for. He likes having sex with me just fine, but I feel like I'm trying to please him in every other way; because nothing I do is good enough for him. Strangely, like my father. Mental abuse is very is damaging and almost as bad as physical(though it doesn't compare). It still can mess you up and it's very hard to get away from or out of. I've been physically abused but not in anyway in comparission to this post. It makes me very sad that anyone can be abused in such a way. I'm sorry to hear about your ordeal but glad you posted... I think that people need to know what can go on by meeting a stranger. I've done it too much recently. Thanks for the warning. I will take heed.

[denuseri]

Abuse has too many forms Trina, and i wish we could end every one of them. i appluade yu on yur courage for coming forward about your own.
Sometimes to heal the wounds we have must bleed, but in the end we will be stronger for it.
If you ever need anything, just someone to talk to, or support you, please feel free to pm me for any assistance i can give.

[Alex Bragi]

Please be aware that this group is not affiliated with BDSMlibrary.

As is always the case, on line, please be careful about personal details and information you chose to reveal, and please always respect other people's confidentiality.

:)

[butterflySlave4u]

sooooooo.....whens the next chat meeting??

[gemmy]

Mental abuse is very is damaging and almost as bad as physical(though it doesn't compare). It still can mess you up and it's very hard to get away from or out of.

Trina, hunnie - all abuse is bad and not to be compared with anything or anyone else's experiences - what damages you, is exactly that ...damage to you simply. Mental abuses can, in cases be worse in different ways luv, they are things you continue to think about yourself long after your tormentor is no longer a part of your life, so you continue their work of damage and in essence pay them homage for their abuse by continuing it. It's easy to say let it go, and unrealistic. It's a matter of working it through to see yourself on the other side, a viable, Valuable person and believing it ;)

Physical abuse can have physical ramifications and manifestations: cutting, hurting yourself in a physical manner

Mental abuse has the same effect in that it too manifests itself mentally: low self image, self esteem, self worth

They are both powerful abuses that hurt us deeply in many many ways - talking and seeking help in even the smallest ways does help build strength and clarity to see the other side.

Some of us will never be 'fixed' but we can go through our lives a little more healthy and break the chain of abuse so it never touches our children or loved ones :)

Good luck hun and good for you for posting!

[Trina]

Hi Mastersgem, I have been seeing a therapist for sometime now but I do think the cycle continues and is very hard to break. The ramifications for me are definitly low self-image, esteem and worth. I laughed when my therapist asked me to bring my father for a group session. I am one of five siblings all of whom have been stilited as adults; it doesn't take a genius to figure something must have gone wrong with the way we were raised. My father was an expert on mental and never physical.
I do think the mental abuse is harder for me... physically the bruises go away and you forget; it's what has been said that doesn't go away.

Thanks for your comments and I've been working toward getting whole.

[crazy_grrluk]

I do think the mental abuse is harder for me... physically the bruises go away and you forget; it's what has been said that doesn't go away.



mental abuse is the worst. it never leaves you... un like the physical abuse like where u say the bruises and other stuff will disappear. mental abuse stays with you for life. one learns to live with it... and then something will trigger the memories off.. it could be an action or the way something was said.. then you regress back into your own little world.

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by crazy_grrluk:
mental abuse stays with you for life. one learns to live with it... and then something will trigger the memories off.. it could be an action or the way something was said.. then you regress back into your own little world

I agree with you that it never leaves. It really just goes to sleep and can come back with the right trigger. How bad that flashback is depends on how well you dealt with it in the past. If you don't deal with it, it will deal with you.

One other thing. I think one thing that makes mental worse than physical abuse, is that even we who have gone through it tend to minimize it. Even we tend to think someone getting beat up is worse, and we should just be thankful we didn't experience that.

When it is pushed down and made out to be not such a big deal we can set ourselves up for a big fall.

[stripedangel]

yeah, it never goes away, no matter how you try and shake it out of your head. i really did begin to believe the things that were said to me...and we do tend to try and ignore the fact that it is really abuse. Those of us who go through it always think that the physical abuse is much worse, but i know that my ex husband's physical abuse is much less of a stinging memory than my ex boyfriend's emotional abuse. the emotional is still with me. the physical can be placed in the past, for the most part. i remember every scathing word, and it rolls through my mind all on it's own. i have no control over my thoughts in this respect, it just creeps in and snatches me and i go down into myself and feel very afraid to come out, barely able to hear Master when he pays me a complement...and for the longest time i simply didn't believe it. Not that i thought he was lying, but like he had a good imagination. i remember one time when he told me that i was pretty, i said, "Are you trying to convince me, or yourself?"

Sorry to go off like that...


it hurts for years and it hurts my Master to see me go through it and to go through it with me.

xxx

[Trina]

Quote, Stripedangel: "i remember every scathing word, and it rolls through my mind all on it's own. i have no control over my thoughts in this respect, it just creeps in and snatches me."

Yes, my ex of seven years... I can just hear him telling me I wasn't good enough for him even though he loved me. Do they take some kind of training to be cruel?

[Kuskovian]

As a dominate with a survivor of abuse in my care, I have found some ways work better than others, especially conserning BDS&M type activities.

I strongly reccomend you consult a professional therapist/nurse, and or Doctor for help.

I have found in helping Seri overcome/deal with some of her triggers that patience and understanding are "key".
First and foremost: I allways let her bring to the table any issue she wishs to have help with, as well as aide in planning the best theraputic solution senerio. This is nessesary for several reasons, she cannot be expected to have success unless she feels "ready" to deal with a paticular thing. In addition to which, letting her choose, helps reestablish self confidence and esteem allowing her to be in "control" of herself.

Sometimes the best thing is to just listen and not try to "fix" anything (which goes against my nature)and is often the hardest part of this for dominates.

Just being there to hold her when she needs it is one of the things she says have helped her the most.
She has often told me that her triggers haven't diminished; so much as the way she chooses to respond to them has changed over time.

I strongly recommend a "light" hand with any survivor when it comes to limit testing and "tasks" designed to help in dealing with a given trigger, as these emotive responses they experience are very very "real" for them.

For instance: as Seri has previously stated in this thread, it took six months of effort before she could leave the house by herself for a walk around the block in our neighborhood. A walk she took knowing I would be watching her from a distance, but a walk she had to physically take by herself. Baby steps, as well as, slow and steady support were the critical factors.

How you react to your submissive's needs is of paramont importance.

One of the worst things a dominate could do is take offence, find fault, critisize or punish in anyway thier submissive when she has bualked or didn't successfully complete an assigned task conserning her "triggers" or any other abuse related issue that is being dealt with.

Remember it took great courage for her to even bring the idea of "helping' her in the first place, respect that fact, don't demean her just when you are trying to help her. It was a success regardless of outcome, just for her to even try.

Be prepared for her to become very unsettled in her demeanor, especially when in the proccess of coping with certian things. She may lash out at you in an inapropriate manner, not because she wants too, so much as has too.

Physical, mental, spiritual, all aspects of one's being are affected by abuse. It doesn't matter what kind of abuse one has endured.

If anyone needs help conserning these matters feel free to contact us.

[stripedangel]

no, trina, something tells me that they are just naturals....and i often wonder if they're not victims themselves.

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by stripedangel:
and i often wonder if they're not victims themselves

That is often true, or they are extremely insecure and try to cover it up at another's expense.

Still, an abused person MUST remember, this does not excuse an abusers behavior. It is still reprehensible and should be condemned. There is a danger in making allowances for any abusive behavior, we will often turn the blame back on ourselves. It is not our fault, and never was. Anything you do or say is not worthy of a lifetime of beatings or emotional assault.

Look how many people there are in this world who were abused and did not become abusive themselves. There is no excuse.


Originally posted by Kuskovian:
patience and understanding are "key"

There is so much here that I wish I said but didn't know how to put it into words. Thanks for saying it.

What you said about therapy is also important.

If anyone reading this has been abused and needs help and has had a hard time finding a therapist to take your lifestyle seriously go online and google "bdsm friendly therapist" you will get a listing of therapists sympathetic to kink. Or try this link: http://www.polychromatic.com/pfp/psych.html

[stripedangel]

thanks for that, wow, i wish i lived in Austin!!

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Trina:
i remember every scathing word, and it rolls through my mind all on it's own. i have no control over my thoughts in this respect, it just creeps in and snatches me.

As you go on you will be able to deal with it better. Time doesn't heal all, but it will give you space to do it. Everyday that goes buy is one more day you survive what happened to you.

It took me years to come to terms with what happened to me, but I did. Talking about it with folks who understand will help alot.

Just remember don't blame yourself. It's not your fault you were abused.


Originally posted by stripedangel:
i wish i lived in Austin

:confused: huh???

[stripedangel]

LOL i looked at your list, Austin and Houston are the locations that have those therapists, sorry...did't mean to derail the thread...

[gemmy]

Hi Mastersgem, I have been seeing a therapist for sometime now but I do think the cycle continues and is very hard to break. The ramifications for me are definitly low self-image, esteem and worth. I laughed when my therapist asked me to bring my father for a group session. I am one of five siblings all of whom have been stilited as adults; it doesn't take a genius to figure something must have gone wrong with the way we were raised. My father was an expert on mental and never physical.
I do think the mental abuse is harder for me... physically the bruises go away and you forget; it's what has been said that doesn't go away.

Thanks for your comments and I've been working toward getting whole.

"See? You're an intelligent girl, you can see the problems plaguing you, do you really think you need help?"

The one time I did seek help, that is what I was asked by the 'professional' psychiatrist.

I, (then (25), just lost my baby son and had been beaten by his father blaming me of the loss), said "Yes, I do"

He never took me seriously so thus, I took a maybe longer road of trying to work it out on my own - truly nothing really 'set' in me of my worth until having my daughter :)

I've learned over much time, that some things (and the professionals will all tell you), just need to be hard felt and learned to get.

Breaking 'The Chain' is a lot of work but so highly worth it.

I currently 'shelter' a young friend (day or night on Any notice) should she need a safe place to be and have had to - that's all part of it too ;)

[gemmy]

As a dominate with a survivor of abuse in my care, I have found some ways work better than others, especially conserning BDS&M type activities.

I strongly reccomend you consult a professional therapist/nurse, and or Doctor for help.

I have found in helping Seri overcome/deal with some of her triggers that patience and understanding are "key".
First and foremost: I allways let her bring to the table any issue she wishs to have help with, as well as aide in planning the best theraputic solution senerio. This is nessesary for several reasons, she cannot be expected to have success unless she feels "ready" to deal with a paticular thing. In addition to which, letting her choose, helps reestablish self confidence and esteem allowing her to be in "control" of herself.

Sometimes the best thing is to just listen and not try to "fix" anything (which goes against my nature)and is often the hardest part of this for dominates.

Just being there to hold her when she needs it is one of the things she says have helped her the most.
She has often told me that her triggers haven't diminished; so much as the way she chooses to respond to them has changed over time.

I strongly recommend a "light" hand with any survivor when it comes to limit testing and "tasks" designed to help in dealing with a given trigger, as these emotive responses they experience are very very "real" for them.

For instance: as Seri has previously stated in this thread, it took six months of effort before she could leave the house by herself for a walk around the block in our neighborhood. A walk she took knowing I would be watching her from a distance, but a walk she had to physically take by herself. Baby steps, as well as, slow and steady support were the critical factors.

How you react to your submissive's needs is of paramont importance.

One of the worst things a dominate could do is take offence, find fault, critisize or punish in anyway thier submissive when she has bualked or didn't successfully complete an assigned task conserning her "triggers" or any other abuse related issue that is being dealt with.

Remember it took great courage for her to even bring the idea of "helping' her in the first place, respect that fact, don't demean her just when you are trying to help her. It was a success regardless of outcome, just for her to even try.

Be prepared for her to become very unsettled in her demeanor, especially when in the proccess of coping with certian things. She may lash out at you in an inapropriate manner, not because she wants too, so much as has too.

Physical, mental, spiritual, all aspects of one's being are affected by abuse. It doesn't matter what kind of abuse one has endured.

If anyone needs help conserning these matters feel free to contact us.

really, that is amazing, thank you so much for posting it

[gemmy]

Yes, my ex of seven years... I can just hear him telling me I wasn't good enough for him even though he loved me. Do they take some kind of training to be cruel?

No, they see the 'victim' stamp ;)

remove it *s*

There is 'healthy' and unhealthy submission, for me, I truly was a victim; ashamed completely of this 'thing' i felt. People will use it as long as you 'let' them.

Embracing your submission will help you find 'healthy' submission; ignoring it only helps you dig a very bad deep ditch of attracting bad people who only choose to use it against you.

[stripedangel]

Just a note:

i was once asked the following question...

"Do you want to be a professional victim?"

Just think about it for a while.......it did something for me, i think, but i know it pops into my mind when i'm feeling a bit self-critical...

xxx

[Mr.FixIt]

Sometimes the best thing is to just listen and not try to "fix" anything (which goes against my nature)and is often the hardest part of this for dominates.

I concur entirely!


I strongly recommend a "light" hand with any survivor when it comes to limit testing and "tasks" designed to help in dealing with a given trigger, as these emotive responses they experience are very very "real" for them.

My slave, stripey, has suffered both physical and verbal/mental abuse (I would not discuss this, except that she has already shared this much here with all of you and I commend her for that). However, we ENJOY a "heavy" hand in play and in discipline. But, for her, her past mental abuse has been the prevalent matter. It has taken years to get her to realize how beautiful, wonderful, caring, loving and intelligent she is. I could never utilize humiliation techniques with her. For her, such BDSM tactics would be demonstrative and demolishing of what I have tried to help her recognize.

Please understand that I am not trying to compare physical abuse vs. verbal/mental abuse vs. sexual abuse. I myself used to be a victim of both verbal/mental and sexual abuse. I have no personal experience with physical abuse other than what I know of stripey's past--secondhand; therefore, I do not feel that I would be qualified to make such a comparison, nor do I see the need for such a comparison. But, for stripey, I do know that the verbal/mental abuse has been the lingering issue.


How you react to your submissive's needs is of paramont importance.

ABSOLUTELY.

[Mr.FixIt]

1. They had separate men's and women's private forums. Men who have been abused generally don't want to talk about their experiences publicly, and i have noticed that with the exception of ashton (thanks btw hun for sharing), there are no men doing so here...though i understand that this thread is still very new.

I MUST respond to this! Not because I see this as a challenge, because at this point in my life talking about such personal things (especially in this setting) is no longer terribly difficult for me. So here is my story.

I am the eldest child of a total of four siblings of an old school Church of Christ preacher--who was not a very good preacher. We would move to a small town in the mid-west where he landed a preaching job at a congregation with 50 members. He would judge and tell them they were all going to hell, and six months later (when the housing lease was up) we would move again--to another small town preaching job, and the cycle continued for years; therefore I am quite well adapted to being the new guy in town!

My father's judgement didn't stop at the pulpit though! He preached to me at home too. He told me over and over that I was a loser, I would never go anywhere in life, that I would never amount to anything, and I believed it...then (BTW...I have earned a better, more respectable salary than him since I was 16 years old). I fought with my father, a lot, and it was ugly. I used to put my head through the drywall in my room in retalliation until I hit a framing stud once and knocked myself out! He never hit me though. He tried once. He raised his fist and swung towards me, and I caught his hand and said, "don't ever try that again, Jerry." I used his first name a lot, that seemed to infuriate him effectively. (I'm sure that you have heard that preacher's kids are the worst!) My mother always supported the family--she worked full-time and went to college to earn her nursing degree. She was the dominant one and he hated that! He really hated that. My mother would act as the referee between us and she always got the losing end of the stick, but I was glad that someone was trying to stand up for me. Once after a really heated argument between my father and my teen-aged self (you know--the whole "your worthless thing"), my mother took me out for a drive. I thought it was cool that she was taking me out for a drive and having a conversation with me as if I was a grown adult, but didn't realize I was too young to have such a conversation------this isn't going where you think, you bunch of Freudians! lol. She told me that she wanted to take all of us kids (me and my younger sisters and brother) and leave my father. I explained that it was only me and my father that couldn't get along (I felt that it was all my fault--because he repeatedly told me so). I convinced my mother that I would move out of the house at the age of 17, and everything would be OK for my brother and sisters. In hindsight, I realize now that everything was NOT OK for my brother and sisters, and I had created a weakness for my mother in her moment of strength and resolve. I then avoided him for the next year--I rarely came home--I mostly lived at my friend's house, and I allowed myself to feel responsible for the whole family problem.

I was entirely self-concious, and I had zero self-esteem. My friend's stepfather who was clearly homosexual (in a small rural Texas town) said things that made me feel better about myself. Mind you, my self-esteem was so bad that I didn't even look people in the eye at school. I used to count the tiles in the floor between classes. I was not homosexual, and I DO NOT judge those who might be. But, he made me feel good about myself. One day I went by my friend's house, as I always did, and no one was home but his stepfather. He told me that I was a pretty-boy, and that someday all of the girls would want to get to know me. I don't quite remember how we ended up in his bed, but he sucked my cock. He was the first that I had ever been with sexually--male or female. He told me things like "you CAN move you know." I enjoyed it, and I was disgusted at the same time--it felt wrong--and good--and wrong. Someone was paying attention to me though, as no one ever had.

There's more: I remember when I was VERY young, but obviously still old enough to remember (which is what disturbs me most of all) showering with my father and asking him why his "privates" were so much larger than mine. Typing this, I am now recalling his answer that I will not share and is more disturbing to me.

There's more: from about the age of 5, for reasons that I CANNOT understand or recall, I began............................................. .................................................. .................................................. ...........I CANNOT tell the rest, here, or anywhere. There is no good way of explaining it that will help you to understand that I was the victim and the victimizer. I typed it all out once, stripey came in and read it, and correctly said that is was too much. She is the only one that I have told ALL to.

But now: I know who I am. I have worked all of my teen-aged and adult life to prove (to myself and for others' approval) that I am worthy, worthwile, and honorable. There were times in my life that I didn't feel like living. But when I met stripey, I knew she needed me and that I was, indeed, worthy, worthwhile, and could be honorable. (My father still, still, still, does not approve of my life, my decisions, or my stripey, but FUCK him and his little opinions).

My point to this all is: I now understand better who I am, because of where I have been. I am stronger now, for what I have been through. Oh sure, I still seek approval, especialy from stripey even though I am her Master! But our past experiences have made us perfect for suporting each other. And men, even dominant men, can share (most of) their abused experiences!

Thank you stripey, for honoring me by giving yourself to me entirely. I love you peaches! I have made a lot of mistakes, but as long as you will tolerate it, I will be here for you. As our boy once said, "Daddy can fix anything!"

[denuseri]

That was a very brave thing to do Mr Fix It, and proves that there are allways exceptions to the rule when it comes to stereotyping the abused and what forms abuses take.

We are here for you just as much as for anyone else.

It is not what happened to "us" that defines "us", it is how we meet each dawn despite it that matters most.





and in response to your response above this post very full of courage i would like to say i think what my owner is speaking of as "light" being while we are working on something that is tramatically difficult for me, one of my responses to a "trigger" like my episode with agoraphobia,

in areas where "things have been worked out we have and also do enjoy "rough" play as it were, sometimes even what others consider "hard ball" there is even some broken pvc pipe in the back yard to prove it

winks but hey we are goreans after all lol

[stripedangel]

Oh, Master, i love you so very much! Hugs! i am so proud of you for opening up. You did well, Sir.

Precious Master!

i know what it took for you to say these things, and i know you are a true survivor. You have honored me since the day we met, Sir, and it has grown immensely...along with our trust and love-and our marriage. What a blessing you have been to me and the kiddo. i am in awe of your strength and resolve. i see you growing in your Domhood (is that a word? is now!), maturing every day.

You are so beautiful, Master!

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[Rowen]

Mr. Fixit, my respect for sharing, will send you a PM..Stripey, will PM you too...but really want to express my admiration to the both of you in public.....your caring and love for eachother is awesome - you have been through the "for worse" part and I do wish you both the "for better" parts!!

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Mr. FixIt:
It has taken years to get her to realize how beautiful, wonderful, caring, loving and intelligent she is. I could never utilize humiliation techniques with her. For her, such BDSM tactics would be demonstrative and demolishing of what I have tried to help her recognize.

Everyone has limits and those need to be respected. Some of us have more limits, some have different ones than others. It takes a good, person to see where things should not go. I have heard of some Dom/mes who treat hard limits as challenges, or personal mountains to conquer. You are right, it would be bad to push in that direction. stripey is one lucky woman to have you FixIt.

I can't say too much about you and your dad, it hits way too close to home for me. Unfortunately, it's still an open wound. Still, thanks for sharing.

[stripedangel]

That reminds me of a toast i once heard

May the best of your past be the worst of your future! Cheers!

i love saying it!

[stripedangel]

Everyone has limits and those need to be respected. Some of us have more limits, some have different ones than others. It takes a good, person to see where things should not go. I have heard of some Dom/mes who treat hard limits as challenges, or personal mountains to conquer. You are right, it would be bad to push in that direction. stripey is one lucky woman to have you FixIt.

I can't say too much about you and your dad, it hits way too close to home for me. Unfortunately, it's still an open wound. Still, thanks for sharing.


aww ashton, how sweet of you to say, and i am very blessed. Master has made that choice all on his own, i did not post it as a hard limit. That is his hard limit...but one that i will not argue, as i do believe it would undo some of the work that Master has done.

Master's father has abused all of us, in various ways, who have been involved with him. He looks upon everyone with contempt and pity, like he feels that he has not prayed for them enough, no matter what they do. Nothing is good enough. i am a jezebelle. My son is a poor pitiful product of heathens. Master is never to be believed...Good ole dad has, time after time, questioned the validity of Master's claim that he ran a faster mile than his father. i was standing there when Master ran that race and i saw the time and told the man and he still sat there with that shitty little grin on his face, shaking his head at the two of us, with disbelief and contempt in his eyes. i could tell he was not accepting this very minute occurrance.

It's not like Master said , "i'm a better dad than you."
................................which is also very accurate.

The man even stated that a congregation member needed to be punished for her outspokenness.

Makes me even more proud of what i've seen Master grow into......

[newslave]

As I read through pages and pages of stories and support, I wonder why this happens...why we have to support one another. What makes people like this...people who do nothing but hurt other people, try to destroy them...

I begin to think - what can change this? What can we do to prevent other women and men from going through the things that we have and struggling to survive and be healthy? Where is the fault in the cultures, in the world? Perhaps this belongs in another thread, but my survival has revolved around taking control in other avenues of my life and trying to change what's around me.

What can change this? Is there even a way?

Love to all who are here, and thank you all for sharing...

[Mr.FixIt]

As I read through pages and pages of stories and support, I wonder why this happens...why we have to support one another. What makes people like this...people who do nothing but hurt other people, try to destroy them...

I begin to think - what can change this? What can we do to prevent other women and men from going through the things that we have and struggling to survive and be healthy? Where is the fault in the cultures, in the world? Perhaps this belongs in another thread, but my survival has revolved around taking control in other avenues of my life and trying to change what's around me.

What can change this? Is there even a way?

Love to all who are here, and thank you all for sharing...

Dog shit smells like dog shit.

If you accept that most people are dogshit and stop expecting more than that of them, you will be pleasantly surprised when dog shit smells slightly like roses--and dog shit. Is that too synical? I don't think so.

:cool:

[stripedangel]

By standing together, we are powerful. We were all alone in our own nightmares but now we're not alone.

The abusers will keep on keepin on, but we are there to make sure that at least some don't leave behind a victim...because since there are so many abusers out there, we all need to be able to inspire and show others that they can survive and help give them the will to make it. They need someone to show them how to be a survivor and they need to be able to cry to someone or a group of someones. See, we carry a torch that must be passed on.

You never know what impression you will have on another's life. i would rather look at it realistically, aware of the fact that this sort of thing will happen no matter how i wish it not to. Therefore, i must open up and bleed some. OK, i can do that if i can take Master's stripes. i hope i leave a helpful impression on anyone that i encounter, always.

xxx

[newslave]

Dog shit smells like dog shit.

If you accept that most people are dogshit and stop expecting more than that of them, you will be pleasantly surprised when dog shit smells slightly like roses--and dog shit. Is that too synical? I don't think so.

:cool:

Interesting theory....though I must admit I haven't quite reached that amount of cynicism in my life, despite the people I've met. It is the Midwest in me, perhaps, but I like to think that people are capable of all kinds of wonderful things. Including....making things like this change....

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by stripedangel:
He looks upon everyone with contempt and pity, like he feels that he has not prayed for them enough, no matter what they do. Nothing is good enough

He sounds like an extremely insecure person. It's sad in a way. but if he was less obnoxious his family might want to help him. As it is his actions keep everyone at arms length, which he may be doing on purpose (and maybe unconsciously) to somehow protect himself from whatever it is he is afraid of.


Originally posted by newslave:
I begin to think - what can change this? What can we do to prevent other women and men from going through the things that we have and struggling to survive and be healthy? Where is the fault in the cultures, in the world? Perhaps this belongs in another thread, but my survival has revolved around taking control in other avenues of my life and trying to change what's around me.

What can change this? Is there even a way?

One of us alone can do little. Together we become stronger. We cannot change the world ourselves and probably will not see resolution in our lifetime, but that does not mean that we can abandon the cause.

Some of us here take time out of our day to let folks who are hurting know that they do not have to continue being a victim. Sometimes it seems strange to find, on a website devoted to an alternative lifestyle that this thread is here. On the other hand, all of us here are just ordinary people, and some of us have been abused. We are trying to take control in a little part of this big world where we have some influence and use that for good.

I think we are trying to do it the only way we know how, one person at a time.

[stripedangel]

Master's father is a whole other issue, and i don't know where it stems from. The man is narsocistic, or however you spell it. He honestly believes that he is correct in all he does. God is even backing his every play...His way is the only way and no one is on a tall enough pedistal to match his. He's not lying when he says the awful things he says, he honestly believes it. All of it. He does't say things that he doesn't mean. He never says anything without having given it a huge amount of ponderance and consideration....not even out of anger.

He never had time for making sure that the kids brushed their teeth or turned in their homework. He never could be bothered with making sure the kids were disciplined, unless one of them said or did something in public that embarrassed him. He fought his own divorce with the sixth amendment argument...divorce would keep him from practicing his freedom of religion, since the Bible doesn't condone divorce for any other reason than adultery. When the judge laughed at that one, his next move was to call me (since i must have been the one to influence his wife into the divorce in the first place...you know, she's a woman...forget the fact that she was in her 50s and had been a nurse half her life...she could not have come up with that idea on her own, had to be the family jezebelle). When i answered the phone, he proceeded to try and blackmail me about everything that had happened with Master when he was little...talking about how he would bring it up in court. The judge would hear it and split us all up. He would have hated to see that happen, he'd stated, but his marriage (his wife/property) was being taken from him and he had to fight for it. i told him, "This all is now over." and hung up.

One person at a time, and one day-hour-minute-second-breath. Some days it's breath by breath for me...All we can do is be of support. We can't take the pain away, but if we face it, and deal with it and we have others around who will face it with us, then no one has to hurt alone. That's the worst.

i have a vivid memory of suffering alone...the one that i can never get past. The verbal jackass had just finished making me feel like a nothing yet again, flat out told me he had someone ready to suck him off at work, since i was so inept at it. He decided to visit said cocksucker after berating me for about 30 minutes with a lecture of how my fat got in the way of him seeing the pretty me...in great detail. Wonder why i wasn't much for oral??

[LOL i'm the complete opposite now in that respect...i love you, Master!]

The bastard had left and there i sat, tears rolling, sobbing...and here come my son, age 3. He put his hand on my knee and just stood there, stroking my head. After a bit, he asked, "Why you so sad, mommy?"

We all know that a three year old is too young to even begin to understand any answer that i could have given him, and i couldn't think of anything to say that he could have digested, so i just sat there and shook my head. i knew at that moment that even though i had my lil man no matter what...i was alone in this hell, and i had to keep him from being affected. i didn't want him to see me crying over it any more, that was totally wrong to do to a child...making him wonder why i cried so much and all. i had no one else to tell this to, my best friend was the bastard's sister-in-law. She knew that things were bad for me but had no idea what i was told behind closed doors....because the bastard had me convinced that talking bad about someone to their family was lower than low. Worse than a rat or a narc (he'd been in prison, therefore i was trained on how to keep my mouth shut about many things as well).

After he left me for good was when my best friend began to get me to open up and when i did i found out that this was typical of the bastard, and that his reason for going to prison wasn't just for rape, but that he'd been caught peeping in wondows at the local college and that his ex wife divorced him for raping her.

According to him, the prison term of 20 years (out for good behavior after 14) was because he was once caught with his bread truck at home for lunch, which was against company policy and the owner of the bread company was good friends with the sherriff, so they trumped up a bunch of stuff and got him sent to prison. Gawd i feel dumb writing and admitting to falling for this!
But i digress.........

i never ever want anyone to feel that way, like there's no place to go, no one to turn to. No one who can honestly hold their hand and tell them it's ok to say whatever you want, tell it all...and no one can hurt you any more for it.

xxxxx

[Euryleia]

Thanks so much for sharing your story, stripedangel. Good for you for getting out and being willing to take another chance on love and happiness. Your resilience is inspiring.

You bring up a very good point about people feeling that they have no one to turn to. Isolation is a major tool that abusers use to keep their victims from hearing the truth or getting support. They want their voice to be the only one in our heads.

That is why friends are infinitely priceless. A friend reminds you of everything that lies within your heart. They act as a mirror when you lose sight of who you really are or what you truly believe in. They pick you up when you forget that you can do so on your own. They remind you of the true value of your worth.

Whether here on the forums or in the real world, finding and keeping friends can help keep us safe and speed our recovery.

[newslave]

Whether here on the forums or in the real world, finding and keeping friends can help keep us safe and speed our recovery.

I completely agree....Absolutely, although I wonder how to find these people in real life. One of my "friends" is the very reason that I feel the need to be around this thread. Two, in fact. Another one of my friends was texting another person as I told him about my story, and the rest just feel really uncomfortable.

I love all of the people that are here and giving support to me and to all of us, but how do I find a person that I can trust somewhere other than the internet? Most of my friends will never know what I've been through, because I have a hard time trusting people, as I always have. So far, only one of my friendships has grown stronger after the story, mainly because she told me hers and we were drunk and we cried together.

Does this happen to anyone else?
As always, love to all...

[stripedangel]

Yes!! LOL! That's how Master and i began our relationship! The story is around here somewhere, we told each other everything...........ALL OF IT! We had both been drinking and could have been tipsy, and we both cried sitting there in a news station parking lot waiting for a friend of his who was needing a ride home. There are folks that you can trust...it's just a matter of finding the right ones.


xxxx

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by newslave:
Does this happen to anyone else?

Well yes, I often get drunk and cry. lol

But seriously, I have a hard time trusting others, too. But it was easy here not because it's the internet and anonymous. What makes it easy is that here for the first time I met folks who know from experience what I'm talking about. They allowed me to see that it is time for me to move on with my life and not let my past hold me back. And the great thing is that I have an opportunity to do the same for them.

We talk about support, but it's really about giving and getting support that helps us all the most. When we give and get we find ourselves in the best position to heal. If we only try to help others and hold ourselves apart we cannot heal because we will not allow ourselves to do it.

You are not alone in this. There are more stories here than you can imagine. As you hang around you will learn to see things differently, and to see the opportunities to give and to get.

[crazy_grrluk]

It's good advices for ladies.
We have all read similar advices but read them again, there might be some new ones.




Through a Rapist's Eyes (No Joke)

This is important information for females of ALL ages.

When this was sent to me, I was told to forward it to my lady friends, but I forwarded it to almost everyone in my address book. My men friends have female friends and this information is too important to miss someone.
Please pass it along.

A group of rapists and date rapists in prison were interviewed on what they look for in a potential victim and here are some interesting facts:

1) The first thing men look for in a potential victim is hairstyle. They are most likely to go after a woman with a ponytail, bun, braid or other hairstyle that can easily be grabbed. They are also likely to go after a woman with long hair. Women with short hair are not common targets.

2) The second thing men look for is clothing. They will look for women whose clothing is easy to remove quickly. Many of them carry scissors around specifically to cut clothing.

3) They also look for women on their cell phone, searching through their purse, or doing other activities while walking because they are off-guard and can be easily overpowered.

4) Men are most likely to attack & rape in the early morning, between 5:00 a.m. And 8:30 a.m.

5)! The num ber one place women are abducted from/attacked is grocery store parking lots. Number two: Are office parking lots/garages. Number three: Are public restrooms.


6) The thing about these men is that they are looking to grab a woman and quickly move her to another location where they don't have to worry about getting caught.


7) Only 2% said they carried weapons because rape carries a 3-5 year sentence but rape with a weapon is 15-20 years.


8) If you put up any kind of a fight at all, they get discouraged because it only takes a minute or two for them to realize that going after you isn't worth it because it will be time-consuming.


9) These men said they would not pick on women who have umbrellas, or other similar objects that can be used from a distance, in their hands.

Keys are not a deterrent because you have to get really close to the attacker to use them as a weapon. So, the idea is to convince these guys you're not worth it.

10) Several defense mechanisms he taught us are: If someone is following behind you on a street or in a garage or with you in an elevator or stairwell, look them in the face and ask them a question, like what time is it, or make general small talk: 'I can't believe it is so cold out here,' 'we're in for a bad winter.' Now you've seen their face and c! ould ide n tify them in a line-up; you lose appeal as a target.

11) If someone is coming toward you, hold out your hands in front of you and yell STOP or STAY BACK! Most of the rapists this man talked to said they'd leave a woman alone if she yelled or showed that she would not be afraid to fight back. Again, they are looking for an EASY target.

12) If you carry pepper spray (this instructor was a huge advocate of it and carries it with him wherever he goes), yell I HAVE PEPPER SPRAY and holding it out will be a deterrent.


13) If someone grabs you, you can't beat them with strength but you can by outsmarting them. If you are grabbed around the waist from behind, pinch the attacker either under the arm (between the elbow and armpit) OR in the upper inner thigh VERY VERY HARD. One woman in a class this guy taught told him she used the underarm pinch on a guy who was trying to date rape her and was so upset she broke through the skin and tore out muscle strands - the guy needed stitches. Try pinching yourself in those places as hard as you can stand it - it hurts.

14) After the initial hit, always GO for the GROIN. I know from a particularly unfortunate experience that if you slap a guy's parts it is extremely painful. &nb sp; ;You might think that you'll anger the guy and make him want to hurt you more, but the thing these rapists told our instructor is that they want a woman who will not cause a lot of trouble. Start causing trouble and he's out of there.


15) When the guy puts his hands up to you, grab his first two fingers and bend them back as far as possible with as much pressure pushing down on them as possible. The instructor did it to me without using much pressure, and I ended up on my knees and both knuckles cracked audibly.

16) Of course the things we always hear still apply. Always be aware of your surroundings, take someone with you if you can and if you see any odd behavior, don't dismiss it, go with your instincts!!!

You may feel a little silly at the time, but you'd feel much worse if the guy really was trouble.

1. Tip from Tae Kwon Do: The elbow is the strongest point on your body. If you are close enough to use it, do!

2. Learned this from a tourist guide in New Orleans. If a robber asks for your wallet and/or purse, DO NOT HAND IT TO HIM. Toss it away from you....chances are that he is more interested in your wallet and/or purse than you, and he will go for the wallet/purse. RUN LIKE MAD IN THE OTHER DIRECTION!

! 3. If you are ever thrown into the trunk of a car, kick out the back tail lights and stick your arm out the hole and start waving like crazy. The driver won't see you, but everybody else will. This has saved lives.

4. Women have a tendency to get into their cars after shopping, eating, working, etc., and just sit (doing their checkbook, or making a list, etc.) DON'T DO THIS! The predator will be watching you, and this is the perfect opportunity for him to get in on the passenger side, put a gun to your head, and tell you where to go. AS SOON AS YOU GET INTO YOUR CAR, LOCK THE DOORS AND LEAVE.

a. If someone is in the car with a gun to your head DO NOT DRIVE OFF, repeat: DO NOT DRIVE OFF! Instead gun the engine and speed into anything, wrecking the car. Your Air Bag will save you. If the person is in the back seat they will get the worst of it As soon as the car crashes bail out and run. It is better than having them find your body in a remote location.

5. A few notes about getting into your car in a parking lot or parking garage:

A.) Be aware: look around you, look into your car, at the passenger side floor, and in the back seat.

B.) If you are parked next to a big van, enter your car from the passenger door. Most serial killers attack their victims by pulling them into their vans while the women are attempting to get into their cars.

C.) Look at the car parked on the driver's side of your vehicle, and the passenger side. If a male is sitting alone in the seat nearest your car, you may want to walk back into the mall, or work, and get a guard/policeman to walk you back out.

IT IS ALWAYS BETTER TO BE SAFE THAN SORRY. (And better paranoid than dead.)

6. ALWAYS take the elevator instead of the stairs. (Stairwells are horrible places to be alone and the perfect crime spot. This is especially true at NIGHT!)

7. If the predator has a gun and you are not under his control, ALWAYS RUN! &nbs! p;The predator will only hit you (a running target) 4 in 100 times. And even then, it most likely WILL NOT be a vital organ. RUN, preferably in a zigzag pattern!

8. As women, we are always trying to be sympathetic: STOP! It may get you raped or killed. Ted Bundy, the serial killer, was a good-looking, well-educated man, who ALWAYS played on the sympathies of unsuspecting women. He walked with a cane, or a limp, and often asked 'for help' into his vehicle or with his vehicle, which is when he abducted his next victim.

I'd like you to forward this to all the women you know. It may save a life. A candle is not dimmed by lighting another candle. I was going to send this to the ladies, but guys, if you love your mothers, wives, sisters, daughters, etc., you may want to pass it onto them, as well

[gemmy]

great advice, all of it hun - thank you!

[crazy_grrluk]

i recieved it in an email today from a friend

[stripedangel]

Wow, cg, info worth reading! That's one of the best posts i've seen in a long time.

Thanks!!!

[butterflySlave4u]

Excellent, excellent, excellent!!

[denuseri]

cg that was just awsome i hope we all take it to heart here, i know i do


i only have one more thing to add,, its mainly for people that are going to meet someone from online for the first time

i didnt do the following and it was a serious contributing factor to what happened to me;


1)Allways have a responsible (real life not online)third party that yu trust available to monitor from a distance your encounter that yu must contact in person (if contact by phone then have a pre arranged "trouble" word) by a certian time or they will call the cops for yu etc,,

2) do not go anywhere with the perspective dom without letting yur contact know the location, address etc

3) have prearanged times, set them in stone like a hard limit and its ok to explain that these times cant be broken to the person your meeting,, that way they will know you are not a good "abduction" canadate

4) keep yur responsible party contact long after the inital meeting,, gradually relaxing the standards until you really know the person, for instance: with me it was a few days allmost a full week before "bad" things started to happen and i realized i was in way over my head with no hope of escape (i recomend a month or two at least)

5) never allow yur emergency contact to be in the perspective doms presence with you, if he has bad intentions you may both end up in trouble

6) dont let yur gaurd down just because its a woman, or he has a woman with him when you meet,, belive it or not she may be an willing or perhaps not so willing accomplance. (which was the case for me)

7) last but not least "take your time and think things through" you may really like the person and be head over heels from the time yu have spent with him or her online, which may cloud your judgement big time,, dont rush,, be careful be safe first,

If they resent these limitations or complain about them (if they know there in place), then perhaps they have some issues you need to carefully think about before making a further comitment to them.

Eventually if they are the Mr or Mrs "right" for you they will earn you trust with time and more than likely will be fine with your extra saftey percautions because if they really do care they will want yu to feel safe.


In addition to this the more people know about your relationship to this person the better, a lot of the above can also be handeled with a "group" of people supporting yu, heck if yu can, meet he or she with a group of yur friends present the first couple times, the more people know thier face address job etc etc the better.

[Mr.FixIt]

He sounds like an extremely insecure person. It's sad in a way. but if he was less obnoxious his family might want to help him. As it is his actions keep everyone at arms length, which he may be doing on purpose (and maybe unconsciously) to somehow protect himself from whatever it is he is afraid of.


You are correct ashton. Within the last couple of years, I discovered, from my mother that, as a child my father was raped by an older boy in Brazil. This discovery confirmed for me what I already suspected--We all have some skeleton in our collective closets. and none of us is alone!

[Arria]

I´d like to add my 2 cents here. They originate from the time when I was very young, lived in a small village without public transport, and did a lot of hitchhiking.
I´d like to point out that the family I lived with was well-known in the area, and it was typical for the village inhabitants to pick up hitchhiking youngsters because they did the same before they got their own driving licence. However, there were times and places where I joined the cars of complete strangers.
I also spoke about my experiences with the Dom who later introduced me to the lifestyle together with his lady, which was a great help for me.

First of all, don´t hitch-hike unless you really have to, of course :-)
1. Don´t tell where you want to go - first ask where the driver is heading. If that is your direction, you can join. This way you avoid to be captured by some guy who will just tell you what you want to hear, and then go somewhere else (like into the next dark wood, yes).
2. Upon entering the car, do NOT show fear of contact! Look him in the eye, speak clearly, don´t twitch or pull back your hand if it happens to touch his when you buckle your seat bealt.
3. This piece of advice came from a guy who used to do a lot of hitch-hiking himself. The ride with him proved to be the most entertaining :-) He said, do not answer any questions the driver asks you honestly. It is not his business what your name or occupation or place of living is. Tell him fairy tales. If you´re not good at stand-up lies, prepare a story that you can tell at such occasions.
4. Contrary to what we are told so often: Don´t cover your whole body with clothes. I tested various clothing styles and found that I got the really obtrusive come-ons when I dressed the most decently. This does not mean you should make yourself look cheap! Just show you are aware of your body. The aforementioned Dom explained to me that a woman who obviously is aware of her body and the reactions it may cause means TROUBLE if someone is trying to take advantage of her. Meaning she will know what to expect, and will have means to fight back.
5. Do NOT carry a weapon (e.g. knife) unless you REALLY know how to use it! A potential attacker will very likely take it from you and use it against you. Pepper spray might be a better thing, but it could be problematic if used in a closed space like a car.
6. If you feel uncomfortable in any way with the person whose car you are in, GET OUT, if need be at the next gas station!
7. Make sure your driver knows you are expected within a certain timeframe, and if you don´t turn up, people will be looking for you. (This is even easier today, as everybody has a mobile... my hitchhiking times were before the mobile era).
8. Never ever let the guy take you to your doorstep, NO MATTER how trustworthy he might appear! Get out of the car a few streets away from the place where you are really going, and MAKE SURE (!) that he drives away before you go in your planned direction.
9. If you get any indecent offers (and you will get them - many men seem to believe if a girl gets a ride, she will be willing to give a "ride" in return...), decline firmly but politely. If he does not give up his attempts, GET OUT at the next occasion!
10. Avoid at all costs to appear scared. It gives them the feeling they are in control.
11. And here is one for the smart-asses who tell girls only to join cars where the driver is a woman, or where a woman is also in the car: That doesn´t happen.
I have taken approximately 200 hitchhiking rides, and the ONLY time a woman driver stopped for me was because she mistook me for her daughter.
As for the couples in cars: The guys usually look friendly, the ladies beside them look usually VERY poisonous. Especially if you are younger and prettier than themselves.

As for denuseri´s former post: I think some of those precautions should be taken by vanilla girls meeting vanilla guys. It´s not like the weirdos were to be found only among the BDSM folks...

Kind regards
Arria

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Mr. FixIt:
We all have some skeleton in our collective closets. and none of us is alone!

What happened to seems to explain the intensity of his religious fervor. But I wonder if he is preaching at the perpetrator for doing it, or himself for letting it happen.

As to your last comment, for years I thought I was alone. When I found this place I found I wasn't. Still haven't gotten used to it yet but it feels pretty good.

[stripedangel]

What happened to seems to explain the intensity of his religious fervor. But I wonder if he is preaching at the perpetrator for doing it, or himself for letting it happen.

As to your last comment, for years I thought I was alone. When I found this place I found I wasn't. Still haven't gotten used to it yet but it feels pretty good.


Master's father was the son of a Baptist Minister. Their reason for being in Brazil was missionary work, and Master's father's first language was Portugese. He was 6 months old when they went to Brazil and he was 16 when they came back to the US.

Since Master's parents' divorce about 4 years ago, this man has renounced his faith. i don't know if he has been attending church lately, as we rarely hear from him, or anyone from Master's family.

Yes, absolutely, it is so easy to feel alone. i too am happy to have found this site and these people...and i'm happy that Master has a venue for his healing as well.

xxx

[newslave]

From a Website....

The crime of date rape is becoming more and more prevalent. Fortunately,
extensive media coverage of this crime and so called date rape drugs have made women more vigilant and aware of this potential threat. Still, despite increased awareness, the number of these incidents continues to climb.

Parties, bars and night clubs are prime breeding grounds for acts of violence, assault and rape. With this in mind, these simple safety tips are important to keep in mind and pass along.


-Always get your own drink, and watch it being poured.
-Never leave your drink unattended. If you need to use the restroom and can't take it with you, leave it with a trusted friend-not a new date!
-If your drink tastes funny, do not drink it and dispose of it so no one else does.
-Keep in mind that most drugs used to spike a drink are colorless and tasteless, so not allowing your drink out of your sight is paramount.
-Be aware of how your friends are acting. If they seem more "out of it" than usual, be very wary and keep an eye out for them.


When it's time to leave, you may have met someone you are interested in. Ask yourself if you really trust this person. Can you be sure they won't make you do anything you don't want to do? Are you confident they will take NO for an answer?

If you've asked yourself these questions and still want to leave with this person, be sure to introduce them to friends and let your friends know you are leaving with them.

So you've left with this person and you're now in a new location. You could be in a car, your home, their home, the beach, or some other secluded spot. You could even be a consenting participant in a heavy "make out" session. But things are moving too fast, the person's making you uncomfortable, or you've just simply changed your mind.

At no point is it ever too late to say NO. Say it firmly and repeat it louder if you need to.

Hopefully, you were right when you asked yourself if you could trust this person, that they wouldn't make you do anything you didn't want to do, and that they'd take NO for an answer. Unfortunately, despite a person's best efforts, it's possible to find yourself with somebody who has fooled you horribly and isn't going to take NO for an answer. This is NOT your fault. However, you do need to act to ensure your safety. If screaming for help or fleeing are not viable options, you need to defend yourself.

I could discuss many self-defense tactics or possible weapons, but for this particular topic, I'd like to tell you about one particular item that can be perfect for a situation where date rape seems imminent. It's a pepper spray disguised as a lipstick. A potential attacker is likely to drop their guard if you switch gears from resisting to saying you'd like to freshen your lipstick. His posture will relax when he sees you reach into your purse and come out with nothing but the aforementioned lipstick. But, the attractive case he sees packs a potent pepper spray. It holds twenty half-second sprays with a range of 10 feet. While your potential attacker is temporarily blinded and in excruciating pain, you have given yourself ample time to escape and go for help.



I searched all around to try to find better lists to prevent date rape, because I hear that the majority of rape is with someone that the woman knows...but it really looks like the ways to prevent it are slim.

For me it wasn't a guy in an alley, or an (I thought) unsafe place, it was a guy that I knew, that I met at church camp and thought that I could trust, a guy who is probably a youth pastor now. I wasn't drunk or under any influences other than senses dulled from sleep. I hadn't been partying, we never made out, I didn't even know that he liked me. I wasn't prepared because I didn't think I needed to be...we were never meant to be alone. I could've learned all of this and I don't think it would have been the same...

(Love)
New

[stripedangel]

Male Sexual Abuse/Rape

http://www.aest.org.uk/index.html

Found this site, but wanted to post this part in here ...

A sexual assault is any time either a stranger, or someone you know, touches any parts of your body in a sexual way, directly or through clothing, when you do not want it. Sexual assault includes situations when you cannot say no because you are drunk, high, unconscious, or have a disability.

Rape is any kind of sexual assault that involves the forced penetration of the anus or mouth, by a penis or other object. This may not be the legal definition of where you live but it fits to a large extent. There are other definitions that may fit better for you, and that is OK as well, if you feel like you were raped then you probably were.

Rape, and sexual assault, are not about sex, even though they may they feel like it, they are violent crimes against another person. Rape and sexual assault, like any other forms of violence, are used to exert power AND control over another person, yet for males it can cause all sorts of problems, guilt and shame. Many feel that rape is just not suppose to happen to males, but all to often it does happen.

Most cases of male rape tend to go unreported even though they are often far more physically violent than the rape of females. There are several reasons for this, and we shall have a look at some of them soon. Rape is widely accepted as a crime of violence, and is not as such a sexual crime. The anger, violence, hatred and fear are acted out sexually as a way of dehumanizing the victim to a point where the rapist no longer has to care about you as a person. Invariably the rapist will tell you that it is your fault in some way, and although the mixture of words and violence can be a powerful way of brain washing, it is only that; brain washing. NO ONE deserves to be raped, same as no one deserves to be abused as a child or an adult.

Males CAN freeze when afraid and can thus be totally unable to protect themselves. This is especially true when been raped and afraid for your life, just as it is when you are young and been abused. It does NOT matter if the rest of the time you get into fights and usually win, when you are under that much fear it is totally understandable if you froze, and is NOT a sign of weakness. Rapists and abusers sometimes use threats or weapons to force a person to cooperate. It is important to bear in mind that cooperation does not mean consent. Sometimes cooperating with a rapist is essential to survive the situation. If you are sexually assaulted or raped, it is never your fault - you are not accountable for the actions of others.

Male rape can causes problems to do with sexuality. It is almost inevitable that on having a penis inserted into the rectum, that the victim would gain an erection. This is caused purely by an automatic reaction of the body, due to stimulation of the prostate gland, and the male "G" spot. Even if the victim ejaculates, it is only to be expected. Irrespective of being heterosexual, bisexual or gay, it should not be taken to mean that you enjoyed the experience. (see Myths and facts about male rape )

Getting an erection is one of the main reasons that male rape goes unreported so often. If the victim is heterosexual, they fear that they will be accused of being gay. If the victim is gay, they think getting an erection will be taken as them "asking for it". Either way, getting an erection can be a cause of shame to may males who are raped, and do not understand that it is purely the way the human body is designed. However, most Police stations (in the UK) now have a Victim Liaison Officer, who is used to dealing with abused or raped people, and is trained to be sensitive to the needs of the victim. Now that male rape is accepted in law as rape, rather than assault, males now have the same protection in court as females in having there names protected (in the UK).

Many men, unfortunately, find it easier to blame themselves than accept that they could be overpowered and raped. Men are taught from an early age that they should be strong and able to protect themselves. Unfortunately, that is as much a myth as Father Christmas, but we all believed in him when we were young. The shame and guilt is similar to that of childhood sexual abuse, and often a survivor of childhood sexual abuse will find they seem to find themselves in situations where they are re-victimised in later life.

REASONS FOR SHAME AND GUILT

The myth that men are suppose to be able to protect themselves.

The myth that men can not be a victim.

Got an erection, possibly ejaculated.

The myth that only gay people get raped.

Unable to accept how afraid you were, possibly for your life.

Self blame for not being able to stop the rape.


.

REASONS FOR NOT REPORTING THE RAPE, OR GETTING HELP.

Guilt, Shame, Self-blame. Fear of not being believed.
Fear of being accused of being gay. If gay, been accused of "asking for it".
Fear of ridicule in court, and / or newspapers. Fear of reprisals from the rapist.
Males less used to talking about emotions than females. Fear of what friends or family will think.
Thinking you are the only one it has happened to.

Although, everyone reacts differently to surviving such an assault, there are some common symptoms and reactions.

PROBLEMS CAUSED BY RAPE

Fear of going out due to being unable to protect yourself. Being unable to trust people, especially males.
Nightmares. Flashbacks.
Panic attacks. Depression.
Sexual dysfunction. Drink / drug problems.
Eating disorders Self hate.
Fear of HIV infection. suicidal thoughts and behavior
Questioning sexuality. Questioning ones manliness.
Withdrawal from relationships
Feeling of loss of control



As you can see from the above list, some of the effects are similar to childhood sexual abused, and if you have been a victim of both, then life can become extremely difficult. However, there are differences, many because of your age, the amount of violence used, fear of being killed, etc. Unlike childhood sexual abuse, where no one could reasonably expect to protect him or herself, adult male rape raises the big question of "why did I not stop it happening?" This was a question that I personally had a lot of problems trying to find an answer to.

I was 37 years old, and the person who raped me was only 24 years old, ex-army and physically much stronger than me. (See I still have to justify it to my self sometimes). The rape took place in my own home, after been violently beaten up for a period of over four and a half hours, more on than off. During that time, there were short periods of time that I was alone in the room and latter thought that I could have escaped, but instead I froze. It took a long time for me to accept that it is understandable to freeze when faced with a situation where I was convinced I would end up dead and had no control over the situation. Had I of attempted to escape, whilst in a state of shock I would not of got very far, and that would of pushed my attacker into a corner where he would of been more likely to kill me. There was nothing in reality that I could have done apart from give in to him. I wrote down every thing that I thought I could have done, but when I worked out what my attacker would have done, the outcome would have been worse.

Another reason that I gave into the situation was that I had taken as much physical pain as I could. That does not make me a coward, it just means that I was realistic. I would have done anything to stop the pain. The fact that I had been abused as a child also meant that, by being raped, I was at least in a situation that was more familiar than been violently beaten. Which ever way I look at the incident I no longer blame myself for what happened, or the things that happened in the 10 weeks before the police moved him out of my house. I did what ever I had to do too physically survive the events, and had I not I would probably not be alive now. Sure I wish it had not of happened, but it did, I can not change it, and I now have to move on. Three years later I still find it hard to sleep on a night in the dark, even though the house is now alarmed. I still have nightmares, though they are getting less frequent. I sleep in a different bedroom. I have moved all the furniture around and redecorated. Basically I have done all that I can so that I do not have constant reminders in my house. Whilst I do not think anyone can totally recover from being raped, things do improve in time. The hardest part was to stop blaming myself, but with the help of two good therapists I eventually managed to accept that I was not to blame. I hope that you too will be able to let go of the self blame yourself, as you did not deserve to be raped and you do not deserve the blame either.

[stripedangel]

An abusive partner will railroad discussions, so that you don't have time to think about what's right and what's wrong in their behavior.
Take a moment to consider these questions. Your partner might have behaved as though these things were okay, even though it's obvious that they aren't okay...:

Do you feel that you can't discuss with your partner what is bothering you?

Does your partner frequently criticize you, humiliate you, or undermine your self-esteem?

Does your partner ridicule you for expressing yourself?

Does your partner isolate you from friends, family or groups?

Does your partner limit your access to work, money or material resources?

Has your partner ever stolen from you? Or run up debts for you to handle?

Does your relationship swing back and forth between a lot of emotional distance and being very close?

Have you ever felt obligated to have sex, just to avoid an argument about it?

Do you sometimes feel trapped in the relationship?

Has your partner ever thrown away your belongings, destroyed objects or threatened pets?

Are you afraid of your partner?

THE PROCESS OF BRAINWASHING (MIND CONTROL)

1. The brainwasher keeps the victim unaware of what is going on and what changes are taking place.

Your partner might control your finances, make plans for you, or not tell you what his plans are until the last minute. He may talk about you to others behind your back, to isolate you from them.

2. The brainwasher controls the victim's time and physical environment, and works to suppress much of the victim's old behavior. The victim is slowly, or abruptly, isolated from all supportive persons except the brainwasher.

Your partner might have insisted that you stop certain social, hobby, or work activities. You might have gotten moved to a new location, farther away from your family and friends. Or you may have been asked (or told) to reduce or stop contact with specific supportive people in your life.

3. The brainwasher creates in the victim a sense of powerlessness, fear, and dependency.

Verbal and emotional abuse creates these emotions, and they become stronger and stronger over time.

4. The brainwasher works to instill new behavior and attitudes in the victim.

Your partner trains to you behave in ways that he wants you to behave. He gradually makes you feel differently about yourself, and erodes your confidence in yourself.

5. The brainwasher puts forth a closed system of logic, and allows no real input or criticism.

Cycle of Abuse

Phase 1 - TENSION BUILDING:
Tension increases, breakdown of communication, victim feels need to placate the abuser.

Phase 2 - INCIDENT:
Verbal and emotional abuse. Anger, blaming, arguing. Threats. Intimidation.

Phase 3 - RECONCILIATION:
Abuser apologizes, gives excuses, blames the victim, denies the abuse occurred, or says it wasn't as bad as the victim claims.

Phase 4 - CALM:
Incident is "forgotten", no abuse is taking place.

COMMON CHARACTERISTICS OF ABUSERS

* He was verbally abused as a child, or witnessed it in his own family.

* He has an explosive temper, triggered by minor frustrations and arguments.

* Abusers are extremely possessive and jealous. They experience an intense desire to control their mates.

* His sense of masculinity depends on the woman's dependency upon him. He feels like a man only if his partner is totally submissive and dependent on him.

* Abusers often have superficial relationships with other people. Their primary, if not exclusive, relationship is with their wife/girlfriend.

* He has low self-esteem.

* He has rigid expectations of marriage (or partnership) and will not compromise. He expects her to behave according to his expectations of what a wife should be like; often the way his parents' marriage was, or its opposite. He demands that she change to accommodate his expectations.

* He has a great capacity for self-deception. He projects the blame for his relationship difficulties onto his partner. He would not be drunk if she didn't nag him so much. He wouldn't get angry if only she would do what she's supposed to do. He denies the need for counseling because there's nothing wrong with him. Or he agrees to get counseling and then avoids it or makes excuses to not follow through. He might not want her to get counseling because, he reasons, she wouldn't have any problems if she only turned to him.

* He may be described as having a dual personality -- he is either charming or exceptionally cruel. He is selfish or generous depending on his mood.

* A major characteristic of abusers is their capacity to deceive others. He can be cool, calm, charming and convincing: a con man.

* The mate is usually a symbol. The abuser doesn't relate to his partner as a person in her own right, but as a symbol of a significant other. This is especially true when he's angry. He assumes that she is thinking, feeling, or acting like that significant other -- often his mother

[stripedangel]

Found this on the net, it fits my ex husband and the subsequent boyfriend...

If you argue with him, he says you're stubborn.
If you're quiet, he argues with you anyway.
If you call him, he says you're needy and clingy.
If he calls you, he thinks you should be grateful.
If you don't act like you love him, he'll try to win you over.
If you tell him you love him, he takes advantage of you.
If you dress sexy, he says you're a slut.
If you don't dress nice, he says you look bad.
When you don't sleep with him, he says you don't love him.
If you do sleep with him, he only does it the way he likes it.
If you tell him your problems, he says you're bothering him,
If you don't, he says you don't trust him.
If you try to bring up a problem, he says you're bitching.
If he brings up a problem, he yells.
If you break a promise, you "can't be trusted".
If he breaks it, it's because "he had to".
If you cheat, he wants to punish you by locking you up or beating you.
If he cheats, he expects to be given another chance

[denuseri]

WOW stripey hugs sis,, you are a brave one, and i commend all the time and reaserch you have done to make all these very informative posts,,big time personal thanks sis luv ya bunches boo


I would like to announce that the next chat meeting for abuse survivors is Saterday the 28th of June, between the hours of noon and midnight or there abouts standard centeral time, Members of the abuse support sanctuary may check in there for the password all others feel free to contact by pm eiather myself, MysteriousFun, or striped angel for the private chat rooms password on that day.

Thanku hugs and kissess

[stripedangel]

i don't believe all of it fits us here in the BDSM community, but i believe it's all good to know.....and some of it is really pertinent to the lifestyle.


i have seen others posting things that they have experience with or have researched, and i think it's a good idea to do this. You find things out for yourself, and have the opportunity to share it...bonus! Thanks y'all...i learned some shit! LOL

Huggles

[Mr.FixIt]

COMMON CHARACTERISTICS OF ABUSERS

* He was verbally abused as a child, or witnessed it in his own family.

* He has an explosive temper, triggered by minor frustrations and arguments.

* Abusers are extremely possessive and jealous. They experience an intense desire to control their mates.

* His sense of masculinity depends on the woman's dependency upon him. He feels like a man only if his partner is totally submissive and dependent on him.

* Abusers often have superficial relationships with other people. Their primary, if not exclusive, relationship is with their wife/girlfriend.

* He has low self-esteem.

* He has rigid expectations of marriage (or partnership) and will not compromise. He expects her to behave according to his expectations of what a wife should be like; often the way his parents' marriage was, or its opposite. He demands that she change to accommodate his expectations.

* He has a great capacity for self-deception. He projects the blame for his relationship difficulties onto his partner. He would not be drunk if she didn't nag him so much. He wouldn't get angry if only she would do what she's supposed to do. He denies the need for counseling because there's nothing wrong with him. Or he agrees to get counseling and then avoids it or makes excuses to not follow through. He might not want her to get counseling because, he reasons, she wouldn't have any problems if she only turned to him.

* He may be described as having a dual personality -- he is either charming or exceptionally cruel. He is selfish or generous depending on his mood.

* A major characteristic of abusers is their capacity to deceive others. He can be cool, calm, charming and convincing: a con man.

* The mate is usually a symbol. The abuser doesn't relate to his partner as a person in her own right, but as a symbol of a significant other. This is especially true when he's angry. He assumes that she is thinking, feeling, or acting like that significant other -- often his mother

A lot of this (except for the last one) made me question myself.

[Mr.FixIt]

Found this on the net, it fits my ex husband and the subsequent boyfriend...

If you argue with him, he says you're stubborn.
If you're quiet, he argues with you anyway.
If you call him, he says you're needy and clingy.
If he calls you, he thinks you should be grateful.
If you don't act like you love him, he'll try to win you over.
If you tell him you love him, he takes advantage of you.
If you dress sexy, he says you're a slut.
If you don't dress nice, he says you look bad.
When you don't sleep with him, he says you don't love him.
If you do sleep with him, he only does it the way he likes it.
If you tell him your problems, he says you're bothering him,
If you don't, he says you don't trust him.
If you try to bring up a problem, he says you're bitching.
If he brings up a problem, he yells.
If you break a promise, you "can't be trusted".
If he breaks it, it's because "he had to".
If you cheat, he wants to punish you by locking you up or beating you.
If he cheats, he expects to be given another chance

All of this relieved my concerns about myself!

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Mr. FixIt:
A lot of this (except for the last one) made me question myself.

And that's what makes me not question you!

I think it's more common for abusers not to question themselves on this point. If they did it would prove that they are not always right.

(Be careful about showing your soft side too much in public. Some day when you pick up a nasty looking paddle and shake it at someone all you're going to get is a giggle and a big "whoa!" lol)

ps
it was really hard to type that last comment with a straight face. :)

[Mr.FixIt]

As tempting as it is for me to boast of my paddle wielding skills right now, I will refrain from doing so, so as not to derail the thread. lol

:dont:

[slaveangel{HM}]

Found this on the net, it fits my ex husband and the subsequent boyfriend...

If you argue with him, he says you're stubborn.
If you're quiet, he argues with you anyway.
If you call him, he says you're needy and clingy.
If he calls you, he thinks you should be grateful.
If you don't act like you love him, he'll try to win you over.
If you tell him you love him, he takes advantage of you.
If you dress sexy, he says you're a slut.
If you don't dress nice, he says you look bad.
When you don't sleep with him, he says you don't love him.
If you do sleep with him, he only does it the way he likes it.
If you tell him your problems, he says you're bothering him,
If you don't, he says you don't trust him.
If you try to bring up a problem, he says you're bitching.
If he brings up a problem, he yells.
If you break a promise, you "can't be trusted".
If he breaks it, it's because "he had to".
If you cheat, he wants to punish you by locking you up or beating you.
If he cheats, he expects to be given another chance

Oh wow......sighs

[newslave]

I hate that I can't get into chat right now....I want to be in there.

[Greybeard_69]

I'd just like to start off with the fact that no woman deserves to be treated with abuse and No should be respected as No. secondly verbal and emotional abuse is as serious and sometimes more serious, as their scars and damage is easily hidden from those around them which can lead to them not getting the help they need as early as possible.

Any action between a man an a woman is consensual, if its not then its rape , assault, or any other charges that the police can bring to bare. This can never be understated or over said, nor should it be tolerated, by Dom or Sub.
This said the other point is the victim must be believed, or they don't have a chance to survive.

Too those of you that have under gone abuse, hugs an my heart goes out to you.

My mother went out with a guy, he broke her collar bone an put stitches in her head on another occasion. The funny thing was, he was one of the nicest people you could meet, from what I saw he was good to mum an my little brother. when mum showed me her stitches, I didn't want to believe her. My brother saw it but was too young and had a hearing problem that affected his speech and was hard to understand. My sister and I lived with my Dad. It also went on for 5 years untill she picked him up from his hotel room to take him to work (he had lost his license dui driving under the influence) and found him in bed with another woman. Funny how that will do it every time, Grins.

[yourlilslave86]

i have suffered from abuse i just have kept quiet and on the wall about it. I am not sure how much it will help to share my experience because i have done a lot of therapy for it and realized it isnt my fault.

my mom was in an abusive relationship with my father and left him. it ended when he started stalking her online. my mom was brave and left him when i was 15. she has grown a lot since then. i do not blame her for leaving him.

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Greybeard_69:
I'd just like to start off with the fact that no woman deserves to be treated with abuse

Maybe you didn't mean it this way Greybeard, but men and boys can be victims of abuse. And women can be abusers, as was the case for me.

Also, I would like to mention that abuse does not always have to be sexual in nature.

[Rowen]

i have suffered from abuse i just have kept quiet and on the wall about it. I am not sure how much it will help to share my experience because i have done a lot of therapy for it and realized it isnt my fault.

my mom was in an abusive relationship with my father and left him. it ended when he started stalking her online. my mom was brave and left him when i was 15. she has grown a lot since then. i do not blame her for leaving him.

Girl, sharing or not is all up to you. For some people it can help to get it of their chest - even more so if they can do it to people they won't see at work next day or at the next party. They should share.. Then there are those that prefer to keep it to themselves. They still can share, but should feel compelled to do.

Don't know the specifics of your situation, but indeed your mom was brave to leave your father, for that action you should be proud of her.
You were a kid when this happened, so you are not to blame. Never.

[Rowen]

Maybe you didn't mean it this way Greybeard, but men and boys can be victims of abuse. And women can be abusers, as was the case for me.

Also, I would like to mention that abuse does not always have to be sexual in nature.

Glad you mention this, Ashton. In fact, the "non-physical"abuse can be far more devious and devastiting. There are no easy visible signs like scars or bruises. Many times it is diguised as "upbringing" or "discipining" meanwhile terrorizing the victim with demaening and degrading remarks, or simply ignoring the victim until he or she acts as demanded.
Still wondering why some people are soooo eager to please, why some people never dare to say no, always accept even the most unfair judgements, always accept the unpopular tasks?

Worst of all, especially when parents do this (and mothers are so d*man good at it) the victim incorperates those thougts of being useless, no good, unworrthy, filthy, sinful, you name it as long as it is not positive.

This way children can become maimed for the rest of their lives without a single scar, without a single time of beating, without a single intervention or even notification by police, school or doctors. They are simply those "wierd kids" nobody understands and shouldn't complain. They should just act normal and then everything will be OK. After all, they didn't even get a single beating, their parents didn't divorce, daddy wasn't a drunk, so why should they complain?

When you meet such a "strange kid" or "wierd coworker" just think about the above before judgement

[butterflySlave4u]

Maybe you didn't mean it this way Greybeard, but men and boys can be victims of abuse. And women can be abusers, as was the case for me.

Also, I would like to mention that abuse does not always have to be sexual in nature.
this is my 5th attempt at a reply to this quote....i'll make it brief.

the comment made here by Greybeard69 was in reference to His MOTHER, hence the comment was gender specific. it was in SUPPORT of us, people, it wasn't meant to be a slight.

[ashtonDs]

Greybeard69,

I didn't take it as a slight. I seemed like a general comment and I tried to make a gentle reminder. Sorry to hear about your mom.

butterflySlave4u,

Thanks for the clarification.

[stripedangel]

We all have our touchy spots...

i'm sure that we can all understand that we all have differing circumstances. We must also try and understand that each person's perspective comes from their respective circimstances, and this isn't a thread for one type of abuse over another...

It is my practice to simply read the emotion in each post rather than the wording. Just the facts, lol. i, for one, have great difficulty articulating what i intend to convey when i am emotional, so when i post in here, it might not come out like i hope.

xxxxxxx

[crazy_grrluk]

can i just add something here.

whatever the stories remember that something might just be a "trigger" for another person... which could result is a relapse for that person

[denuseri]

wow cg thanks for bringing up triggers

dealing with "triggers" was one of the topics we discussed in the last private chat room meeting,

possible triggers for survivors have a very very wide range and vary from individual to individual based on thier own experiences with just about as many different ways of dealing with them, yet "deal" with them we must one way or another

heck a few nights ago in the lobby someone mentioned removing teeth and it provoked a deep response in myself, i had to log out and go collect myself

i am certian they had no idea that thier statement was going to effect me the way it did, it certianly wasnt thier fault i had difficulty with something like that

some triggers are so mundane to the perspective of others they are not aware of nor even begin to expect that you may be experiencing difficulty becuase of them

[Arria]

I´d like to point out that everyone can have triggers without being aware of them. Even people with no abusive background whatsoever. Or it might be something no one ever did to you before. Even if it is done by your loved one, it can be a trigger.
For a gay friend of mine, it was being slapped.
For me, it was getting spit in the face.
Sometimes you hate the triggering action so much you avoid it at all costs.
Sometimes you start to include it into very intense play sessions.
It´s your feelings and your decision.

I used to think only things which had happened to a person before, especially in an unwilling context, could turn out as triggers. It is not so.
This is for the Doms out there who happen to stumble over a trigger and feel bad about it... it´s not your fault.

[newslave]

My day is coming up....my main trigger...and I wish there was more that I could do to get it out of my head...

[denuseri]

newslave:

consentrate on your goal my sister, if this is the test you have placed before yourself, rember your duty to yourself, to thrive in your submission, your task to be strong, you have survived far worse than this, you are brave and you are loved.

rember that you are not alone, your other sisters are here for you.

hugs and kissess boo, my prayers go with you in your time of need

as allways i shall help in any way i can

[ashtonDs]

I'm dealing with some crapola right now and it's really got me down. How do some of you deal with your abuser(s)?

Several people have told me that I have to forgive my abuser. Right now I don't think it's possible. What I am trying to do is to let it go, to release it, so it doesn't rule my life like it once did.

Maybe at some point in the future I'll be able to say I forgive her. The problem is, the person she abused is a fourth grader in her classroom a long time ago. On top of that she never saw a reason to ask for forgiveness because she doesn't see what she did as wrong.

[kuriousnature]

Hello all,
I have been reading this thread for a while and am feeling compelled to share a bit of my story. For me there have been 3 major incidents. When i was younger my older brother molested me for about 3 years. i never told anyone not even my parents. Currently we have no relationship to speak of and i had completely blocked the memories until about 10 years ago. i was living in a foreign country and was raped by a friend of mine on my brithday. This person stole my virginity from me and has made what is supposed to be a very special day every year a nightmare. Unfortunately, i thought that i had found the one. He knew all of my history and before we were married he treated me like a princess. He had swept me off my feet. On the second day of the honeymoon it was like everything changed. He became very controlling. This is not a BDSM relationship. He is very jealous and quick to anger. He often will take his anger out on me. i really would like to get out of this marriage, but i trusted him and he has control over all finances etc.
i appreciate the support that is here on these boards. i am working with some friends to try and make it possible for me to be able to leave when the time is right. But i worry what will happen to me.
i want to thank all of those survivors on these boards for all of the love and understanding that they have. And thank you for creating a space to share.

[denuseri]

it is very brave of you to share your story with us, i hope all will turn out well for you

i dont know what country yu are in sis, but here there are outreach programs for battered and or abused that help wemon get away from thier abusers, yu may also consider documenting any abuse that has or is occuring for later use in legal proceedings etc,

your first consern should be your imedieate saftey, i will pray for you sis

[kuriousnature]

I am in the US and ironically i worked as a play therapist in a domestic violence agency for 6 years.

[Euryleia]

I am in the US and ironically i worked as a play therapist in a domestic violence agency for 6 years.

It is more than irony. There are plenty of people out there who are educated in domestic violence and rape who still find it happening to them. We think, "Aren't I supposed to know better? How could I get myself in that position?"

And that is exactly what they want us to do--they want us to feel that it is our fault. The blame is on them, though. No matter what we did--we never asked to be abused or raped. It doesn't matter that we smiled politely as we walked by a crowd, or stayed late at a party, or invited him in for a drink or to fix our leaking faucet. It doesn't matter if we dated or married our abuser. It doesn't matter that we sought attention from our teacher or coach or uncle. It is not our fault!

They are the abusers and it is they who have violated our trust, our bodies and our psyches.

[kuriousnature]

Many of my friends have gotten upset with me for not leaving because "i should know better". However, they do no understand what it takes to leave.. Thank you for the support and the concern, you really are all sisters in this battle, and i hope that some day your courage will rub off when the timing is right. i remind myself every morning when i am blessed to wake up that no matter what horrors the day may hold; i will be ok, i will survive, and one day i will leave..

[denuseri]

it must be a very hard thing to do for you kurious

hugggs, i hope all goes well

[newslave]

Kurious, thank you so much for sharing, and I wish you all the best. I know it can be hard to leave, but it is such an important step that you know that you should, that you can when the time is right. And it is so wonderful what you do for other women. I hope that you find a special person that can help you as you help others. Plenty of hugs to you and all the support you need!!

[Selash]

*pulls a chair into the room and sits down*

I have never been abused.. but I am here to hear, and to learn and to understand. I want to help the woman I love. I want to be her strength and her rock. I want to learn and understand everything I can, so I can be everything she needs.

Thank you all for sharing yourselves like this.. If anyone ever needs an ear, Mine is always open.


Selash.

[Kuskovian]

Wellcome to the club Selash.

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Selash:
If anyone ever needs an ear

That's the first step right there, listening with love, without judgement or accusation.

[denuseri]

Wellcome to this thread Selash, Ash couldnt have said it better. we are allways available to help you in any way, hugs and kissess

[Selash]

*offers hug to those that want them and huggles to those that need them, and a deep passionate kiss to My pup*

I would love any help that can be give to Me, and I want to freely give any help I can.

[suchaminx]

I can't believe I have missed this thread!

I would like to echo Selash - I am fortunate not to have been abused but I feel for all of you who have. I too can always listen and my pm box is open.

~hugs~ for you all

minxy x

[sisterhoney61 {RW}]

I'm dealing with some crapola right now and it's really got me down. How do some of you deal with your abuser(s)?

Several people have told me that I have to forgive my abuser. Right now I don't think it's possible. What I am trying to do is to let it go, to release it, so it doesn't rule my life like it once did.

Maybe at some point in the future I'll be able to say I forgive her. The problem is, the person she abused is a fourth grader in her classroom a long time ago. On top of that she never saw a reason to ask for forgiveness because she doesn't see what she did as wrong.

I deal with my abuser by not dealing with him. I haven't seen him in 10 years. I have no idea where he is. He could be in prison (which is very likely) or he could be six feet under (which is also very likely). But I still have nightmares about him and had one just last week in fact. I will still say something to Master that will imply that He will hurt me in some way, and He has to gently remind me that He is not my ex.

Will I ever be able to forgive him? I honestly don't know. One person that I do need to forgive is myself, because I will often think back to that marriage and tell myself what an idiot I was for marrying him and remaining in the marriage. All the red flags were there on our first date. And yet I married him anyway. My self-esteem was so low at that point that I jumped at the chance of being with him because he had paid attention to me. He went on a date with me and wanted to see me again. No one had ever done that before. I was terrified that if I wasn't with him I wouldn't have another opportunity to be with someone else. So one of these days I need to forgive that lonely young woman and remind her that she has grown since then and has learned from her mistakes. I have to remind her that she is no longer the same person she once was and now indeed has what she has always wanted: the love of a good man.

[Greybeard_69]

I don't think there is ever, "A right time to leave" one thing i noticed with my mothers situation was it wasn't the abuse that made her decide to leave but the fact that he was screwing around on her. She could explain the broken collar bone, and the stitcher's in her head and forgive him for it because "he was drunk at the time", or because "he really did love her". kuriousnature, if u have the support of your friends, then the times right. I know its a scary thing to walk out and start over. My thoughts are with you kuriousnature and I hope your safe and my thoughts are with you.

My main reasons to post here are in support of those that have and those that are going through abuse. If any thing I have posted or do posts offends or causes a triger, then I apologize as this is not my intention.

I have been through my own personal hell with abuse, It was not sexual nor was there a lot of physical abuse. It was mainly verbal and emotional abuse.
funny how it can take u 14 hours to decide if your going to post what u write.

[kuriousnature]

Selash and Greybeard,
I thank you so much for coming here and offering support to all of us. The world is a better place because there are people who care enough to stand up and speak out and support survivors.
Everyone else,
I thank you all for you support and prayers. We are at a cross roads right now and I still do not know what path I am going to take. I truely appreciate everyones patience and support.

As to the issue of forgiveness. I forgive becuase I know that I have to. I know that they people that have hurt me were in turn hurt themselves. I know that they mostly likely do not know anyother way, and while they may be hurting me, it is becuase of their past. I however do not know if i will forgive myself, or stop taking repsponsibility for their actions as my own. However I do know that every morning that I get up and make the effort to greet the day with a smile instead of tears, they have lost just one more ounce of control over me....

[denuseri]

whenever the forgiveness hurdle gets in front of me, and i know i am wrong for not wanting to forgive them, it just has to be done in my mind, i tell myself all sorts of things to try and convice myself that they , all people deserve forgiveness,, sometimes i succeed and sometimes i fail,, i dont think i will ever be able to completely forgive them because it allways feels like i havent, every time i rember part of what they did too me, it starts all over again

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Greybeard_69:
funny how it can take u 14 hours to decide if your going to post what u write.

wow...sometimes it only takes you 14 hours?

I have taken a long time to post. There have been times when I deleted everything I typed and logged out, only to do the same thing the next day.

I have heard some people say "it shouldn't be so difficult. it's the internet. It's not like someone is in the room with you."

The difficulty isn't in that someone is or isn't in the room, it's in sharing details about hard times in your life, for some of us terrifying times. And the people here on this thread are not just names on a screen, After all that we have shared, there are stories attached to those names, and hopes and dreams. There are people attached to those names.

I think it would be safe to say many of us have done the same thing, sometimes more than once.


Originally posted by Greybeard_69:
I have been through my own personal hell with abuse, It was not sexual nor was there a lot of physical abuse. It was mainly verbal and emotional abuse.

I can't let this pass without comment. Please don't trivialize what happened because it was only verbal and/or emotional. It is what it is...abuse.

In my opinion, one of the reasons people have more trouble with verbal and emotional abuse is they think to themselves (as well as being told this by others) "at least I wasn't beaten. I never landed in a hospital. What do I have to complain about?"

By trivializing it they ignore what happened and blame themselves when they can't handle it. They don't deal with it and it comes back and deals with them. Self blame keeps the wound fresh and bleeding. It is the abuse that keeps on abusing.

It is difficult, but come here for you too.

I know how it is to have been verbally and emotionally abused. It happened to me, and kept me messed up for years. One day, after finally telling my therapist about it, she said. "Oh my God, that's child abuse. You were abused. Why didn't you tell me about this before? We should have been working on this all along."

This was knowledge I couldn't handle, so I rejected it outright. "Me, abused? Abuse only happens to other people." Now, many years later, I have to admit that it is abuse. Otherwise I can't heal.

A bdsm forum was the last place I would have ever thought to find healing, but I have. I shared some scary stuff, and totally surprised myself when I said something useful to someone.

(I even told myself once, I need to go through here and read all my postings, because I need to hear and do what I'm suggesting to other people.)

Remember, come here for you.


Originally posted by denuseri:
whenever the forgiveness hurdle gets in front of me, and i know i am wrong for not wanting to forgive them

denu, it might not be a question of not wanting to, but one of being able too. There is still so much emotion wrapped up in what happened to you I don't think it's the right time yet. It's not possible.

What I am trying to do is let go of my abuse, to release it and allow it to become detached from me. When I can look at it without all the emotion, the fear, the horror, the hate, then maybe I will be able to turn around and forgive.

Some people find it helpful to meditate on the letting go. They picture how their life would be if they could look at the abuse and acknowledge it the same way they look at their car. "I have a blue car" -fact. "I was abused" -fact. It is impossible for some to forgive while the wound still bleeds.

You are not wrong, you,re just not ready yet. ~hugs denu~

[denuseri]

Thanku so much for that Ash i think it reallu helped me,,,huggggggs

[Kuskovian]

Call me a throw back, but it is against my nature to "forgive" any animal that has done the things they have done to my girl. I will burn in the depths before I do.

There are things that don't deserve to be forgiven.

This does not mean you need hold onto your rage, for the soul that eats only hate cannot thrive.

Trancend what has happened, grow again with love for each other, for you have survived like the trees of a long winters embrace.

[gemmy]

Call me a throw back, but it is against my nature to "forgive" any animal that has done the things they have done to my girl. I will burn in the depths before I do.

There are things that don't deserve to be forgiven.

This does not mean you need hold onto your rage, for the soul that eats only hate cannot thrive.

Trancend what has happened, grow again with love for each other, for you have survived like the trees of a long winters embrace.

I couldn't agree more!!


denu, it might not be a question of not wanting to, but one of being able too. There is still so much emotion wrapped up in what happened to you I don't think it's the right time yet. It's not possible.

What I am trying to do is let go of my abuse, to release it and allow it to become detached from me. When I can look at it without all the emotion, the fear, the horror, the hate, then maybe I will be able to turn around and forgive.

Some people find it helpful to meditate on the letting go. They picture how their life would be if they could look at the abuse and acknowledge it the same way they look at their car. "I have a blue car" -fact. "I was abused" -fact. It is impossible for some to forgive while the wound still bleeds.

You are not wrong, you,re just not ready yet. ~hugs denu~

Sorry ash but I don't believe all people Should be forgiven and as Kuskovian says, some animals don't deserve it.

I neither can forget nor will ever forgive what my tormentors did to me over Several years. They knew what they were doing. They weren't mentally ill or sick in any way. They did it simply because they could. I would happily see them rot in hell and will dance on their pathetic graves when they finally die. That whole what goes around comes around bs everyone talks about - to me is just a way to self soothe. These people tormented, tortured, raped not only me but other children that came around as well and others throughout the course of their lives - They are still living to a nice, ripe, healthy old age. That's what goes around - abusers will always have the upper hand and all we can do is try to distance ourselves from it, that's all I think anyone can do really.

Even if you do get the satisfaction of bringing them before the authorities (having fully humliated yourself in front of random strangers probing your every sexual thought and motive - yes, I did go this route and lost after being further humiliated); what does it get you? Are you then going to forgive them? No, you are no farther ahead and just back to putting distance between you and them, physically, emotionally and mentally.

*the 'you' in the above statements is just a general term and not personally pointed to anyone, thank you*

[Selash]

*strikes fist to chest*

I am not a vindictive Man. But, abusers Piss Me right the Hell Off... Few have ever seen Me enraged... the couple that had where quoted as say it was the "sacriest thing they have ever seen"... Anyone who thinks they have the right to abuse, in anyway, Shall have thier heads on a pike in My front yard, after I burn their home and salt thier land. Forgive mistakes, forgive wrongdoings, forgive a moment of weakness. Abuse shall not be tolerated, forgiven, marginallized or whitewashed.


*returns to My chair and lets the dark clouds gather, gently holding the hand of the woman I love most in the world*

[newslave]

I feel strange sometimes...because I have no rage against the things that happened to me. Instead I feel a deep sadness, an internal sadness, somthing that cuts me up but doesn't let me get mad at the people who have doen it to me. I don't know why but...I guess I wonder if other people feel the same.

[denuseri]

very much so my sister

very much so

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by mastersgem:
Sorry ash but I don't believe all people Should be forgiven

No need to apologise.

I spoke of forgiveness because that is what denu spoke about. For some people forgiving is part of letting go. If she wants to forgive, who am I to tell her she is wrong.

This is something I struggle with in my own abuse. Forgiveness is something I have tried in the past, and as many times as I've given it, I have taken it back just as many.

So for many years I thought I couldn't forgive. In fact I went totally the other way with my feelings of hatred growing. It really ate away at me.

One thing that hatred did give me was a feeling of power. That powerful hate fueled all kinds of fantasies which became darker and darker over time. I got to the point where I became depressed and fixated on the hate. It got so bad I began living inside of a fantasy that described in great detail everything I wanted to do to the woman that abused me.

It was just like walking around in my own story. The lines between reality and fantasy became so blurred that I ran from the police when, in the real world, they were not after me. In my fantasy they had found me out, so I ran.

That was scary but I didn't pull back until I became suicidal. Then I realized I couldn't hold the hate. Forgiving wasn't working and neither was ignoring it (had a nasty habit of popping back up all the time), but then neither was holding on to the hate.

Shortly after that I remembered reading an article about letting go. There is no judgement, no counting the cost in it. We acknowledge what happened, and that it happened to us, and release it. In the releasing the event has no further control over us. It happened, and we acknowledge that, but do not allow it into our lives.

It cannot eat at us that way. We move on with life. In letting hate control us, we ultimately allow our abusers to continue influence over us. To be absolutely free of them we have to find a place where we can let go.

If denu wants to take the next step to forgiveness I will never discourage her. She has a beautiful heart. If it is something she needs to do, I will not stand in her way or discourage her in any way.

As an interesting aside, I read an article once where a victim forgave her victimizer in open court. She told him she could not hold on to hate and had to let it go. She that she cannot let the event in question rule her life.

She also acknowledged that she knew her attacker would stew over it, and continue to think about it, but she was not going to let him rule her life any longer.

Her attacker was shocked. During the trial he had been leering at her every chance he got and reveled in that fact that his attention was discomforting to her. Now he was relegated to the status of a nobody. She was going to go on with her life free of him, but allow him no more control over her.

He shouted and yelled obscenities at her trying to get a reaction, all to no avail. All those years in prison he was going to spend as a nobody, and he was going to prison for a very long time.


gem, maybe you just are not ready to let go, or forgive, your wound is still bleeding.

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by newslave:
I feel strange sometimes...because I have no rage against the things that happened to me. Instead I feel a deep sadness, an internal sadness, somthing that cuts me up but doesn't let me get mad at the people who have doen it to me. I don't know why but...I guess I wonder if other people feel the same.

It seems you have let go.

[Rowen]

I feel strange sometimes...because I have no rage against the things that happened to me. Instead I feel a deep sadness, an internal sadness, somthing that cuts me up but doesn't let me get mad at the people who have doen it to me. I don't know why but...I guess I wonder if other people feel the same.

Still doubt if posting this is a good idea, but can relate more to this than I want to. Don’t know why, but the sadness always dominates the anger. Perhaps so because that anger can be so frightening, thinking about the consequences when I would have let that anger out, directed at those who did deserve it.
It would have meant an other family tragedy no doubt – the other bullies being out of sight already thus preventing a school drama as well.
Until now found comfort in the thought that I was able to forgive those I still see – them being next of kin. In fact proud of the fact that for one of them I somewhat take care, be it from a distance with help from psychiatric day-treatment. And supporting the other now there’s a chance serious illness has struck. Afraid I don’t make sense here at all..what I am trying to say is that I was convinced I had worked things out, until now. Even considered myself lucky for the good things I learned from it, in fact being a benefit in my work and amongst my friends.

Now, once more, I realise that so many of my praised traits are the remnants of that past. It was my way of survival for all those years, making sure I sensed what was wrong even before they knew it themselves, comfort them when things had gone out of hand again, consulted them, meanwhile taking care to properly finish my education thus securing their pride and my way out – even if home was havoc again by simply ignoring your own needs, denying your feelings. It was the only way for the youngest in a small, isolated family.

No doubt it is the basis for that submissive part in me, longing to please, to care, able to devotion and loyalty “above and beyond” indeed…but longing for security, guidance and acceptance as well – still after all those years.
No doubt it will contribute to that dominant part, at its best during a crisis, specialized in not showing any weakness, doubt or fear whatsoever, being on guard, demonstrating strength all the time, guarding people, guiding people – meanwhile battling again in my head. Once again, excellent qualities, highly appreciated, but they have come at price.

No doubt there is truth in the explanation my therapists gave me for that longing for bondage & control I have from my early childhood – contributing to that feeling different, weird, alone. Take the pain away from a situation and replace it whit lust, joy and trust, escape in that fantasy from the real world that was so relentlessly cruel.
And yes, it worked…like medication, alcohol or drugs work for other people…I managed to survive, get an university degree, haven’t hurt a single soul on purpose all my life, didn't raise the hammer.. At a considerable price though, namely the relationship with the former love of my life and an almost constant fight with myself, so desperate to be "normal" at least for her in our relationship, even if at first she liked it as well. Both were battles never meant to be fought, lost before they begun, something only now at the end I understand

I always want to show people that whatever happened, you can and will survive, that good can come from evil, that forgiveness can, perhaps should beat the anger, that your live needn’t be ruled from your past. Many times it works…for others..for my patients for sure. But last weeks I simply can’t help hurting like hell while an unknown peace of mind swaps places whit havoc in my head. So I’ am venting here…indeed bleeding here. Because somehow it helps, it is therapeutic for me, even if it prevents me from wise ramblings this time..making me way behind with other tasks in real life. Can’t help it, my mind is still here, and believe me, some anger as well, but the sadness, the grief rules.

However, I will get over it. Always have and always will. And I will come to terms wiht myself..in my own way..someday..at my Island...

[Kuskovian]

Take what comfort you can from us then Rowen.

We are here to help you.

I may only be what they call a "secondary" survivor, but I have been with Seri every step of the way and have seen her relapse many many times.

The way is sometimes hard and steep.

It may seem that you will never reach the sumit.

Yet one can allways see the hope bound in the sun capped peak ahead if one chooses to look.

[Rowen]

One thing that hatred did give me was a feeling of power. That powerful hate fueled all kinds of fantasies which became darker and darker over time. .
.

Yes, indeed it gives you an uncanning feeling of power...I could see it right for my eyes. In every detail. In fact, I ran TO the police, scared to hell I would take matters in my own hands. The only thing those idiots did was ask what I expected from them, then telling me there was nothing they could do..

It's that feeling of power that scared the hell out of me when I was dominating...much more like the "gently guy" even if that means submitting.

[Rowen]

Take what comfort you can from us then Rowen.

We are here to help you.

I may only be what they call a "secondary" survivor, but I have been with Seri every step of the way and have seen her relapse many many times.

The way is sometimes hard and steep.

It may seem that you will never reach the sumit.

Yet one can allways see the hope bound in the sun capped peak ahead if one chooses to look.

Thanks,

I did have second thougts on this post...you know, wanting to be the supportive strong guy. So many people hurting here already...but yes, I really appreciate the support and help here...is the reason I stayed on the net.

[thrall]

Rowen....

I haven't read the entire thread, only the last page of posts. And yes i saw your post before you deleted it. ...


What i am seeing is the problem dealing with the ...."negative" emotions....


Anger......hate.....aggression.....fear. All of the things that are ingrained in us as things we should not feel.....should not act on.....should not use......should not acknowledge......and are BAD BAD BAD BAD....


You are allowed to be angry about what happened to you.....use the anger to your advantage...you earned it.......let the rest go. You DO NOT need to attribute your strength to them......it is yours and yours alone.


You are allowed to hate the people who harmed and hurt you.....and never feel guilty saying it......you do NOT have to like them or even interact with them.


You feel its wrong to lash our with painful emotions...it is not....you just need to channel where the lash falls.......


You are allowed to feel fear.....the fear that you have now somehow been made unlovable.....yes you may fear this....but you are very lovable.....


We feel how we feel. These emotions should never be denied you. These feeling should never be discounted by others as something you .."should not feel"... If you feel it, you feel it. It is neither good nor bad



I call the collective of these emotions.....the beast. The beast the waits inside. Its there always within us...


I have a very large beast and its powerful and strong......it waits....it watches....and it protects me.....it is part of me and i do not deny its existence....nor will i try to kill it. It to has a right to live....

but that being said.....


That beast wears MY collar.....and is on MY leash. I control the beast......the beast does not control me......

[denuseri]

wow Thrall that was very very wonderfully put,,, gave me a lot to think about

hugggs and thanku

[thrall]

wow Thrall that was very very wonderfully put,,, gave me a lot to think about

hugggs and thanku

Hugs Denu.....i believe you hold the collar of your beast........

[Euryleia]

Well put, thrall.

It reminds me of a Cherokee story:

An old Grandfather said to his grandson, who came to him with anger at a friend who had done him an injustice, "Let me tell you a story.

I too, at times, have felt a great hate for those that have taken so much, with no sorrow for what they do.

But hate wears you down, and does not hurt your enemy. It is like taking poison and wishing your enemy would die. I have struggled with these feelings many times." He continued, "It is as if there are two wolves inside me. One is good and does no harm. He lives in harmony with all around him, and does not take offense when no offense was intended. He will only fight when it is right to do so, and in the right way.

But the other wolf, ah! He is full of anger. The littlest thing will set him into a fit of temper. He fights everyone, all the time, for no reason. He cannot think because his anger and hate are so great. It is helpless anger,for his anger will change nothing.

Sometimes, it is hard to live with these two wolves inside me, for both of them try to dominate my spirit."

The boy looked intently into his Grandfather's eyes and asked, "Which one wins, Grandfather?"

The Grandfather smiled and quietly said, "The one I feed."

[thrall]

HHmm.......yes......the one that lives is the one.......that I feed......

i like that Euryleia

[denuseri]

simply awsome wisdom there Euryleia

[Rowen]

thrall, whising I had your gift with words to express my gratitude. Indeed it is all about emotions..but also actions and expectations, obligations.
Euryleia, you fountain of wise quotations and lines, thanks, point taken. You have no idea how adequate that comparison is.

The problem is...I am talking about my brother and my mother, my father being dead for years now.
I really really thougt I had made my peace with "it" and with them. And they try in their way, in fact being victims as well.

The problem is...that I can't use my anger to those who in fact deserve, I can't hurt my family, I can't hurt those bullies from school who no doubt have forgotten all about it.
Indeed I am still scared to lash out..because the unlucky reciever will have many bills settled. Been told I can literally cut someone to pieces in anger, even if it is only verbal.
The problem is..that at times I feel guilty for not using that power.

The problem is...that at one hand I am so glad about what's happening, me finally stopping the fight in myself, accepting who I am, what I need, what I have to offer. But unable to share this with even the best friends, and still having to fear the opinion of those just waiting for a chance to have their pick on me - because of the work I do.

There is the grief of years wasted in a battle that never should have been fought, the irony being that what caused my needs also caused my moral problems with it. And yes, there is that fear of losing it all...after all those years.. The fear of staying that lone rider, hiding in strength and isolation.

I will add the original post..there is nothing to be ashamed about. And believe me, I know what wolf I want to feed..but for now it is a very sad and lonely wolf. Thank you all, thank you so much..

[thrall]

thrall, whising I had your gift with words to express my gratitude. Indeed it is all about emotions..but also actions and expectations, obligations.
Euryleia, you fountain of wise quotations and lines, thanks, point taken. You have no idea how adequate that comparison is.

The problem is...I am talking about my brother and my mother, my father being dead for years now.
I really really thougt I had made my peace with "it" and with them. And they try in their way, in fact being victims as well.

The problem is...that I can't use my anger to those who in fact deserve, I can't hurt my family, I can't hurt those bullies from school who no doubt have forgotten all about it.
Indeed I am still scared to lash out..because the unlucky reciever will have many bills settled. Been told I can literally cut someone to pieces in anger, even if it is only verbal.

The problem is...that at one hand I am so glad about what's happening, me finally stopping the fight in myself, accepting who I am, what I need, what I have to offer. But unable to share this with even the best friends, and still having to fear the opinion of those just waiting for a chance to have their pick on me - because of the work I do.

There is the grief of years wasted in a battle that never should have been fought, the irony being that what caused my needs also caused my moral problems with it. And yes, there is that fear of losing it all...after all those years.. The fear of staying that lone rider, hiding in strength and isolation.

I will add the original post..there is nothing to be ashamed about. And it did help. Thank you all, thank you so much..


Ok...i may take loads of heat for the...but......oh well

It is alright ot HATE your mother

It is alright to HATE your brother

It is alright to HATE your father....even if he is dead...being dead does not absolve him of anything.

I don't care if they "were victims themselves".......it they victimized you......that made them perpetrators......abusers! There is no excuse......and as "victims" themselves......they should know better.....

You do not have to say your piece......with anger........but matter of factually

Use "I" words.......this is how "I" feel....this is what "I" think....this is what was done to......."ME"

SAY THE .........."IT".......say what "IT".....IS.....

And ya know what Rowen..if they dont like it......to damn bad! The brutal truth.....sometimes hurts.....very badly.

OK.....so you say cant hurt you family.....but you also realize that they are toxic to and for you.....stop talking and interacting with them.......There is no law that says that you must.


I am a loner....my friends are loners....we just happen to like being alone....together.......

[Rowen]

Am afraid I will regret this. But..did hate them, in fact broke contact for five years with mother. During the breaking up with my GF however they did really try to support, as far as possible for them.

The IT...boy..the IT is I wasn't supposed to be born, was always considered the dumb, wierd kid, always ridiculed, degraded and belittled. Until 12 it was round a clock bully and harassment time. Luckily after that, at an other school, school was in fact my safe haven....me being that somewhat strange, but unconditional loyal and supportive kid - my character emerging - always the one to bring you home, always the one covering up for you.
The IT was my elder brother having his sexual way with me, to some degree, at which times I was also tied up - hence the huge moral conflict in my brain meanwhile being in doubt about my sexual orientation for years.
The IT was my parents living like seperated people under one roof..the last 10 years not even in the same bedroom...
The IT was the agression at home, mainly from my brother, causing me to consider really drastic solutions..because every time police came...and went...and nothing changed.
The IT was that whatever I wanted or did, it never mattered anyway.
The IT was the three of them seperately crying on my shoulder, having me do the negotiations to get the family going again.
The IT was that still somehow, everything always was my fault.
The other IT was life itself, every G@ddamn single time taking away something I started to cherish or thougt I had achieved.
The IT was that allthough appreciated and respected, I always have been that stranger. the one daring to make the politcal uncorrect but true statements.

And I did hate them. And I was so glad to be away. And I was so damn happy with my love, even gave up the dream of leaving my country for it. Then again, I couldn't help caring for them, forgiving them..it simply is what and who I am.

I can't help it, I do not want to hate...not them, not mankind..no matter what's done to me. I so do want to love...but people do make that so hard at times..

I can't find the right words to put the finger on the spot..being so tired..spending all day here, thinking, typing, crying....healing..but it has something to do with the realisation that the scars are in fact deeper and longer lasting than I thought. But also that indeed I wish I had done what I am doing right now years before. Knowing that my submission indeed was an old need to meet.

And yes, I am a loner...a bit tired of all those girls telling me what a kind and honest man I am but....the bosses telling me just what a good guy I am but... So yes, I prefer the few good friends. And yes, really am reconsidering my future. But there is that longing for that companion on the journey..one that loves for just who I am and what I do, be it as her caring dom, be it as her devoted submissive, always there to care for her.

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Rowen:
The problem is...I am talking about my brother and my mother, my father being dead for years now.
I really really thougt I had made my peace with "it" and with them. And they try in their way, in fact being victims as well.

The problem is...that I can't use my anger to those who in fact deserve, I can't hurt my family, I can't hurt those bullies from school who no doubt have forgotten all about it.
Indeed I am still scared to lash out..because the unlucky reciever will have many bills settled. Been told I can literally cut someone to pieces in anger, even if it is only verbal.
The problem is..that at times I feel guilty for not using that power.

The problem is...that at one hand I am so glad about what's happening, me finally stopping the fight in myself, accepting who I am, what I need, what I have to offer. But unable to share this with even the best friends, and still having to fear the opinion of those just waiting for a chance to have their pick on me - because of the work I do.

There is the grief of years wasted in a battle that never should have been fought, the irony being that what caused my needs also caused my moral problems with it. And yes, there is that fear of losing it all...after all those years.. The fear of staying that lone rider, hiding in strength and isolation.

I will add the original post..there is nothing to be ashamed about. And believe me, I know what wolf I want to feed..but for now it is a very sad and lonely wolf. Thank you all, thank you so much..

Rowen dammit, I couldn't respond to this right away because it made me cry my eyes out. Everything is blurry with tears.

How do I start? My father, while not an abuser enabled my abuse to occur. He could have taken me out of the school where it was happening but he didn't. Also, while not abusive, he is highly critical and it seems at times he considers it his right to stay that way. "That is how I was brought up. That is the way I learned," is what he says whenever I say something about it.

While I hated my abuser, it's difficult with my dad. I have gotten to a place where I hate how he acts and what he says, but for him personally I only feel a deep gut wrenching sadness.

I told him once that at this time in my life I would just like to sit with my him and talk about life. Maybe gain a pearl of wisdom or two. You probably know how he responded, "That is how I was..." Sometimes I want to shout, "Oh just shut the fuck up! You just don't get it!"

It is doubly hard when it is your family. With someone on the outside you can indulge in a really violent fantasy and it offers some relief. With family it only offers guilt.

Like Grandfather said in the story, "hate wears you down, and does not hurt your enemy. It is like taking poison and wishing your enemy would die. I have struggled with these feelings many times."

Sometimes though, hate can cause you to move. It can become such a drain that you must move on.

The beginning of my true healing from my abuse began with the story I told below. I indulged the anger, almost losing my sanity in the process, but it worked for me.

After the episode where I lived in my fantasy, I wrote a poem about fantasizing climbing in the window of the place where my abusive teacher lived and painting the room red with her blood.

I is a rather good poem actually. Nowhere does it say explicitly that the main character carves up his victim, but there is no question what happened. Then I did a series of paintings about my experiences.

Since then I have not been able to get to the same place of anger and hate. I've exhausted it, and me.

Soon, I will be able to let go. The wound still bleeds, just not so freely anymore.

You will reach that place too.

[thrall]

Well Ashton and Rowen......how did that feel to actually...........say..."it"...

big hugs.......

[Rowen]

Well Ashton and Rowen......how did that feel to actually...........say..."it"...

big hugs.......

Actually, I have told it before, at therapy, to my GF - who didn't ran away and let me lay down my head in her lap.
Tried to tell it to some extent to my family, and they do understand it to some degree.
That's why I am so surprised and confused...I really really thougt I was done with it.

Perhaps it is the realisation why I in fact did submit..in combination with problems at work and the possible disease of my brother (he may or may not have cancer at the moment)

However...as exhausting as these days are...they are healing..even if it's 0317 over here right now.

And once again thrall, thanks..if we ever make it over that ocean....

[thrall]

The IT...boy..the IT is I wasn't supposed to be born, was always considered the dumb, wierd kid, always ridiculed, degraded and belittled. Until 12 it was round a clock bully and harassment time. Luckily after that, at an other school, school was in fact my safe haven....me being that somewhat strange, but unconditional loyal and supportive kid - my character emerging - always the one to bring you home, always the one covering up for you.

Not your fault Rowen.....your parents fault. You had no choice being born.....and your parents did not protect you


The IT was my elder brother having his sexual way with me, to some degree, at which times I was also tied up - hence the huge moral conflict in my brain meanwhile being in doubt about my sexual orientation for years.

Not your fault Rowen...its your brothers fault.....IMO he is rapist plain and simple.


The IT was my parents living like seperated people under one roof..the last 10 years not even in the same bedroom...

Not your fault. Rowen.....Its you parents fault. My guess, sadly, is that think they were staying together for the sake of the children.......even so.....that is their relationship...


The IT was the agression at home, mainly from my brother, causing me to consider really drastic solutions..because every time police came...and went...and nothing changed.

Yes and sadly im sure that i know the considered solution to the ending of your pain.....


The IT was that whatever I wanted or did, it never mattered anyway.

And how old were you Rowen??...You were under their control.......so again....not your fault



The IT was the three of them seperately crying on my shoulder, having me do the negotiations to get the family going again.

User's to the end weren't they?...using you for support...and never offering support in return......toxic relationships......hugs......their fault...not yours.



The IT was that still somehow, everything always was my fault.

Not your fault Rowen. You wanted their love and approval.....and i think you still do.....its easier to deal with the pain....if everything is YOUR OWN FAULT...taking all of the painful blame for yourself.......if you do not BLAME THEM.....than somehow.......they may love you because you do NOT point the finger of blame at them.....



The other IT was life itself, every G@ddamn single time taking away something I started to cherish or thougt I had achieved.

that is life Rowen..it moves and changes ......in a blink of an eye.....life is not out to get you......life gives and takes from us all....you are not alone..hugs



The IT was that allthough appreciated and respected, I always have been that stranger. the one daring to make the politcal uncorrect but true statements.


I understand and know how you feel.........it is their loss not yours.....you are still looking for approval and acceptance.....the question is....do you really need it??.....

I approve of you and accept you for who and what you are......big hugs.....



And just as you fathers death does not absolve him......nor does your brothers possible illness........absolve him of raping you as a child.....I know he may need and want your support now.......but does he....deserve it???......i think not.


The thing is Rowen i think you still do hate them....you may not want to admit it.....because "its wrong to hate....and you cant hate your family"...

You were happy when you cut contact form the toxic influences.....and were able to deal with you anger/hate issues.......think about that Rowen.....

Now they are back.....your mother and brother.....both again looking to you for support.....and all the old feelings are back.




t

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by thrall:
Well Ashton and Rowen......how did that feel to actually...........say..."it"...

big hugs.......

thrall, saying "it" is very different when you realize...it's not your fault.

You seem to be more knowledgeable in this than the average observer...experience?

thanks and hug hugs back to you.......

[thrall]

thrall, saying "it" is very different when you realize...it's not your fault.

You seem to be more knowledgeable in this than the average observer...experience?

thanks and hug hugs back to you.......


short answer...........what do you think?

[Rowen]

short answer...........what do you think?

I am sure...and think I do understand "that look" now. Yes, you know what you're talking about. Making my hug even bigger!

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by thrall:
short answer...........what do you think?

Hang on, gotta find someone really short. I'll get back to you. lol

I think I already knew, it was just waaaaay past my bedtime and I was having a hard time staying awake.

[Rowen]

Looking back all day, wanting to post an answer here. Gratefull again for the support here..and thrall, once again you bring comfort and peace.
Thrall, no doubt you know and you feel what this is about. I will PM you cos I think I am getting a bit too personal here.
Can you believe that my first reaction was to defend them – again? Pointing out how they try to make it up, telling how I really have forgiven them. Honest.


Looking back at the posts I am sorry about almost hijacking this thread, still a bit worried about posting this all. Really started the weekend with other intentions, am way behind with work now. But it’s worth it.

Because, mailing with Pertez we realised we are a remarkable bunch…Yes indeed, birds of a feather flock together…and I am beginning to like my feathers. But..have to shift down a bit, can’t keep on spending whole weekends over here.. So dear members, I must try to reduce my time here..even if I don’t want to..
Meanwhile my big thanks here to everyone

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Rowen:
Looking back at the posts I am sorry about almost hijacking this thread, still a bit worried about posting this all.

Rowen, that's why this thread is here. Even though you feel as if you dumped a large load, and maybe you did, it got me to take a couple more steps in my own recovery. There is no way to tell how many people read what you shared and found answers to questions or gained strength from your experiences.

This thread exists to get people talking about recovering from their abuse. You used it well.

[newslave]

Your strength gives us strength, Rowan, and the same for every single person who posts on this thread. It helps to listen...for us to know that it is ok to speak out. I appreciate all of the stories I read here because I know that I'm not alone and know that it is ok to talk about the things that have happened so that I can deal with the feelings that churn inside of me. Please share...anything...

[Rowen]

Hmmm...couldn't stay now could I...
Thanks new, in fact it started a bit in our PM's, and reading the thread again..'twere your remarks that triggered me..big time..then thrall, as always, speaking the right words at the right time in the right way - just how does she do that?
In fact it was a surrender, submission....what am I writing now???? wowww..realistation strikes...*G*... Thanks again....for taking the fight away, even if it is for this moment...and now you mention it...there is a strength in surrender...must think about that..

[thrall]

Can you believe that my first reaction was to defend them – again? Pointing out how they try to make it up, telling how I really have forgiven them. Honest.


Yes i believe it. If you defend them ....it may not really be their fault..but yours...right? Were you a bit annoyed that i had the audacity to say something bad about them??...And you wanted to tell me how good they are???......Are you defending the mental image of what you want them to be....or truly what they are?

One of the biggest tricks abusers and molesters have is that they are very good seducers and manipulates.....its how they control.....

They will seduce you into thinking and feeling whatever suits their own ends.....From what you say...it appears to me that they "need" you now....of course they want you to think that they have "made it all up to you".....they will try and convince you that you have indeed "forgiven" them....

I would lay down good money..... that they also know that you would do anything for their love and approval.....

Its emotional blackmail.......its how they keep you silent.






Thanks again....for taking the fight away, even if it is for this moment...and now you mention it...there is a strength in surrender...must think about that..



I don't think it is so much as we took the fight away from you Rowen...more like you are letting the fight go...

Here is something else i want you to think about....

You are hiding in the light when the only thing anyone sees is the smile that hides the pain. When you are asked...."are you alright..is everything OK"....and the inevitable answer is..........a resounding......"Yes I'm just fine,thank you".....along with a great big smile.....

You whisper your pain into the darkness.....you scream it.....that way no one can see.....

Your truth is here Rowen...for anyone who can see.....This is where you can say the "it".......and not be judged for anything......saying the "it" to a therapist is vastly different than saying "it" in public......Cathartic isn't it?


I have not gone though this thread.....but i believe it is to stop the flow of blood.......it is to support all those who need it in terms of past abuse.......and it would appear that you did need just that.......support.....and at this moment......in public. That is why you asked me here to look at your post......


Big hugs
t

[claire]

I am incredibly touched by what I see happening in this thread. I had already figured out this is a safe place with incredibly understanding and kind people. The support I see is unlike any I've seen any where else. So any brave people telling their stories, sharing their wisdom and their pain. Growing and healing bit by bit.

One of these days soon I will tell my story. It pales in comparison to most, but that is consistent with my life where nothing was ever good enough. I even feel my abuse wasn't good enough/bad enough to have wounded me to the degree I feel it has. intellectually I know that is hogwash, but my heart tells me it is so.

denuseri, bless you for starting this thread, and bless each and everyone of you who has contributed to it.

[Euryleia]

One of these days soon I will tell my story. It pales in comparison to most, but that is consistent with my life where nothing was ever good enough. I even feel my abuse wasn't good enough/bad enough to have wounded me to the degree I feel it has. intellectually I know that is hogwash, but my heart tells me it is so.

Claire, don't worry about what other's might think of your story. This is a safe space and there is no hierarchy of abuse to compete for who had the worst experience. Our damage is our own. What is important is how it affects you and that you survived.

I am glad that this thread has helped you and I hope that you can find the support you need. Whether or not you ever share your story, we are here for you.

[denuseri]

claire

abuse is abuse period mental physical spiritual or other it doesnt matter

nothing says anyone has to post here eiather, no one should ever do anything they arent comfortable with, i know several that stay out of the light because they are not ready and thats fine,, heck i have been a member since last october and other than a breakdown in chat one nite, i didnt post till recently, its very hard to do, and one should be ready inside first

this all about helping each other

hugs and kisses my sista

[Rowen]

Hello you all, have been online, but actually on phone all evening. Have to go to bed now, but read the post, the PM's. Thank you all so much. Will post later this week...have had a talk to my mother...and it was....different...

[Rowen]

OK..so..once again awake way too late…but want to share again..some good news I think this time.

Although unintended, spoke to my mother on the fone, for hours. Told her that even if I thought I was over it, I simply wasn’t and perhaps never will be. Had talked to her psychiatrist and told her that also…despite my wishes, the scars simply are to deep.
It was ambivalent….one the one hand mother aknowledged that they did hurt me badly and that is was wrong to do so. On the other hand her focusing on her own misery, telling she would give her life to make it right and accepting me not visiting her as her punishment…now that I didn’t like…didn’t like at all…felt like being manipulated all over again.
I explained that my keeping contact limited wasn’t punishment, that her dying wouldn’t change what happened..it’s just a fact that I simply hurt too much and still am angry…That’s all..I am not aiming to hurt her…that wouldn’t change what happened either. That felt relieved…

Also spoke my brother…now that’s more difficult. He is stll more or less denying, even though 2 years ago for the first time he didn’t deny that something did happen…and I thought, I so whished..I had forgiven him… I will have to prepare that “coming out” because otherwise I will end up feeling guilty again. Also..there are his kids…some of them rather fond of that nice uncle..and he did try to support me during my break up…looks like he is longing to have a brother…so that’s difficult.

Spoke to my ex on Sunday evening. We still have a bond. I talked about what’s going on, and the support I had found here..and she was so glad about that! Both had a good cry, especially when she heard some of the support here. She supports my “coming out” all the way..both the abuse history as bdsm being a part of me. That’s wonderfull

Actually had a good day at work, even if I didn’t sleep the whole weekend…talked again with my boss…and she told me she in was worried about me the last time…thinking I was hurting like hell. Well, indeed I was. But even more important to me..several people made it quite clear just how they appreciate my unorthodox but passionate way of work. Would consider it a huge loss if I would leave…respect and encourage that I take some time for myself….glad when I told them I am starting to like my feathers..will be going my way…and that the patients can and will benefit from it, exactly because I am different, I am that stranger that see and says things other people don’t… They liked that..told me I looked more at peace..That’s good – even if I didn’t tell I learned so much on a bdsm-site, lol!!

What in fact I am saying is…yes….it was cathartic as thrall puts it….it’s almost like submitting, but then to myself…feeling safe to do so here..for all you to see..it did so well...
Even if in fact I am exhausted by the short nights,..it is working wonders for me. There still is a lot to do, but this weekend a major achievement was made. Thanks to you all…and to those around here..hurting, doubting whether or not to come out with theis story I can only say: please do, you will learn that the people around here pull out that fuzzy blanket, wrap it around you, and just listen…you can cry, you may rant, it’s ok, you are ok…you're safe here, they won’t prod you, they won't hurt you, only gently ask and by doing so help you to say what must be said….and when you look back at that thread…you will feel an uncanning relieve...



I will give this thread back to you..but will never ever forget what happened here...

[yourlilslave86]

claire, like yourself....i wish share my story here one day.....

(((Rowen)))) just because

[Rowen]

claire, like yourself....i wish share my story here one day.....

(((Rowen)))) just because

I'll keep that fuzzy blanket in reach... choose your own time...but then...let it just happen..

[Selash]

*sneaks over and hugs Rowan* I'm proud of you, friend. Most proud.

[Rowen]

I am incredibly touched by what I see happening in this thread. I had already figured out this is a safe place with incredibly understanding and kind people. The support I see is unlike any I've seen any where else. So any brave people telling their stories, sharing their wisdom and their pain. Growing and healing bit by bit.

One of these days soon I will tell my story. It pales in comparison to most, but that is consistent with my life where nothing was ever good enough. I even feel my abuse wasn't good enough/bad enough to have wounded me to the degree I feel it has. intellectually I know that is hogwash, but my heart tells me it is so.

denuseri, bless you for starting this thread, and bless each and everyone of you who has contributed to it.


Claire, same goes for you!

[thrall]

Rowen....Great Big Hugs!!

[thrall]

Ok....just a word for everyone in this thread.....this is not a thread i keep track of...

I dont want anyone of you to feel as if i only talk to Rowen or am leaving anyone out and not talking to you...Rowen asked me to look at what he was posting.....that is the only reason i jumped in.......

I am always around here somewhere......and am always happy to help......just PM me.....and ill be back....

Big hugs for everyone!
thrall

[thrall]

Hi Rowen...just a few more things to think about.....



It was ambivalent….one the one hand mother aknowledged that they did hurt me badly and that is was wrong to do so. On the other hand her focusing on her own misery, telling she would give her life to make it right and accepting me not visiting her as her punishment…now that I didn’t like…didn’t like at all…felt like being manipulated all over again.


You are not punishing your mother, by breaking contact. Breaking contact is not punitive, its something for you. Your mother is reaping what she sowed in the past. She planted pain and anger, it now as come to fruition. Do not......do not allow her to make you feel guilty for your feelings.

And if your mother is true to her word....and wants to make it right....woohoo! She should except a relationship with you..........on you terms.......not hers. If you terms are limited to no contact....then she should be happy for you.





Also spoke my brother…now that’s more difficult. He is stll more or less denying, even though 2 years ago for the first time he didn’t deny that something did happen…and I thought, I so whished..I had forgiven him… I will have to prepare that “coming out” because otherwise I will end up feeling guilty again. Also..there are his kids…some of them rather fond of that nice uncle..and he did try to support me during my break up…looks like he is longing to have a brother…so that’s difficult.


OK.........straight up......to damn bad if he suddenly thinks that having a brother is a good idea. He should have though about being so brotherly then.That ship sailed.........long ago. It would be great if he owns up to raping you.......no euphemisms like you played around....or he really didn't mean anything by it..... but owing up to the facts. The brutal truth. Anything less is letting him off the rapist hook.

Please do not allow what happened between you and your brother separate you and you nieces or nephews. Carry on with them....only leave your brother out of the loop. They did nothing wrong and are innocent.


Good luck Rowen
thrall

[bip0lar]

the incident [as i call it now] happened. i made a post of it when i felt i wanted to share but i don't think i need [nor want] to re-write the whole thing. right now what's worrying me is that i've started thinking about sex again, having fantasies, heck, i've even played with myself. I had sex 3 months after it and i came--then i started crying and crying and crying and couldn't stop. What I hate right now is the guilt of wanting to enjoy sex again. I have met [and read about] women who went through the same incident as i did and were traumatised much more than myself. I'm not saying it didn't hit me over the head with a mallet, i'm worrying that i should be worried and thinking about it but i'm not. i've spoken it over with my mother, told her about my worrying and, well, wanting to have fun yet thinking i shouldn't because... i don't know.
i'm afraid it's not normal to want sex again, but i do! and i hate the fact that i do because i shouldn't.

[Rowen]

but i don't think i need [nor want] to re-write the whole thing..


Don't feel obliged to write...it is up to you and you alone if and what you want to share. That being said...thank you for sharing your question.. Takes courage to do so..I respect that.


right now what's worrying me is that i've started thinking about sex again, having fantasies, heck, i've even played with myself. xxxx .... i'm afraid it's not normal to want sex again, but i do! and i hate the fact that i do because i shouldn't

I read about the incident. So sorry that happened to you. I am always a bit ashamed of being a man when reading such a scandalous act of a male.

Listen to me...when certain parts of your body are stimulated you can't help your body responding...that's what the "forced orgasms" in bondage videos are all about. DON'T blame yourself for it. Even if you body responded, even if you did get aroused, it was still wrong what that man did..because you didn't want it. Period. He is the rapist, you are the victim. He should NEVER have done that to you. Period again!

To me, it looks like it may be a good sign you think about sex again. You are a young girl, you should enjoy sex, it is part of your live. Don;t let that bastard take that away from you.

[bip0lar]

half of me feels sorry for thinking about sex and acting on my thoughts, the other half wants to let go and enjoy it--i don't know which part of my head to listen to. my mum says "it's part of the healing process", but i think, i wish, i hope i got out of this healing process. i don't want to hold myself back on this, it's one of the things in life i actually do enjoy, i've stopped having flashbacks, i've stopped thinking about it, it's all behind me, it CAN'T be undone, it can only be dealt with--and i think i've done that. but then the guilt starts settling in again and i'm asking myself how a male can arouse me again and how i should barricade myself in. i just don't want to have to be on the defense all the time anymore. and i feel stupid asking if that's wrong, because i know it isn't, i just can't stop feeling it..

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by bip0lar:
i don't know which part of my head to listen to

bip0lar,
Elisabeth Kübler-Ross identified something she called the five stages of grief. These "stages" are emotions or sets of emotions that we all go through after we experience a trauma. Here is what a short explanation:



The Five Stages of Grief
Denial:
* Example - "I feel fine."; "This can't be happening."
Anger:
* Example - "Why me? It's not fair!" "NO! NO! How can you accept this!"
Bargaining:
* Example - "Just let me live to see my children graduate."; "I'll do anything, can't you stretch it out? A few more years."
Depression:
* Example - "I'm so sad, why bother with anything?"; "I'm going to die . . . What's the point?"
Acceptance:
* Example - "It's going to be OK."; "I can't fight it, I may as well prepare for it."

Kübler-Ross originally applied these stages to any form of catastrophic personal loss (job, income, freedom). This also includes the death of a loved one, divorce, drug addiction, or infertility. Kübler-Ross also claimed these steps do not necessarily come in the order noted above, nor are all steps experienced by all patients, though she stated a person will always experience at least two.

As you can see, they are not neat, clean and predictable. You are going through some now, it seems, but that is OK. We all do when bad things happen.

Do not punish yourself for something you did not do, or choose. And don't try to tell yourself you should be further along in healing than you think you are. Your wound is still bleeding. It's going to take time to heal. For some of us it takes a long time. Take it easy on yourself. Just realize, the swirl of emotions, the inner confusion, the questions, is all normal.

Please remember, through it all, you are lovable. You are worth having as a friend. You are a good person.

I wish my arms were long enough, I'd give you a big, safe, long, silent hug.

[Rowen]

half of me feels sorry for thinking about sex and acting on my thoughts, the other half wants to let go and enjoy it--i don't know which part of my head to listen to. ..


Bipolar, I think you might think this post usefull
http://www.bdsmlibrary.com/forums/showpost.php?p=681346&postcount=162

[rooshoe]

Does anyone have a problem with trust?

I have a very hard time with my submission in many ways. It's so emotional and psychological, and because of my desire to submit (non-sexual), I ended up trusting the wrong person and... yeah. Not fun. I ended up being unsafe because I wanted so badly to be able to open up and trust. There wasn't even anything kinky/BDSM going on; this was all about my feelings and the relationship I thought I had with this person. I just thought I could trust him, and because I *needed* to trust someone, I did. Stupid stupid stupid.

[newslave]

I have huge huge problems with trust in much the same way...only I generally push people away before they get too close because it scares me so much. And then they earn enough to hurt me and do. Needless to say....There's lots of things that could be better in my life (though i'll also say that things could be so much worse!!)

[Rowen]

Does anyone have a problem with trust?

I have a very hard time with my submission in many ways. It's so emotional and psychological, and because of my desire to submit (non-sexual), I ended up trusting the wrong person and... yeah. Not fun. I ended up being unsafe because I wanted so badly to be able to open up and trust. There wasn't even anything kinky/BDSM going on; this was all about my feelings and the relationship I thought I had with this person. I just thought I could trust him, and because I *needed* to trust someone, I did. Stupid stupid stupid.


Yes, that submissive desire, or the desire for attachment, those can make you forget about yourself..your own safety... IMHO trust has to be gained...not to be given..
Ask yourself just why you should trust that other one? Does he really deserve it? Has he proven himself worthy of it?
And hey, we ALL can make mistakes or misjudge a situation...it's human to err...and learn from it!

[Rowen]

I have huge huge problems with trust in much the same way...only I generally push people away before they get too close because it scares me so much. And then they earn enough to hurt me and do. Needless to say....There's lots of things that could be better in my life (though i'll also say that things could be so much worse!!)

New, after what happened to you, how could you trust other people from the beginning? That being said, you have to give them their chance to earn your trust...
What you are describing is understandable, but risky. The problem is by acting this way, you expect allmost the impossible of people (pushing them away while hoping they are gonna like you)...to which they ofcourse fail...making you think that once again it's proven people can't be trusted and don't care. I know this may sound hard...but IMHO it is important to let you know, please don't be offended by me telling so.
(and if you are, let me know, will ask a mod to remove the post)

[bip0lar]

i thank you dearly for this, pressing the 'thank you' button simply didn't seem enough. i like facts--and thank you for giving me facts, they help me deal with things, no matter what they are.

[meeker]

lm so sorry.

[hurricane1]

Babe im glad you are starting to come around though it is slow recovery dont beat yourself up it was a traumatic incident and with time and being the great smart girl you are,theres nothing you cant achieve.That sick bastard doesnt deserve for your pain after this,he is unworthy to be the one that changed one great girl into one that feels guilt or anything other then happiness.Chin up your are gettin there,you will learn and grow from this.

[Rowen]

Ok....just a word for everyone in this thread.....this is not a thread i keep track of...

I dont want anyone of you to feel as if i only talk to Rowen or am leaving anyone out and not talking to you...Rowen asked me to look at what he was posting.....that is the only reason i jumped in.......

I am always around here somewhere......and am always happy to help......just PM me.....and ill be back....

Big hugs for everyone!
thrall

Like said before, I didn't and don't want to "hijack" this thread. But, there IS something I have to say right here.
Yes, I did ask thrall to look at "the" post, that first one. Because I was soooo insecure about doing it, in fact removing it after the first response. Because she indeed was always there before...always listening (and believe me, I can ramble)

I cannot describe just how confused, insecure, sad, angry and hurting I was at that moment....one part of me still thinking I was or should be done with "it" the other part feeling the lava rising. ..

She has however that magic way with words - and people at that.
Thinking back it were her words, as always the right words at the right moment in the right way, the obvious care, concern and yes, no doubt recognition in them that helped me to share over here, that helped me to stop fighting myself... When I look at it, especially that post where she ask me to tell what "it" is....I still cry...but they are happy tears..

So...I want to say right here: thrall, thank you so much, I owe your for this, big time.

[thrall]

Your making me blush Rowen!!!.....

Thank you though...knowing that what i and others said helped you... is payment enough.......

t

[thrall]

Something for everyone......This is the litinay against fear, from the book...Dune by Frank Herbert





I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.




Remember the last.......Only I will remain......

[Logic1]

*strolls in* and spreads some hugs, comfort, strength and warmth to all of you whom needs it(yes that includes those of you that just wants a hug ;)).
It is a great thing it exists.

[Dea Menrfa]

I have spent the past couple of hours reading this thread, and feeling it intensely. I have so much to say, and yet can find no words for what I feel, and all of the emotions that have been brought up by those of you with strangely similar histories.

Wow.

Just Wow.

[Synfall]

What all of the survivors here are doing in this thread is amazing and so is everyone else who's been involved so far.
I have not yet chosen to be amazing, but perhaps I will one day be able to join you all.
*curls up in a corner and snuggles down contentedly*

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Synfall:
I have not yet chosen to be amazing, but perhaps I will one day be able to join you all.

But you have just joined us. You don't have to relate your whole story with your first or second post. Come and participate. When you are ready, share. And only share what you are comfortable with.


Originally posted by Dea Menrfa:
I have so much to say, and yet can find no words for what I feel, and all of the emotions that have been brought up by those of you with strangely similar histories.

That is a very familiar event. One that still happens to me. I hope you can find some help here, and eventually some peace.

[Dea Menrfa]

Thank you ashtonDs

[Rowen]

What all of the survivors here are doing in this thread is amazing and so is everyone else who's been involved so far.
I have not yet chosen to be amazing, but perhaps I will one day be able to join you all.
*curls up in a corner and snuggles down contentedly*

For you as well..we'll keep that fuzzy blanket within reach...don't feel obliged, feel safe..

[Dea Menrfa]

I would like to mention another severe form of abuse... it is spiritual abuse.

People who manipulate others and blame it on God's will.

I could go on and on about this... as it was a rather large portion of my abuse experiences.

Not only does this interfere with our ability to grow as an individual, but also can inhibit our relationship with God. (not meant to be religiously exclusive, but don't know what other higher powers the readers of this post may have)

[denuseri]

my abuser used to catch me praying for release and taunt me about it, telling me how there is no god that can save me, that i would never be realsed from anything until i was dead and only he would decide when and how that would happen, etc etc, i even started praying to die at one point, i like to think i kept my faith throught the experience, i know i surley stumbled, all people do, we are by no means perfect

the fact that i am still here today was a great sign that some higher power was watching over me in my mind, i have my own beliefs, i dont pretend my way is better than any others, belief in a diety is a very personal journey,

i also abhor people that use thier religion as an excuse to abuse another person, it is to me perhaps one of the greatest sins against ones diety to take and twist what ones god/ or goddess stands for into somthing malignant and evil;

huggs and be strong my sistas, and bros, we are not alone

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Dea Menrfa:
another severe form of abuse... it is spiritual abuse. People who manipulate others and blame it on God's will.

I was abused by a nun, supposedly one of God's representatives on earth, supposedly doing God's work. Just because someone claims to be working for God does not mean that they cannot be abusers and it does not excuse their behavior.

[sisterhoney61 {RW}]

I know that one of the signs of an abuser is when he uses isolation to keep you under his control. I was certainly kept in isolation of family and friends and even the law, because we didn't have a phone in the house. Another way he isolated me was that he did his best to isolate me from my religion. I am a Pagan and he was an atheist and he was the type of atheist who felt that any type of religious/spiritual expression/practice was wrong. In the beginning of our marriage he was fine with the fact that I was Pagan and it didn't bother him that I practiced my religion. But as he became more abusive the more he disliked my religious leanings. At one point I was working in a New Age shop and he accused me of being brainwashed by my co-workers and customers.

As the situation at home became worse I went through my dark night of the soul. Interestingly enough this occurred over one Easter weekend where I sat on my bed for three days and nights and cried. Then I attempted suicide. The Goddess came to me during that time and would not let me die. She made me realize that I was still Her child, despite everything that was happening to me. I instinctively knew that if I survived that there was still more pain and torment for me to go through and I didn't know if I would have the strength to get through this. All I wanted was to die. But the Goddess enfolding me within Her arms and I survived. And I gradually gained the strength to end my marriage and get away from my abuser.

Every day since then I have given thanks to the Goddess for watching over and protecting Her child and for giving me the strength to continue living. She knew that I would move beyond what was happening to me. She had faith in me, which strengthened my faith in Her.

[Synfall]

For you as well..we'll keep that fuzzy blanket within reach...don't feel obliged, feel safe..
Thank you Rowen

But you have just joined us. You don't have to relate your whole story with your first or second post. Come and participate. When you are ready, share. And only share what you are comfortable with.
And thank you as well, ashtonDs

You guys are all very sweet.
Actually I'm fairly comfortable with sharing my story, though. It's what I percieve as my resulting weaknesses that I have trouble dealing with. I know I'm probably not as weak as I feel about myself, but understanding and believing, truly believing, are completely different things.

My father was abusive when I was younger, and nearly killed us on several occasions before my mother ran away with us and filed for a divorce. Then we lived with her parents for a while. I would like to say that that they are nice people. Actually they are, but they are also very cruel in their own way. They never raised a hand to any of us, but they, my grandmother in particular, have a way of making their words feel like invisible razor blades that dance under your skin, even years after the fact. And yes, they too used their religion as an excuse to attack us and our decisions over the years.

I've never understood why it's so much harder to escape abuse that's delivered under the guise of meaning well. I guess when the people in question aren't trying to physically harm you it's harder to hold their actions up to past experience and say, this is just as bad as that. Maybe it's just the fact that physical abuse leaves a visible mark and is harder to hide.

The worst part about it is I learned a number of reactive behaviors when I was very young and never questioned whether or not I should behave that way until very much later. Even now I don't always recognize abuse the instant it's happening or know how to make it stop if I do recognize it. Sometimes wonder if there isn't something about those behaviors that make people target me over some of the people around me without ever thinking about it because they sense my unfortunate willingness to tolerate beyond what I should?

I have had several times where my (boss/ coworkers/ customers / teachers) attempted to take advantage of my quiet nature. I know I don't have to take any of their crap. But I also know I can handle anything a (stranger/coworker/boss/teacher) hands out, because they don't know me well enough to know exactly where they have to apply pressure before I break.
I don't know what it will take to hurt them, and am unwilling to lash out to find out, especially since I know so well how an abusive remark, even in retaliation, can have long term effects.
Still, it gets frustrating, and tiring, always feeling like I'm on the defensive. It makes it very difficult to get close to people, and to trust them.

[claire]

Your instincts are good. Lashing out at others is not always the best response to someone who is taking advantage or abusing us. I just wrote out part of a long response giving advice on how you might handle similar situations, but I realized you weren't asking for advice. You have your own way of handling those situations and who is to say mine would be any better.

It sounds like your grandparents were emotionally abusive, that can be even worse than physical abuse. If they used words and emotions to hurt others, then no they were not nice people. They may have done some kind and generous things for you, but they definitely were not nice.

[Synfall]

It sounds like your grandparents were emotionally abusive, that can be even worse than physical abuse. If they used words and emotions to hurt others, then no they were not nice people. They may have done some kind and generous things for you, but they definitely were not nice.
Maybe I should have clarified. They were nice to everyone else. We have a very strong tendency to act normal around others, so I know they can be nice. As to the rest of the family (primarily my mother and myself), you are right, they are emotionally abusive. I don't think they even realize how dangerous their words are. I'm sure they wouldn't mean to say such things if they truly understood the impact of their words because I know they love us very much. I am very uncomfortable with myself right now because I feel I am making excuses for them and there isn't one. Period. Since I have not been able to make them understand my limits in this regard I try to limit my contact with them as much as possible and when I can't avoid them I limit the conversations to very banal subjects.


I just wrote out part of a long response giving advice on how you might handle similar situations, but I realized you weren't asking for advice. You have your own way of handling those situations and who is to say mine would be any better.

Claire, if you want to go ahead and write down any advice please feel free. It may be different from my own way of dealing, but it can't be any less valid, and we might learn something from it. In fact please do. I would love to learn how other people deal with abuse that doesn't come from family or lover.

Often we think of abusers in terms of people who are closer to us, but there are times when people instinctively seem to know how to hit your weak spot and will attack you, perhaps without even realizing that they are attacking you.
But what people don't always realize is maybe that one last cutting remark they made was the last straw that sends their waitress over the edge to committing suicide that she's been so busy thinking about that she's been giving them lousy service. Maybe she was just trying to cut you down to build herself up so she could hold on a bit longer.
Not really an excuse, but I've just never felt comfortable imagining that I could be the one who could have made a difference for someone and didn't just because I felt justified in being nasty back.

[thrall]

The word you are looking for is......


Emotional Sadists

[Synfall]

I am sure you are right. It's good to have a word for it.
The point is while, yes some people are just naturally bastards, others are simply lashing out because they have been hurt. Regardless of whether or not that can be considered an excuse, it's a cycle of abuse one way or another.
Since I have no way of distinguishing between the two I would rather not be a particpant in the cycle by attacking back. I know that sometime leaves me open to abuse that isn't necessary, but I would rather not hurt unknowingly another person. If I can take it and they don't keep on spreading their 'love' around then as long as it's ended it seems ok.

... It sounds stupid the way I'm explaining it. It doesn't make sense when I try to type it out.

[thrall]

I am sure you are right. It's good to have a word for it.
The point is while, yes some people are just naturally bastards, others are simply lashing out because they have been hurt. Regardless of whether or not that can be considered an excuse, it's a cycle of abuse one way or another.
Since I have no way of distinguishing between the two I would rather not be a particpant in the cycle by attacking back. I know that sometime leaves me open to abuse that isn't necessary, but I would rather not hurt unknowingly another person. If I can take it and they don't keep on spreading their 'love' around then as long as it's ended it seems ok.

... It sounds stupid the way I'm explaining it. It doesn't make sense when I try to type it out.

Big hugs..........oh yes it does make sense!

You are taking responsibility for you own actions. ...BRAVO!

[Rowen]

Maybe I should have clarified. They were nice to everyone else. We have a very strong tendency to act normal around others, so I know they can be nice. As to the rest of the family (primarily my mother and myself), you are right, they are emotionally abusive. I don't think they even realize how dangerous their words are. I'm sure they wouldn't mean to say such things if they truly understood the impact of their words because I know they love us very much. I am very uncomfortable with myself right now because I feel I am making excuses for them and there isn't one. Period. Since I have not been able to make them understand my limits in this regard I try to limit my contact with them as much as possible and when I can't avoid them I limit the conversations to very banal subjects.

.

Synfall, children always want to believe that their parents mean well...since it "wrong" to be angry with them. However, many abusers are respected members of society but tyrants at home! In if they really love you, they sure have peculiar way of showing that, don't you think? If they really love, if they really are interested what is best for you...shouldn't notice that they are hurting you by saying what they say?

[Rowen]

. And yes, they too used their religion as an excuse to attack us and our decisions over the years.

I've never understood why it's so much harder to escape abuse that's delivered under the guise of meaning well. I guess when the people in question aren't trying to physically harm you it's harder to hold their actions up to past experience and say, this is just as bad as that. Maybe it's just the fact that physical abuse leaves a visible mark and is harder to hide.

That is exactly why it so cruel..putting the fear of God in your child..hurting them while telling it is in their best interest, burden them with immense guilt if they even think that its wrong what is happening...that is indeed emotional sadism.




The worst part about it is I learned a number of reactive behaviors .... Sometimes wonder if there isn't something about those behaviors that make people target me over some of the people around me without ever thinking about it because they sense my unfortunate willingness to tolerate beyond what I should?

I have had several times where my (boss/ coworkers/ customers / teachers) attempted to take advantage of my quiet nature. I know I don't have to take any of their crap. But I also know I can handle anything a (stranger/coworker/boss/teacher) hands out, because they don't know me well enough to know exactly where they have to apply pressure before I break.
I don't know what it will take to hurt them, and am unwilling to lash out to find out, especially since I know so well how an abusive remark, even in retaliation, can have long term effects.
Still, it gets frustrating, and tiring, always feeling like I'm on the defensive. It makes it very difficult to get close to people, and to trust them.

You are doing well, you are recognizing patterns, and yes, taking responsibility as well. My compliments for that..and trust me...you are gonna do well...
Because what you describe is perhaps the most devious result of emotional abuse. It imprints behavioiur in you that seems normal and natural to you, but indeed can make you vulnerable, uncertain and neglecting your own needs, feelings. And yes, some people learned otherwise, recognizing those patterns and by that knowing within instant who to lash at..

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Synfall:
I've never understood why it's so much harder to escape abuse that's delivered under the guise of meaning well. I guess when the people in question aren't trying to physically harm you it's harder to hold their actions up to past experience and say, this is just as bad as that. Maybe it's just the fact that physical abuse leaves a visible mark and is harder to hide.

As you said, "physical abuse leaves a mark." With any type of emotional abuse, but especially that "delivered under the guise of meaning well," the abused person can easily fall into doubt. They think it's their fault, and /or they feel guilty about what is happening, as if it is their own fault.

If there is blood or a mark or an injury it's much easier to see. If the evidence of the abuse is mostly in the abused persons head it's much more difficult.

It took me many years into my adulthood to realize that what happened to me was really abuse. In fact, at first I argued with my therapist against that. Abuse was something that only happened to other people, not to me.

Now that I admitted to myself that I was actually abused, I am recovering. Because I took so long to see that and to get help for it, I feel like I will never be totally free of it. There are some effects that I cannot shake off. But like an alcoholic at an AA meeting, I will make it day by day. Just as you will. You, like everyone here, are a survivor.



Originally posted by Synfall:
others are simply lashing out because they have been hurt. Regardless of whether or not that can be considered an excuse, it's a cycle of abuse one way or another.

But it is not an excuse. Abuse is abuse. There is no excuse. The guilt is theirs not yours. It is good that you do not want to join in the cycle. Even if you can distinguish between the two, you do not have to take part. Playing with the darkness, will get you sucked in.


Originally posted by Synfall:
... It sounds stupid the way I'm explaining it. It doesn't make sense when I try to type it out.

It doesn't. You might think that some of us are so eloquent in our delivery and our storytelling, it's just because right now we have a bit more practice than you do.

Believe me, we understand what you are saying, some of us have gone through exactly that.

[enseignez-moi]

So I've been watching this thread for a while and like most who watch for a while and then share, I realize my time has come to share.

I always thought my want for submission was wrong. That it was some horrible manifestation of my ever-present role of the abused. I know it's a part of me and maybe that is part of it, but it's something I'm coming to terms to dealing with.

I spent my life being verbally, emotionally, and physically abused by my mother. I thought that everyone got hit for being stupid. That bruises were normal. Doesn't everyone hide under the covers, quaking in fear? Apparently not. Like many, the first time the word "abuse" came up in therapy I was appalled. That's not me! That's not how it was! I'm much stronger now and realize that just because I was abused does not make my mom the monster many would paint her to be. She was older when she had me. Older and blind, literally. It does not negate what she did. It wasn't right. But she is human. She made big mistakes. But I have started the process of forgiving her.

Self-abuse and depression are both issues I've been dealing with since the tender age of 12,if not earlier. eleven years later and i'm finally starting to get a handle on it. two years, 8 months self injury free!

and the worst part of it... i was in two abusive relationships. I was raped in both. Several times. I did really well at forgetting and remembering only the good times. Both relationships being with another woman, I was under the belief that it wasn't rape. how could another woman really rape you? Well they can. There are many forms of violation and penetration and in both cases it happened. more than once. I didn't actually piece together the abuse/rape by these two woman until I met my current partner/Domme. She has her own abuse history and her telling me about what she remembers triggered nightmares and memories long buried.

I was wondering if anyone else shares abuse histories with their Domme and if so, how do you deal with it? BDSM sex is sometimes great, sometimes triggers us both. We work hard to communicate and to let each other know when things are going south, but sometimes one or the other feels stupid and keeps going anyway. We spend hours after dealing with the repercussions, trying to work through it. It's sex therapy in the most literal sense.

[Synfall]

Originally posted by AshtonDs:

It doesn't. You might think that some of us are so eloquent in our delivery and our storytelling, it's just because right now we have a bit more practice than you do.

Believe me, we understand what you are saying, some of us have gone through exactly that.

Perhaps I will practice more then. I have made an appointment with a therapist and I'm going to start sorting through some of my mess. Thank you guys for your encouraging words. I find myself quite upset by some of the habits that I have developed for dealing with my past, but I am trying to evolve new ways of dealing. I'll let you know if anything more productive comes up.I have had counselors when I was younger, but hopefully now that I have words and a better understanding I will be able to get the help that I need.

[Synfall]

Self-abuse and depression are both issues I've been dealing with since the tender age of 12,if not earlier. eleven years later and i'm finally starting to get a handle on it. two years, 8 months self injury free!


First off, Congratulations! It's wonderful that you aren't hurting yourself anymore. Just a little mantra for you if you ever feel the urge in the future...
Just say, "I am not the one causing my problem, so I am not the one who should be bleeding." :) And smile.



I was wondering if anyone else shares abuse histories with their Domme and if so, how do you deal with it? BDSM sex is sometimes great, sometimes triggers us both. We work hard to communicate and to let each other know when things are going south, but sometimes one or the other feels stupid and keeps going anyway. We spend hours after dealing with the repercussions, trying to work through it. It's sex therapy in the most literal sense.

Having never had a Dom/me yet, please take any suggestions I have with a grain of salt.
Here's something you may try if you haven't done something similar yet. Write down as many experiences as you can remember, good and bad, but use as few words as possible.
You can discuss the list with your Domme, and explain what memory the phrase is referring to and exactly why it was/was not a good experience in detail. I don't mean just visual details, or time periods, but what things that you smelled, textures, sensations, how it made you feel and why you believe you responded so negatively/positively.
Hopefully the fact that you have to actually explain what the memory is and the feelings surrounding it will be enough to help your Domme build scenes that won't create an echoing feeling to any bad memories. And maybe the good memories can inspire your Domme to develop new ideas to build on those things that give you happy feelings.
If you write the list on seperate pages, or in a collumn format you can give your Domme the bad memories to dispose of as she sees fit. Maybe you can even make a picnic out of it, or a ritualistic burning of the bad paper or something.

Did I say grain of salt? I think I meant shaker, lol.

[Rowen]

Perhaps I will practice more then. I have made an appointment with a therapist and I'm going to start sorting through some of my mess. Thank you guys for your encouraging words. I find myself quite upset by some of the habits that I have developed for dealing with my past, but I am trying to evolve new ways of dealing. I'll let you know if anything more productive comes up.I have had counselors when I was younger, but hopefully now that I have words and a better understanding I will be able to get the help that I need.

Synfall, my respect for taking these steps and sharing them. You DO listen, you DO dare to confront yourself and you DO take responsibility. Trust me, those are the most important steps, however difficult they are. Don't hesitate to aks or tell if you feel the need..
You are doing well..and you will be allright...

[Rowen]

I always thought my want for submission was wrong. That it was some horrible manifestation of my ever-present role of the abused. I know it's a part of me and maybe that is part of it, but it's something I'm coming to terms to dealing with.

I cannot tell just how familiair this sounds...then again... can be liberating to experience that some people dont take advantage of you when you have surrendered!


I'm much stronger now and realize that just because I was abused does not make my mom the monster many would paint her to be. She was older when she had me. Older and blind, literally. It does not negate what she did. It wasn't right. But she is human. She made big mistakes. But I have started the process of forgiving her.

Yes. she wasnt a monster but still did monstruos things to you. Still, I admire that you are able to understand, yet realise that understanding it doesn't mean you approve it.



i'm finally starting to get a handle on it. two years, 8 months self injury free!

Awesome - my respect


I didn't actually piece together the abuse/rape by these two woman until I met my current partner/Domme. She has her own abuse history and her telling me about what she remembers triggered nightmares and memories long buried.

I was wondering if anyone else shares abuse histories with their Domme and if so, how do you deal with it? BDSM sex is sometimes great, sometimes triggers us both. We work hard to communicate and to let each other know when things are going south, but sometimes one or the other feels stupid and keeps going anyway. We spend hours after dealing with the repercussions, trying to work through it. It's sex therapy in the most literal sense.

Think you hit the bullseye here: talk. Talk to each other and yes.. it can and will be sex therapy. And it will strengthen and deepen your relationship by giving you both the opportunity to share, to comfort, to heal together. Sounds to me the two of you are doing very well indeed after most diffiuclt years.

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by enseignez-moi:
the first time the word "abuse" came up in therapy I was appalled. That's not me!The very same thing happened to me in therapy, but unlike you I spent many more years suffering, and hoping no one found out, until I got help.

And keep talking with your Domme. Triggers can be anywhere, it's just that you both have a style of relationship where they are easier to dig up. With time they will fade as you get a handle on them.

[Flaming_Redhead]

Violence can take many forms, some of which don't even seem to be hurtful at the time. Talking about it with a therapist, counselor or friend can help to relieve the heavy burden imposed by carrying deep, dark secrets. When it's no longer a secret you keep hidden even from yourself, only then can you really begin to face the truth and stop being a victim. It's easy to continue being a victim. It's much harder to to take a good, long look at yourself, realize the part you played in it, stop placing all the blame on yourself and/or others, learn from your mistakes, and move on. Believe me, it's easier said than done, especially when those around you keep hurting you unwittingly or on purpose. When you are finally able to recognize when someone is a negative influence, remove them from your life whether they be family or friends. You may find your group of friends to be pitifully small, but never confuse quantity with quality.

I won't bore you with all the gory details since it would involve me writing a book, so I'll give you the short version. My parents divorced when I was 2 years old, supposedly because I was an "accident" that my father didn't want. I finally met him after I turned 18, and since I don't know where he is now, I guess my mother was right. Anyway, my mom remarried, and as soon as she had a child by him, I turned into the proverbial red-headed step-child. He turned out to be a mean drunk, physically and verbally, that my mom didn't protect me from because, apparently, she didn't think there was anything wrong with the way I was treated. In elementary school, I was molested by an older girl in the neighborhood as well as a step-cousin who stayed with us for a year along with his other cousins. By middle school, the boys were pursuing me hot and heavy, and the girls were picking fights with me. I lost my virginity at 14 in a house where teen boys were threatening to run a train on me but didn't. This same boyfriend was physically and verbally abusive. I broke up with him after the umpteenth time he cheated on me. I became quite the little slut, dating older and older guys. At 16, I met my future husband who was 11 years older and got pregnant. I had an abortion which my mother made him pay for even though he wouldn't take off of work to go with me. I married him at 20, thinking he was a good man. He wasn't abusive, per se, but he never believed in me. He was passive-aggressive and left me to deal with problems on my own. Gee...dunno how I could've missed that! Toward the end of the marriage, he did become verbally abusive and told me I'd never make it without him, that I'd wind up alone, and that I'd end up with someone who beat me all the time. (If he only knew! hahaha) He used threats of getting me fired from my job as well as his family's money to scare me into giving him primary guardianship of our son. He forced himself on me the last night I was there, but I didn't fight back. After I left him, I was date-raped by a younger man. When I entered the scene, the first dominant I had a relationship with was a verbal bully who talked down to me and called me a slut in anger, and he was emotionally manipulative. I never felt like I was ever quite good enough for him no matter how I tried. I eventually came to my senses, sort of, and broke up with him, though it was one of the hardest things I've ever done. I refused to stay in that situation. I recently lost a "friend" who borrowed money over a year ago and never paid me back. I said good riddance! I don't need people around me who won't treat me with the same respect I show them.

Now, I'm with a new Daddy who doesn't act anything like the old one(s). I'm still a work in progress and don't claim to know all the answers, but it's getting better all the time.

[denuseri]

hugs to all the people posting here, i wish there was no need for this thread to exist, i am continually impressed with the way everyone has come out to support each other

i will continue to keep us all in my prayers

[Rowen]

Flaming redhead (wonderfull name btw), takes guts to post this and power to make the changes you are making. Take good care and stay on track!

[Seri]

I've been debating posting on this forum since I came here, being a guy I find it hard to talk about these kinds of things, however seeing the bravery of every one spilling their hearts made me feel like a coward...I'm not going to go into many details because I'm not yet comfortable with what I'm typing even now, however I do make note that I can relate with you, and thank you for stepping forwards. Perhaps, within time I'll be able to take a stand and share my problems here with the rest of you brave souls. However, at the time, please know that you all have a place within my heart, and I hope every day that you all can recover that much more, untill you've been able to throw off the shackles of the past.

~Mirror

[Synfall]

Violence can take many forms, some of which don't even seem to be hurtful at the time. Talking about it with a therapist, counselor or friend can help to relieve the heavy burden imposed by carrying deep, dark secrets. When it's no longer a secret you keep hidden even from yourself, only then can you really begin to face the truth and stop being a victim. It's easy to continue being a victim. It's much harder to to take a good, long look at yourself, realize the part you played in it, stop placing all the blame on yourself and/or others, learn from your mistakes, and move on. Believe me, it's easier said than done, especially when those around you keep hurting you unwittingly or on purpose. When you are finally able to recognize when someone is a negative influence, remove them from your life whether they be family or friends. You may find your group of friends to be pitifully small, but never confuse quantity with quality.


Hey Flaming_Redhead, :wave:
You are quite right, I believe, in recognizing what's wrong, with yourself, and with others and then trying to move past it. It's very brave of you to come and tell us about your past, and to show us that to you it is starting to be just that... past.

Oh yeah, and the friend you lost because they borrowed money that they didn't pay back? I'm sorry you've had that experience, but I hope you don't mind my saying that's probably the best money you will ever have spent, just to be sure that they aren't around anymore.

Good luck, and blessings.

[Synfall]

I've been debating posting on this forum since I came here, being a guy I find it hard to talk about these kinds of things, however seeing the bravery of every one spilling their hearts made me feel like a coward...I'm not going to go into many details because I'm not yet comfortable with what I'm typing even now, however I do make note that I can relate with you, and thank you for stepping forwards. Perhaps, within time I'll be able to take a stand and share my problems here with the rest of you brave souls. However, at the time, please know that you all have a place within my heart, and I hope every day that you all can recover that much more, untill you've been able to throw off the shackles of the past.

~Mirror


Being a guy doesn't make abuse any less real or valid than it does for the females on this thread. Just the fact that you know that what you've experienced is something you've never deserved is a step in the right direction and can only make you stronger in the long run. We are as, Flaming_Redhead put it, works in progress, so your thoughts and hopes are most welcome. Take as long as you need to get comfortable, we'll be here.

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Mirror:
I've been debating posting on this forum since I came here, being a guy I find it hard to talk about these kinds of thingsI know how you feel. I felt the same way for a long time.

But as you begin to get comfortable you will feel more comfortable sharing. And share only as much as you are comfortable with.

We are not interested in making you spill your guts, we are interested in seeing you begin to heal and put a dark time of your life behind you.

[Rowen]

.... however seeing the bravery of every one spilling their hearts made me feel like a coward....... However, at the time, please know that you all have a place within my heart, and I hope every day that you all can recover that much more, untill you've been able to throw off the shackles of the past.

~Mirror

Mirror.. you're no coward. You are here, aren't you? And your time will come. Meanwhile, thanks for that place in your heart. And we are getting rid of those shackles.. sometime by replacing them by new ones.. the loving kind.


................

We are not interested in making you spill your guts, we are interested in seeing you begin to heal and put a dark time of your life behind you.

Exactly! Tis up to you what to tall to whom and when. As long as that helps you to focus on tomorrow.

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by denusrei:
hugs to all the people posting here, i wish there was no need for this thread to exist, i am continually impressed with the way everyone has come out to support each other

i will continue to keep us all in my prayers

denuseri,
Thank you for getting the ball rolling here. We all would not be here if it wasn't for you.

None of us like that this thread needs to exist, but are glad it does. And we are all supporting each other, just like our founder taught us.

Thanks for the prayers, and big hugs right back to you! :wave:

[Rowen]

hugs to all the people posting here, i wish there was no need for this thread to exist, i am continually impressed with the way everyone has come out to support each other

i will continue to keep us all in my prayers

Ash is right you know. Look what you've started! Simply clicking the thank you button seemed not sufficient.

[denuseri]

but,,,, but i like the thanku button,, lol

and this thread, the support group, the whole kit and kaboodle wouldnt exist if it were not for all of the wonderfull people here,my fellow survivors and thier supporters, without all of you this would have just been another little post with no attention

the real majic comes from all of you

[darkbutterfly]

After thinking about it all night last night I decided to post in this thread.

I was never abused in a bdsm b/c I've only had two Owners (one male & one female, but i didn't refer to her as a Mistress until long after we were over) but my current one is a continual support system to help be better and stronger.

I was however abused by my father, emotionally, physically and sexually. He had a drug problem and his friends all had drug problems. I was sexually assaulted by one of his friends at one point too. The only reason I wasn't raped was because I was able to grab the lamp on the bedside table and hit him with it and run. The sexual abuse is a blur and was a rarity, though I do get nightmares once in a while reliving it. The emotional is imprinted on my personality permanantly and the physical haunts me time and time again, with nightmares and regressive tendencies now and again. On several occasions I ended up in the hospital for days and sometimes weeks, there was one time I was in a coma for 2 days, another time where the neighbor called the paramedics b/c I was thrown in the front yard through a sliding glass door and had lost so much blood they thought I wasn't alive. And I have permanant nerve damage and pain problems from being thrown down stairs and thru windows, into walls and beaten with objects from metal dog chains to chairlegs. The really ironic thing was when my dad died (he was murdered when I was 15) I was really upset, but I was more upset that I hated him and never had the guts to tell him. And I was angry b/c I never had the chance to resolve my issues and feelings towards him either.

I actually brought up being attracted to BDSM to my therapist I was seeing for a long time b/c I was worried that it was something I was doing that was regressive to my recovery. And she pointed out several factors of being attracted to BDSM, especially D/s relationships.

1.) I emotionally shut down in times of stress but in dealing with pain in sparks a feeling, any feeling in me and so I begin to function again. If I voluntarily push myself to feel something, the easiest way to encourage that is through voluntary pain b/c then I can have control over something I didn't have control over before and I am able to illicit a response to something I shut down in dealing with years ago.

2.) Physical pain is something that is familiar with me, and while I have some very strict lines on things that involve objects and being hit, it gives me a sense of familiarity with a new view. I have the opportunity to choose how I want to be treated and have control on something I didn't have control over a long time ago.

3.) a D/s relationship that is HEALTHY (keyword here) is actually more beneficial than anything else that could happen in recovery b/c I have always been very, VERY mistrustful of people in general...ESPECIALLY men (for obvious reasons) and being in a relationship that demands absolute trust in someone else is a desire to prove to myself that all people are not like that and not all men are like my father and that I can trust. And in having 2 Owners who have been encouraging, comforting and supportive, as well as being kind, but giving me guidelines to fulfill also help my recovery and my ability to trust in others as well as myself. Which apparently is huge according to my therapist...lol

:)

[naomi57 {ukMC}]

well here goes

i have noticed that there are a lot of victums of abusive relationships(some even on this site), sexual and otherwise, and that there are a wide variety of support groups out there for all the different types of victums ,,,,except one group, ours

where is the help for submissives that have been abused?

its right here, we are the ones that should support our own

most all suport groups outside the comunity dont address the needs of our own people, in other words they are vanilla, and lack the understanding that we as submissives and doms/ dommes share in our way of life

i am not advocating the exclussion of outside scorces for support(in fact i strongly reccomend seeking medical and spiritual support) i am, simply saying that we have a unique perspective to help abuse victums within our range of expertise

that is the reason i am posting this thread,

part of my own therapy was seeking out this site so i could talk with people within my peer group that would accept my way of life

yes i was a victum of sexual abuse in a bdsm context,
it has taken many years of hardship to reach the place i am at today, to be able to speak and share about it with others and i am very thankful to the people at this site for all the catharic help they have given me

yet i feel that as a recovering abuse victum its not enough that i help out the occasional girl or two i come accross in chat or the forums thats on the cusp of abuse or has been abused,(my owner supported me, who supports those subs without owners)

thats why i have posted this thread,, anyone that wishes should reply here with thier story of recovery, questions,or conserns,advice etc: or pm me if you wish for privacy i will make every effort possible to help you

perhaps if we all work together in this we may be able to really help a lot of submissives that are having trouble recovering from thier tramatic experiences


:my ordeal:lasted for three months, i suffered through pure hell at the hands of a pedator i wouldnt call a dom and his accomplices that i went to meet from an online chat,(not this one), without taking the proper precautions:
it took six months of corrective surgey to physically repair what was done to me, including dental work etc, i shall never have children because of them, it took allmost six more months before i could even step outside my house on my own, let alone be touched or have sex etc, i am very lucky to be alive, with my owners help ( he has litterally saved me) doctors , therapists, support groups, and this site, including many individuals here have helped me a great deal

i am not telling you this seeking sympathy, i am doing this for the benifit of others that have been abused, if they read it they may garner some hope of recovery for themselvesso i know from personal experiences what kind of things some of you that have been abused are going through

i once heard a dom refer to us as "the broken ones" well we dont have to remain broken,, we can heal, we can be fixed, we can recover, grow, and thrive (even enjoy bdsm again) with the right help,and the best help we may find just might be from each other


hugs and kisess for all conserned,

i have a master who is also my partner he is very strict but fair he has never abused me or rape me but before i became his slave i was rapped so it is not always done in a master or slave relationship

[Rowen]

Darkbutterfly
You describe a sheer living hell in which you grew up. And a most fascinating view of your therapist on the therapeutic aspects of BDSM to you. By far not all of them do.
I can imagine that experiencing that there are people who you can trust, who won't abuse your vulnerability can be of the utmost importance.
Thanks for sharing and I am glad bdsm was such a help for you.

[denuseri]

hiya naomi and darkbutterfly> i am glad you posted here with us you are very brave to come forward as are the others before you , i wish we didnt have this commonality to share, its not a great club to be in


abuse weather it was from a bdsm situation or not is still abuse



our subbmission in a bdsm relationship can actually work as a strength to our recovery in many ways especially with a supportive owner, i draw great comfort from my owners protective support as well as his understanding, it is also something that keeps me from harming myself when the darkness closes in because i have to preserve myself for him (i dont know if it makes sence to all but it works for me) i also see that effort to protect myself from myself to preserve my owners "property" as a motivator for the as yet unowned too, as they must protect themselves for thier future dom/domme

also the medical comunity has a tendency to catorgize we that are lovers of bdsm in a way that puts our kink in a derogatory light (more than one doctor and or nurse/therapist has shown me such discrimination first hand)

, something i wish to say about this is they are wrong when they do this, we are loving careing human beings and i figured the people that would best understand this is our fellow bdsm community members that dont judge us for our kink

thats one of the main resons the thread was started so we that are into bdsm and are survivors of abuse, (any abuse) can help support one another, aslo it was to help establish a modus opperandi for recovery and information guilde for those in the community that are trying to help abuse survivor submissives but didnt really know how to go about it, i have heard of many mis-communications between doms/dommes with formerly abused submissives that didnt understand why thier sub just couldnt "get" past certian aspects or perform certian tasks for them, and who better to give them the informational tools they need to help thier subs than we who have survived

after all, who best understands our peer group if not ourselves?

[Karesch]

Firstly I'd like to say my thanks to all who have posted in here. Truely. Thank you. I've never in my life read something so heart rending, yet so beautiful at the same time, in all of my life. I've been part of numerous communities over the years, and none has ever earned so much of my respect as this one has, in this thread. My heart goes out to all of you and the pains you feel.

It's taken me more than a few hours, and probably half a pack of smokes, to read this thread, all the while searching my soul, seeing parts of my past, considering, contemplating, owning and contemplating further. In the end, I've decided that I'll speak. Mayhap not for the support recieved, but perhaps for any support or strength it might give others. For any strength it might offer.

Yes, I have been in abusive relationships. Verbal and physical. Most who know me, who truely know me and are my closest friends, know the things I've been through, and they understand and have always been a great source of strength in recovery. Most others would scoff at the idea of it even being possible. How does a 6', 250lb, physically intimidating, mentally strong, Dom, get abused... well, it's simple... size and physical prowess is as much a hinderance in life as it is a boon, and especially a hinderance when dealing with abuse as a man, from a woman.

The fact is simple and all too painfully plain when in that situation. I am very capable of hurting people. I've studied alot of martial arts, biology, physiology, all the makings of a true human predator. I know this about myself, and it is a source of my confidence and self assuredness, aswell as being a hinderance.

Verbal violence I can take, and take, and take, and take some more. It doesn't require any reaction from me, although it does create internal strife and pain. I've suffered lots of this at the hands of significant others. More than I care to dwell on.

Physical violence on the other hand, is a whole nother ball of wax. It's immediately painful, and most human's reaction is to try and stop the hurt. To avoid it, or defend oneself. Yet I can't do that either. Size and ability is a hinderance. Any response from me, even a very controlled one, could and is likely, to result in the other party being hospitalized or seriously injured at the least. So what does one do. I've had to force myself to just take it. To take hold of my instinctive desire to defend myself and do absolutely nothing but ride it out, because in the end, who does the cops/judge/jury believe... the 5'5" 115lb woman who's wearing casts, or the 6' 250lb guy that doesn't have more than a couple bruises... So I've endured it, left it when the time was right and moved on. Talking to those that I trust about my experiences, healing, and now, sharing with the rest of you, that even a very physically capable, very tough, Dom, can be on the recieving end of such misery...


K

[ashtonDs]

Originally posted by Karesch:
So what does one do. I've had to force myself to just take it. To take hold of my instinctive desire to defend myself and do absolutely nothing but ride it out, because in the end, who does the cops/judge/jury believe... the 5'5" 115lb woman who's wearing casts, or the 6' 250lb guy that doesn't have more than a couple bruises... So I've endured itKaresch, you definitely are not alone in this.

Several years ago there was a program on television (and right now I'll be damned if I can remember the specifics) that told the stories of several men who were physically abused by their wives. But it's not like they were small men, or weak, or physically hindered in any way. All of them were beaten by women smaller and weaker than they were. One man when asked why he didn't try to stop her said, "I was brought up not to hit women." So, he "took" her abuse.

The thing is, all of them had emotional problems from the abuse virtually the same as people who are abused by someone stronger. Abuse is abuse, no matter the size of the abuser, and no matter the size of the abused.

For me, there is no mystery here. Yes, someone your size can be abused, and does suffer from it.

Thank you for sharing your story.

[Karesch]

I just hope that by sharing it, it gives some sort of comfort in it's knowledge to others that are in or have been through, similar situations.