what about contracts???

[hiddyboy]

some seem to think contracts are irrelevant, like safe words for day players. others seem to think that contracts are relevant and important. what do the rest of you think?

can anyone show me a copy of a standard contract? and if i needed to, can anyone help me set up such a contract?

thank you

[submissivewife]

Here is a couple of links we have here at the library

http://www.bdsmlibrary.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3748&highlight=contracts

http://www.bdsmlibrary.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4496&highlight=contracts

[_ID_]

Depends on what your intended purpose of the contract is. Are you looking for a M/s D/s or play partner contract? Each would be written with different verbage to convey the intent and requirements of the relationship. Do you plan on stict adherance to the contract? If you do, the contract is usefull, if you plan on using it more as something to negotiate what the other wants out of the relationship, it is usefull, but its impact isnt as deep, or meaningfull.

V/R
ID

[Timberwolf]

My take, and it might not be a popular one.

I have to say, I think an actual D/s contract is way over the top. My stance is this: someone's word to me or mine to you should be worth more than a signature on a piece of paper. I don't need someone's signature on a piece of paper to bind me to another person.That goes for both D/s contracts, and vanilla marriage liscences for that matter (as if the government has any authority to tell me who I'm married to based off paying them a fee). All I need is my word, and my heart. In the end the rest is all for show, and nothing more but a pale reflection of those two things.

I would also say, if a sub felt the need to have a contract for the reasoning of it clearly defining what I could or could not do with her, that for me would be a very big sign that I did not yet have her trust, to a level I was happy with, most likely due to a lack of communication.

[His_pita]

We have a contract and for us it is a powerful symbol of where we are and what we want out of our D/s relationship. We looked at the ones online but they were too generic for us, so my Dom decided to write ours so that it says in detail exactly what we want it to say.

Yes, of course we could have the same relationship without the contract. It is not legal or binding in any sense other then our word to each other. However, it is powerful to us because it was written with great care for whom and what we are to each other.

We review our contract every 3 months and will for our first year. When that year is up we hope to have a new contract that consist of a couple of lines that state very clearly what we want and expect out of each other. We will also have a collaring ceremony and I will receive my permanent collar.

My Dom likes rituals and since being with him I have grown fond of them myself. For us symbolism and rituals are a useful tool in keeping our D/s alive and thriving.

[_ID_]

As far as the meaning beyond the two people involved. With a marriage contract, it gives the partner rights (in the usa, dont know the laws of other countires, feel free to add those details) that wouldnt be allowed normally. One of the reasons why gay marriage is such a big deal. Not wanting to hijack the thread, so if that becomes a debate lets start a new thread.

The meaning and weight of the contract holds only as much weight as you give it. So as in pita's case, it is a very important document, and as in Timberwolfe's case, it would hold little weight.

In my particular relationship, we have a contract, however we don't review it on a regular basis, just when we feel need arrises. She got her first perminate collar before we got married, we both held the meaning of the collar to mean as much if not more than the ring on the finger does.

I hope this answers some of your questions.

V/R
ID

[Satan]

Contracts annoy the hell out of me. Most of it is common sense, and I would rather have actions define our relationship than a bunch of fancy words on paper.

[Uncle_Ed]

Contracts annoy the hell out of me. Most of it is common sense, and I would rather have actions define our relationship than a bunch of fancy words on paper.

Interesting comment coming from Satan.
It must have been your feminine side coming out when you were Liz Hurley-Satan there seemed hell-bent on contracts. *winks*

[Tojo]

I guess all that shows that contracts mean different things to different people. As Satan says it's just common sense really.

I don't have one with lisa, & we've been going for 8 or 9 months now- we may have one someday. We have a simple verbal agreement.

I did have one with my first girl, more to keep her on the right track with her life if anything.

As far as online contracts go, there's tons of them, just do a search for 'contracts BDSM' or something.

Ultimately though it's just what the two of you decide.

Tojo

[mina]

Interesting comment coming from Satan.
It must have been your feminine side coming out when you were Liz Hurley-Satan there seemed hell-bent on contracts. *winks*

lol, I don't think he's seen that movie. I'm also trying to make sense of your comment, if the Satan there (Liz) IS hell-bent on contracts, and he's not, how is there a comparison?

[Ozme52]

Personally I prefer the original Bedazzled with Peter Cook as the Devil.

[Ozme52]

If you're going to go to the bother of having a contract...

I'd suggest including a Failure To Perform clause... *weg*

[her_Joe]

I'd like to say that I can cavalierly dismiss a contract like several of you have done, and I think I catch your drift. The contracts we found on line when we were drafting ours were usually laughable, cliched, and more romance than meat.

For us, a contract has given us a touchstone with this 24/7 thing we're trying to live gets confusing and when priorities shift. As anyone who has done it knows, or anyone who imagines it may gather, there are times when the "normal" (D/s) priorities rattle around a lot.

Of course, common sense could solve all of these issues probably. But anyone who has been married knows how little common sense comes into play when emotions are involved.

So, as pita explained, each three months in this first year of being together we sit down and go over all of it, from one end to the other. We make few changes. It does give us a formalized chance to revisit the things that we thought were important to us; it's nice to find out they still are, even though life sometimes throws curves, or housecleaning, or shopping, or teenagers into the mix in such a way that the way we wanted it to be has to be revised or simply suspended for a bit.

Some people think that's nonsense. Okay. But if you're one of those casual types who say your heart and your word are your bond, and your common sense is going to remain intact no matter the situation, and -- finally -- you trust your dominant (or submissive) to be able to do the same, then I wish you well.

But I would still bet that you have a contract ... if not written down, then verbal. Can any of you tell me that you've never had a conversation with your O/other in which you negotiated what was a hard limit, a soft limit, what is expected of each person, before you got together? In fact, what would you tell someone -- imagine a new submissive, perhaps -- who asked on the boards, "This dom guy says he's going to take care of me if I submit to him. I really like him. He snarls really neat and makes my armpits tingle. Should I move in with him this weekend with my kid and turn over all my money to his care? Oh, he likes breath play, suspension, and knife play. Anything I need to do before the lights go out?"

I'll go so far as to say that anyone involved in a BDSM relationship in real life who doesn't have a contract, written or a verbal agreement, is a bad story waiting to be told.

hJ

[Silke]

*nods* I agree with you her_Joe, we probably all have contracts in one form or another. I just never thought about verbal agreements when someone brought up contracts.

I still don't know what to think of contracts. The standard ones on the web make me laugh and the term 'contract' is loaded with negative connotations for me. On the other hand, I can see where they might become very special when worked out and negotiated between two people, and become a reference point to revisit from time to time, even something like a source of strength.

But still...something about a written contract strikes a weird chord with me and I can't really point my finger on why that is the case. *shrugs* I don't know.

[her_Joe]

Maybe, Silke, it's because it sounds so cold? Something like "pre-nuptial agreement"?

I'm hopeful, like pita said in her earlier post, that when this year is over we'll know one another well enough that all of what we need to say can be boiled down into a sentence or two.

Yeah, I"m big on ritual. Some folk find it artificial.

hJ

[Silke]

Maybe, Silke, it's because it sounds so cold? Something like "pre-nuptial agreement"?

*ponders* yes, I think you're right. BDSM (contrary to my preconceptions before I started dipping my toes in it by the way) has been all about a journey into deep emotions for me, and the term 'contract' might just sound too cold. It might also explain why I see the sense of it on the rational side but have a weird feeling about it. ;)


Yeah, I"m big on ritual. Some folk find it artificial.

I don't find it artificial at all...rituals can be so much if both people are into them - comforting, an anchor to get into a certain mood, a reminder... :)

Good luck in finding the essence of your relationship...I'd be interested to hear what those few sentences will be when you find them. *smiles*