For The "Sake Of Art?"

I'm going to preface this post by saying I am not looking for a definitive answer to the question I'm posing, simply thoughts and comments to flesh out the thought process my Dom and I are going through. Here's the scenario:

Today I was contacted by an artist friend of mine inquiring if he could pass my number along to a colleague who was in search of a female model. I agreed to help and spent the better part of my Sunday posing for a small gathering of oil painters. The sitting was a focus on facial features and expressions, so I was comfortably clothed the entire session.

As we were wrapping up, this friend of my friend and head of the study session asked if he could call me again to pose. As these artists in the gathering are all quite successful professionals and the gig payed very well I agreed to model again. He then asked me if I would consider posing for the "forms" study group. Translation: would I pose completely naked?

I told him I would think about it and get back to him. I'm a little nevous but not against the idea. However, there was no way I was going to agree to appear naked without the consent and blessing of my Dom. I told Him about the offer via IM, as I have not seen him face to face yet to discuss this. He said he would think on it and we'd talk.

My question to the Dom/mes as well as the subs on the forum is simply this: how would you feel about a similar situation involving your partner? J-Go and I will make this decision based untimately on how the two of us feel, but I am curious for other perspectives. Thoughts?

i'd consider it but i'd be very wary.
in the end i'd say why not?

amber,
Since I am a nudist I would not have a problem with it, but you were totally correct to ask your Dom. If you are his slave then very correct to get his permission to allow his most valued possession to be seen.

I think this is a cultural thing. Why would he have any problems with you showing your naked body to anyone? It's not like you're having sex with the artists. You wouldn't think twice about shedding your clothes on a nude beach, would you?

He might say "no", anyway. For undisclosed Domly reasons?!?

My mother was a nude model for painters when she was a student. She showed me a few sketches she got as gifts. If she could be relaxed about it, anybody can. I wouldn't call her an exhibitionist. Sexually liberated perhaps, but not exhibitionist.

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Originally Posted by Sir_Russell

If you are his slave then very correct to get his permission to allow his most valued possession to be seen.

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Isn't this just Islamic values poisoning our cultures of late? Just wondering. Sweden is pretty liberal about nudity, so maybe I'm completely off here regardign the rest of the western world.

If it's a case of will you pose naked or not, then that's a fair question to be asked. And I guess you gave the right reply, considering that you have a Dom to answer to. Having said that, I wouldn't have any issues myself about letting wifey pose nude. (She wouldn't do it, but that's another topic.)

The second question is, do you feel completely at ease in all respects, with the group you are posing for?

My take on the matter would be if you are supporting yourself then you should decide if you need the income from such activities. I can understand you wanting your Dom's input and especially his blessing but if he is not helping to support you then I would have no problem with you deciding to do it if you needed to.

I see it this way; it is not really a question of asking permission, it is more of how people view nude modelling in general.

Of course I would ask permission and discuss it with my partner first, whether he be Dominant or not. With a D/s relationship, it would depend on the type of relationship it is. If a Dominant completely owns his slave, then it is only by protocol that the slave ask permission first. Then again it is really common courtesy, just to do so.

This is more of a question in my mind of the misconceptions that people have about nude modelling.
The naked human body, is in fact a beautiful piece of artwork in itself, a raw form of expression. Artists who are serious about their work, will view the human body as such.

People tend to overlook the artistic expression and lean more towards the offensiveness of posing naked in front of a group of strangers.

I am not into art all that much, but from what I have heard, artists derive artistic pleasure from thier work, they are not there to fulfill a deviant fantasy, or to go home and masturbate over thier work later on.

This isn't really the same thing as a man asking a female to pose for pictures, that he will post on his personal website or for fapping material for him and his friends.

I would be very surprised to hear that a model or any artist would become sexually aroused during a session.

For me I would be honoured to be able to use my body in such a way for the artistic pleasure of another.

I think it is important that you look good nekkid.......

:D

;)


...and I'm more than willing to help you answer that question....

No... Really!!

Just send (or post) several examples of yourself in your nekkid glory...

:rolleyes:

Seriously.... (or is it too late?)


I think it's a wonderful idea if you're comfortable doing so.
And, as a dominant, I find great pleasure in having others admiring what's mine... and perhaps wondering...

I collect art, sci-fi genre mostly... mostly ;) ... and take great pleasure in having others view and enjoy my collection. I have always enjoyed watching others furtively glance at whomever is on my arm...

I can't think of any reasons to object.

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Originally Posted by TomOfSweden

Isn't this just Islamic values poisoning our cultures of late? Just wondering. Sweden is pretty liberal about nudity, so maybe I'm completely off here regardign the rest of the western world.

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No... I don't think so. It may sound it on the surface but Islamic values would never condone allowing it.

This is a bdsm/lifestyle value... asking s/he whom you've given yourself to (as opposed to a less than willing taking, my personal perspective of how I see Islam treating women,) for permission to display what you've given him/her control of.

But you are right that being brought up in Sweden (positively) colors your perspective. In the US, while now "acceptable" for others, it's art after all, not my wife/girlfriend/daughter etc.

You can see this in the kind of 'fallout' professional women who also pose for Playboy Magazine (and if that's not outright tame and arty) sometimes have to endure.

Remember, the US was founded by religious fundamental followers. We're pretty repressed. Our politicians suffer more for being found out for being sexual beings than for graft and payola.

But let's take a straw poll :rolleyes:

Who thinks Amber should post pictures? (Yeah, I know. I'm incorrigible.)

If you are comfortable with it, and want to do it, I say go for it. I went to an Arts high school (yes, I am one of those), and the visual artists would have nude models from time to time. For several months an eight-foot-tall painting of a old naked man with a pierced penis graced the front lobby of my school. We were "progressive".... or something.

If my Master wanted to do it himself, I wouldn't have a problem with it.

If I wanted to do it, I think his biggest issue is that so far I have refused to pose for him (he is a fairly serious amature photographer) and wanted to go pose for strangers.

That being said, I don't think it is something I would actually do. Stripping down in a room full of strangers is just not on my list of fun things to do.

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Originally Posted by Sir_Russell

amber,
Since I am a nudist I would not have a problem with it, but you were totally correct to ask your Dom. If you are his slave then very correct to get his permission to allow his most valued possession to be seen.

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Exactly. I thought about it this way really: how would my Dom (or anyone, for that matter) feel if thier sub/slave/significant other took a piece of personal writing and brught it to a literary study group? There's nothing morally or ethically wrong with reading, and it would have artistic merit, but a person's intimate possesions (and what is more intimate than one's sub/slave?) are still thier's to choose to do with what they will.

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Originally Posted by TomOfSweden

I think this is a cultural thing. Why would he have any problems with you showing your naked body to anyone? It's not like you're having sex with the artists. You wouldn't think twice about shedding your clothes on a nude beach, would you?

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I have done a small amount of nude modeling before (for the artist who recommended me to this new gentleman), as well as appeared in a scene in a theatre production topless. I find nothing to be ashamed of in regards to either scenario. From a cultural standpoint, J-Go has never looked down upon or been offended by these appearances either. As His intimate property and private possession however, it's not a matter of ethics or culture or taste, simply (I think) if He wants to share or not. ;)

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Originally Posted by ThisYouWillDo

The second question is, do you feel completely at ease in all respects, with the group you are posing for?

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I will not know all of the members of this group, I am relying on the recommendation of the artists in the group that I DO know. The class is for professional, working artists as opposed to a group of college kids, however, so I can't magine any discomfert other than the initial, "Holy Shit!" moment one has before disrobing.

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Originally Posted by Warbaby1943

My take on the matter would be if you are supporting yourself then you should decide if you need the income from such activities. I can understand you wanting your Dom's input and especially his blessing but if he is not helping to support you then I would have no problem with you deciding to do it if you needed to.

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There is no financial need for it whatsoever. Honestly? I'll likely use the money to take J-Go to a ridiculously expensive diner complete with good wine and great Scotch. The artists in this community are fabulous folks I've found, and I'm certainly the kind of girl that likes to put something interesting on her list of life experiences now and again! ;)

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Originally Posted by cadence

I see it this way; it is not really a question of asking permission, it is more of how people view nude modelling in general.

This is more of a question in my mind of the misconceptions that people have about nude modelling.
The naked human body, is in fact a beautiful piece of artwork in itself, a raw form of expression. Artists who are serious about their work, will view the human body as such.

People tend to overlook the artistic expression and lean more towards the offensiveness of posing naked in front of a group of strangers.

I am not into art all that much, but from what I have heard, artists derive artistic pleasure from thier work, they are not there to fulfill a deviant fantasy, or to go home and masturbate over thier work later on.

This isn't really the same thing as a man asking a female to pose for pictures, that he will post on his personal website or for fapping material for him and his friends.

I would be very surprised to hear that a model or any artist would become sexually aroused during a session.

For me I would be honoured to be able to use my body in such a way for the artistic pleasure of another.

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I love that last statement - yes, there is a distinct degree of pride and honor in being asked, and in participating in something like this.

I know I personally worry very little about what people think of nude modeling or what they find offensive (and from conversing with J I know He doesn't find the concept itself offensive in the least either), I simply do not wish to offer my body in any fashion that makes my Master feel like I have given a part of myself away that is simply for His pleasure. I don't think either of us are under the impression that the artists will be gleaning sexual pleasure form the session, but it is a form of pleasure being taken from my form and nakedness nevertheless.

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Originally Posted by Ozme52

Who thinks Amber should post pictures? (Yeah, I know. I'm incorrigible.)

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Yes, yes you are... There prolly won't be pictures, but I hear there's still one or two seats available in the session... *class turns to see a large 'Domly' looking guy enter the room with a Big Chief tablet and box of Crayolas*

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Originally Posted by lily27

That being said, I don't think it is something I would actually do. Stripping down in a room full of strangers is just not on my list of fun things to do.

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It is an odd experience, I'll grant you that. The other times I modeled for an artist it was just the single painter and I knew him personally, the time on stage was in front of over 250 perfect strangers. In each case a very particular sensation comes over you as you become hyper aware of your body: you lose the ability to breathe automatically and have to think about doing it, you become very aware of the weight and feel of your limbs, of the temperature around you, and of how each and every movement you make feels. It's not uncomfortable per se, but it is enlightening.

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Originally Posted by Ozme52

But let's take a straw poll :rolleyes:

Who thinks Amber should post pictures? (Yeah, I know. I'm incorrigible.)

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You all are free to vote but mine is the only one getting counted....No Oz you will not be getting any pictures...sorry. :dont:

Thank you all for your input...I share the ideals many of you do, I was in a play earlier this year with Amber in which she was partially nude. Of course I was backstage and got the best view in the house *grin*. This however I must admit has me wondering if I like the idea or not. Before going any further I want to make clear that this is Ambers decision, yes I am her Dom and I will give her my opinion but I respect her enough to give her complete latitude on this decision. Her body is long and artful, I’m not at all surprised she has been asked. In fact she has posed for a renowned local western artist before (nude) so it is not new ground. Two differences, 1) I’m in her life now (…thank you for caring enough to ask little pet) and 2) Neither her nor I know these people all that well… I just want to know she is in a safe environment an is not going to attract a stalker or something. (I mean seriously isn’t that Oz’s job?! *grin).

Anyway thanks for the input I would be interested to hear from some folks who have actually done this sort of thing.

Weighing in on the artists side here.......*wearing the coveralls(no panties of course) and holding the brushes*

When we had a nude models.....male or female.......it was as far from a sexual experience as you could ever get. The room was warm..........too warm but it was for the comfort of the model, so we all roasted for the sake of art. The models took regular breaks and no one bothered them. I must say that i greatly appreciated the models for posing........because the human body..........is art

However it was great fun when i was at a strangers house several years later......and the painting on the wall was a topic of conversation......it was rather funny when i said, "I know those boobs......i painted them as well"...........lol

UPDATE: after a face to face chat the main issue Master and I kept coming back to was that of my safety. Working as I do out in the public eye, I've manged to acquire one or two or six stalkers in my time already (and that was fully clothed!) . ;) Having watched some of these scenarios unfold (as well as being a rather protective kinda' guy to begin with), J's first instinct is always to keep me out of harm's way. In discussing the issue we covered a lot of what was already mentioned in the comments above, as well as the real and the percieved threats, and in the end decided together that it would be a unique experience and that I should give it a go.

So grab your charcoals, pencils, and oil paints folks - we're going to art class on Thursday!

Finger paints? :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by TomOfSweden

Isn't this just Islamic values poisoning our cultures of late? Just wondering. Sweden is pretty liberal about nudity, so maybe I'm completely off here regardign the rest of the western world.

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I think not.

Consider the counter position, that of regarding it as so casual (as opposed to so forbidden) that it should not even be discussed (as opposed to being a matter for strong consideration). Is that not a different set of values poisoning our cultures of late?

Her body was given to him, of her own free will (one must suppose). Therefore, it is his decision to make, regardless of what cultural influences they have experienced.

All i have to say............

There are nuts everywhere!........you can pick them up just as easily at the bank, or mall. Clothes on or off...it really makes no difference it think.........

See ya in class...........lmao........and ill show you my fan brushes..........lol

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Originally Posted by thrall

All i have to say............

There are nuts everywhere!........you can pick them up just as easily at the bank, or mall. Clothes on or off...it really makes no difference it think.........

See ya in class...........lmao........and ill show you my fan brushes..........lol

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Fan brushes?? Grrr... Yeah baby, talk dirty TO ME! ;)

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Originally Posted by Ozme52

I think it is important that you look good nekkid.......

:D

;)


...and I'm more than willing to help you answer that question....

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Actually honestly, as an artist, I like drawing the fat ugly people best. They were more interesting. Course it didn't help that my best looking model did NOT use anything to hold back body oder. ha! And of course there was that "too skinny to be real" model with the tampon string hanging out. ugh

But yeah, you should have asked your Dom, and yes, you should do it. As an artist, I never saw sex...I saw curves, shadows, grace, and amazing artistic splender. Plus you can ask to take photos of the art, or maybe even get some sketches of yourself.

Consider this subject put to bed.

Literally.

The session ended about two hours ago and I am currently quite happily tucked in ten floors above the ruckus of downtown. Ahh, home sweet home. I plan to write a longer post detailing the evening, but for now I'll just say that I don't regret choosing to model in the least. There was nothing awkward or scary about posing, in fact I think I was more nervous when I sat for the group clothed on Sunday.

Was it sexual? There was indeed an undercurrent of sexuality, but no more or less than I carry as part of my day to day bearing. If anything, I would say it was more sensual; the way good food, good wine, and good art should be. Visceral, yet focused.

Thanks for turning thing this into a great thread you all -- I'll fill you in on the details on Friday or Saturday. For now, this sleepy lil' subbie needs to go to bed!

Still no photos to share of the art pretty one. Now that does make you a bit of a tease

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Originally Posted by Sir_Russell

Still no photos to share of the art pretty one. Now that does make you a bit of a tease

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There will be a history posted later this evening/early tomorrow morning (I have been offline this weekend as I just got a new dog and he's been keeping me busy!) but I am sorry to say there won't be any pictures this time around. There are oddly strict rules in place for photography of the atrists' work, but I have been invited back in two weeks to pose again and I now know some of the artists well enough that I think they might let me take a few pictures.

UPDATE: The "rest of the story" is now posted under a new thread in the "My BDSM Life" section.

Personally I think nude art is mostly perceived as some thinly veiled form of pornography. While some 'artists' simply create a spitting image of the model, a few extremely talented are able to convey more on the canvas. Take the impressionists, controversial in their time, they were able to display something that people can't just help thinking about when they see it.

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Originally Posted by Lion

Personally I think nude art is mostly perceived as some thinly veiled form of pornography. While some 'artists' simply create a spitting image of the model, a few extremely talented are able to convey more on the canvas. Take the impressionists, controversial in their time, they were able to display something that people can't just help thinking about when they see it.

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While some may paint or draw pornography, I disagree that nude art should be considered as a form of porn.

I took life drawing classes - and found them completely asexual - One of the models at the time was a young lady I was sleeping with - and seeing her naked in front of the class was as asexual as anything you could imagine. Funny thing - it's all contextual - if I'd taken her to an event and displayed her naked it would have been extremely sexual in nature - but in a life-drawing class? nope - just the reverse.

And I wouldn't class anything that was produced in that class as overtly pornographic in any way

I agree, Whippett.

Though I've never taken a drawing class, I work in the arts and perhaps that's why posing naked has never seemed sexual to me. I also have lots of friends that have done it, therefore it's not a foreign concept. I can understand the sensuality of it, more so for the model. To have all eyes cast upon drawing the most detailed curves of my body sure does seem sensual.

It only seems pornographic to people in the US because nudity is a forbidden.

Congrats Amber, glad to hear it went so well!

In my opinion it depends on what the picture is intended for. As people have mentioned lots of life classes use naked mode;s to teach about drwaing the contours of the models etc. However if someone \draws a pic and puts it up purely for titllation then that makes it porn.

As I mentioned in the follow up post: very sensual, not overtly sexual. Perhaps that's a blurry distinction to some, but I liken it to a good meal or a great bottle of wine: there is a pleasure and a satisfaction in the experience, but no accompanying rush of hormones. ;) For me, the only sexual element was knowing I was "showing off" my Master's possession and something he is normally NOT inclined to share!

amber,
Life in general should be and is sensual if your awake and aware enough to take advantage of them. Your right though about how to enjoy sensuality with the it requiring sex. Though I wonder, how was the love making that night afterwards. My bet is that it was very special.

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Originally Posted by Sir_Russell

amber,
Life in general should be and is sensual if your awake and aware enough to take advantage of them. Your right though about how to enjoy sensuality with the it requiring sex. Though I wonder, how was the love making that night afterwards. My bet is that it was very special.

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Well... *blushes* J walked me back to my place and spent the rest of the evening fussing over me and massaging out the myriad of kinks and knots that posing for a few hours causes. I feel asleep in His lap, truth be told! But when He crawled into bed wth me the next morning... Yes, very sensual, very spiritual, VERY special...

amber,
I figured as much, having never posed and since my media is film or now digital my models were never subjected to long times holding a pose. I just didn't factor that into my thoughts.

I bet though that if you ever do try photo modeling in the nude that you will also find that to be very sensual and arousing. Then both of you will enjoy that building held sensual arousal that explodes in wonderful session of sex and hopefully bondage.

We may have had a small, private photo shoot while out of town this weekend... *weg* It did result in a rather "inspired" encounter!

*growls in envy* hehe

that's so very cool Amber and sounds like it's been an enriching and rewarding experience all around - good for you!

gem,
xo