BDSM outside of marriage

I'm going to make no judgements here whatsoever, I've just become really curious to know if many people are married but practice BDSM outside of their marriage rather than inside (having failed to successfully introduce BDSM or for any other reason which I'd be interested in hearing).

I've seen members on here who appear to live or have lived a secret BDSM life that their partner knows/knew nothing about, and I'm guessing this is more often the case than not and that it would not be usual for a vanilla couple to agree on one of them engaging in anything remotely sexual with someone else.

I guess members here may also have been the 'other party' in such an affair. Did you know they were married or did you find out down the line? What happened?

Unusual topic of discussion I know... I hope curiosity didn't really kill the cat ;-)

Your most likely also going to find that 90% of the one's who are married to a vanilla partner that you meet online who are into bdsm are not doing any bdsm in real life eaither, using online as their out let and not telling their partner about their online activities becuase they dont see it as cheating.

While Keltar and I aren't married yet, the topic of BDSM has been discussed even before we actually got together, so it was actually part of the mutual attraction. BDSM is within our sexual realm of enjoyment.

When we would/will actually practice with someone else - online and/or real life - she (as they would only be female due to personal choices on both sides, including my bisexuality) would be shared by both of us. There is no secret BDSM (or any other sort of possible "cheating") going on in our relationship.

Trust, open communication and sharing, are crucial aspects of our relationship.

If I had it to do over, I'd only be looking for a bdsm-avid partner.

But that discounts factors out of our control. There's little one can do if one falls for a vanilla except perhaps ignore it. Not a good solution.

The more you can tallk about it up front the better. Our solution was an open relationship that allows us to experience NRE (new relationship energy) without having to lose ong established love. Those decisions perforce put me into the married conducting bdsm outside of that relationship. I've also been that other person, but take no guilt over it... as I have never forced anyone to go outside of their own comfort zone, though I recognize I am exceptionally charismatic. (Lucky me ;) )

That said, though my own relationship is DADT (don't ask - don't tell,) I try to only approach others in open/poly arrangements... and the occasional unattached person... if I feel I can trust them to remain rational about my commitment to my vanilla relationship.

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Originally Posted by Ozme52

Our solution was an open relationship that allows us to experience NRE (new relationship energy) without having to lose ong established love. Those decisions perforce put me into the married conducting bdsm outside of that relationship.

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That's really interesting. So I'm assuming it's just you conducting BDSM outside of your relationship and not your partner too (who presumably isn't into it hence why you are playing elsewhere?)? Thanks for sharing, and also when you say about your relationship being DADT, do you mean in reference to your partner or in reference to anyone you might practice BDSM with outside of your marriage?

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Originally Posted by Liushka

Trust, open communication and sharing, are crucial aspects of our relationship.

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Good on you both, really. :-)

This is a very touchy subject, however, I will add my honest input.

I was in a failing marriage. It lacked everything when it came to sex... including the act of sex :/ When my interest in BDSM sparked and I was sure I wanted to try it, I did stray. I'm in no way saying this is ok. In fact, my guilt over it was extreme. I quickly realized that this was a lifestyle that I wanted to live.

My marriage came to its end as I knew it would. For over a year it had struggled. My BDSM experience is not the reason my marriage fell apart though. There were many other factors. Now, as a single young woman, I have embraced this world. It's my added twist of excitement :)

Also, I think knowing how I feel about BDSM, I would struggle with being with a straight vanilla partner. Cheating is not ok in my eyes. Regardless of the circumstances. So, knowing what I know now, my partner would have to have some interest on BDSM. I have a hard time with open relationships and the poly side of BDSM. I like exclusiveness (I know that's not a word lol).

Thanks for being so honest in your previous post, Scarlet. Really brave of you, but I'm glad you're finally on the right road now and are happy about that :-)

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Originally Posted by scarlet_85

Also, I think knowing how I feel about BDSM, I would struggle with being with a straight vanilla partner. Cheating is not ok in my eyes. Regardless of the circumstances. So, knowing what I know now, my partner would have to have some interest on BDSM. I have a hard time with open relationships and the poly side of BDSM. I like exclusiveness (I know that's not a word lol).

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I'll second your opinion on open and poly relationships. It's not something that feels natural to me at all - I've recently tried to be in a casual arrangement with someone (not even a form of relationship, literally just having some fun whenever it can be arranged) and it's really hard for me to accept that that's all it will ever be, and that they're probably going to be seeing other people at the same time as me. If I'm honest I'm not actually looking for another relationship just yet anyway, but I can never control my emotions and I always seem to get more emotionally involved in any situation than I might like to be. Hopefully practice will make perfect and I'll be able to do casual as much as the next person!!

I was in a largely broken vanilla marriage. I'd unsuccessfully tried to introduce some aspects of bdsm into our life, several times. Occasionally, I would seem to have very minor success, but it never lasted, and there were way too many other problems. When I came to the Library, I was in a bit of denial, thinking that I was making a last ditch effort to save things with my husband. What I now see, is that I was really looking to try bdsm, in a tentative, somewhat safe way.

Unlike what denuseri said, I definitely saw what I was doing as a form of cheating, and I didn't like it. As soon as I'd gathered enough courage (and paused for knee surgery) I left my husband. That was about six months ago, and I've never been happier or more satisfied.

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Originally Posted by chipmunk_

I was in a largely broken vanilla marriage. I'd unsuccessfully tried to introduce some aspects of bdsm into our life, several times. Occasionally, I would seem to have very minor success, but it never lasted, and there were way too many other problems. When I came to the Library, I was in a bit of denial, thinking that I was making a last ditch effort to save things with my husband. What I now see, is that I was really looking to try bdsm, in a tentative, somewhat safe way.

Unlike what denuseri said, I definitely saw what I was doing as a form of cheating, and I didn't like it. As soon as I'd gathered enough courage (and paused for knee surgery) I left my husband. That was about six months ago, and I've never been happier or more satisfied.

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Wow... your story hits home. Thank you for sharing :) I am a lot happier as well... I even had the knee surgery! Lol crazy for sure! Happiness is key... and I'm glad you're tasting it!

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Originally Posted by ar1

That's really interesting. So I'm assuming it's just you conducting BDSM outside of your relationship and not your partner too (who presumably isn't into it hence why you are playing elsewhere?)?

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I don't know. DADT works both ways. She may be having vanilla affairs, she may be "kinky" with multiple partners... I doubt though, that she does "traditional" bdsm as there is no evidence of that in her between us.

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Thanks for sharing, and also when you say about your relationship being DADT, do you mean in reference to your partner or in reference to anyone you might practice BDSM with outside of your marriage?

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My bdsm partners always know I'm married and married with no "intention to get a divorce". And though that limits my choices sometimes, it's better than the altenatives. I won't lie to get laid. I won't intentionally hurt someone if I can avoid it... except, of course, in the bdsm sense of the word 'hurt'.

(Sorry for the delay answering, I missed the question in your reply.)

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Originally Posted by scarlet_85

Also, I think knowing how I feel about BDSM, I would struggle with being with a straight vanilla partner. Cheating is not ok in my eyes. Regardless of the circumstances. So, knowing what I know now, my partner would have to have some interest on BDSM. I have a hard time with open relationships and the poly side of BDSM. I like exclusiveness (I know that's not a word lol).

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Exclusivity. ;)

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Originally Posted by ar1

Thanks for being so honest in your previous post, Scarlet. Really brave of you, but I'm glad you're finally on the right road now and are happy about that :-)

I'll second your opinion on open and poly relationships. It's not something that feels natural to me at all - I've recently tried to be in a casual arrangement with someone (not even a form of relationship, literally just having some fun whenever it can be arranged) and it's really hard for me to accept that that's all it will ever be, and that they're probably going to be seeing other people at the same time as me. If I'm honest I'm not actually looking for another relationship just yet anyway, but I can never control my emotions and I always seem to get more emotionally involved in any situation than I might like to be. Hopefully practice will make perfect and I'll be able to do casual as much as the next person!!

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Poly definitely isn't for everyone. But if you have a wandering eye... or your partner does, it beats serial monogamy and causes far less emotional pain imo.

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Originally Posted by Ozme52

Poly definitely isn't for everyone. But if you have a wandering eye... or your partner does, it beats serial monogamy and causes far less emotional pain imo.

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I always felt that the whole "open relationship" thing had potential for pain as well. It also makes me think that the relationship could be potentially based off sex. If you are dating someone, or married, and go else where for sexual gratification, isn't that saying that the relationship is suffering slightly?

I know that you are married and practice BDSM outside of marriage. From what I've read, your marriage seems strong. I'm going to ask a question... my apologies if it offends for that is not my intention. So... do you have a good sex life with your wife? And do you only have one sub? Do you have other sexual encounters apart from the marriage and BDSM role? Ok... more than one question :P

I completely respect your input, Oz, and I really hope I didn't just offend you. I've came back to this thread a couple few times just because it has a lot of good points. And I enjoy the thought process. Being able to see many different aspects is rewarding in its own way.

P.S. I hope you're enjoying your travels :)

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Originally Posted by scarlet_85

I always felt that the whole "open relationship" thing had potential for pain as well. It also makes me think that the relationship could be potentially based off sex. If you are dating someone, or married, and go else where for sexual gratification, isn't that saying that the relationship is suffering slightly?

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Yes, of course it does. The more complicated the relationship(s) the more opportunity for miscommunication and of course the more opportunity for it ending badly "just because". But I don't think poly relationships tend to end because one feels chemistry with someone newly met... and they don't cause the pain that the statement "I never really loved you in the first place." causes, which, I believe comes from the concept that there is a single soul mate for each of us, or "one true love"... and therefore the previous love must have been a mistake.

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I know that you are married and practice BDSM outside of marriage. From what I've read, your marriage seems strong. I'm going to ask a question... my apologies if it offends for that is not my intention. So... do you have a good sex life with your wife? And do you only have one sub? Do you have other sexual encounters apart from the marriage and BDSM role? Ok... more than one question :P

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I certainly did, very hot and for many many years. Sometimes it waned, and was actually revitalized by an affair. Plus, I spent large periods of time away from home on business, and I always came home hornier when I was getting "regular service" on the road. Today, as we've both grown older, my physical passion for my wife has apparently fled, and either her needs have too... or perhaps she's getting them met elsewhere. I could leave "for a younger woman" but I still love my wife, so why not have both? Selfish? Perhaps, not as selfish, imo, as leaving over a mid-life crisis. Besides... I'm too old to start a new family with a young woman just ready to start hers... no matter how hot she might be. ;)

You also ask if I have only one submissive, and right now, yes. But the same "logic" applies. Should I dump her if a new subbie comes along wanting to kneel before me? And really, how many of those stick around once they're exposed to a dungeon full of dominant personalities, many of whom are monogamous.

One thing I've learned that I didn't recognize when I was young, single, and contemplating my forthcoming marriage, was how much nicer it is to be able to share someone new as a couple. As I've also said, if my spouse had ever appeared curious to try something kinky, even as mild as a threesome, perhaps I would have broached a renegotiation. But after 33 years? Not too likely that we should change what works for us.

Lastly, yes, I do have other sexual encounters. I guess it's partly because I give good vocabulary online... and partly because I am "charming" in person.

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I completely respect your input, Oz, and I really hope I didn't just offend you. I've came back to this thread a couple few times just because it has a lot of good points. And I enjoy the thought process. Being able to see many different aspects is rewarding in its own way.

P.S. I hope you're enjoying your travels :)

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I am. I am.

Thank you :) I love honest feedback.

And, for some reason, this was my thought to all of the above stated...

My Master is 16 years older than I am. That puts him at 41. However, through many discussions, there are no expectations at this time. We just enjoy the company of each other. And the sex is **AMAZING** :P I have a child already and even though I'd like to have more, that's just not an option at this time. As you said, you have lived your life, just like my Master. I am young and very "wild & crazy" still. I think what's helped us on that is a ton of communication, throwing out restrictions, and the acknowledgement that we live in two different worlds. But I'm content with all of that. He's the smile on my face :) I think that realistically, age has no restraints as long as you're happy.

Also, I agree with what you said about your marriage. In a strange way, you are still very loyal to your wife. That's home. And even though you live a poly lifestyle, you haven't completely neglected your wife. So, I can respect that.

I give you kudos for being able to manage more than one sex life lol a friend of mine refers to that as an empire. A lot of effort involved in that one!

I'm involved in a new baby bdsm relationship with a man who is married in a very vanilla relationship. I don't necessarily feel good about being involved with a married man, but on the flip side, I, selfishly, need the release of this type of sex. I don't want his wife to find out. He's the dom, I'm the sub, so I don't know how this will play out but he's teaching me so very many things that I didn't know. My hope is that I don't fall for him while this is going on.

Very interesting! I just joined and am not quite sure what section to use to address my fetish. My wife and I are professional pilots and she comes across as very prim and proper, vanilla if you will. We have an active personal sex life 4-5 times per week. I am, I guess, a semi cuckold. I love finding out my wife is with someone else, she doesn't know I know, and have that person take photos and vids. She has recently gotten involved with a local doctor who is very much a Dom and has given me a tour of his very expensive and extensive "basement" how outside the lifestyle is this?

My husband is also really turned on by the thought of me with another man. We both have fought our desire for this for a long time, but after 10 years it makes us happier and more in love not to.

I'm in a very difficult position, my other half can act dominant but due to a disability needs a lot of guidance and telling what to do in life in general. I've had to learn to deal with this as I am naturally submissive. However, this has meant at times I have been elsewhere and in some ways this has enhanced my relationship with my other (for example I learnt to orgasm thanks to an affair!!) On the other hand, yes I've felt a lot of guilt.

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Originally Posted by Angelina34

My husband is also really turned on by the thought of me with another man. We both have fought our desire for this for a long time, but after 10 years it makes us happier and more in love not to.

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Good that you found the right way for you, just wondering, why did you fight it??

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Originally Posted by felinefred

I My hope is that I don't fall for him while this is going on.

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Uh, that can be quite hard to avoid..As someone used to say: there is no condom for the heart.

Societal "norms" are bitches. It's hard to let go. It takes more trust (in my humble opinion) to have an open marriage than a physically monogamous one.

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Originally Posted by LO1121

It takes more trust (in my humble opinion) to have an open marriage than a physically monogamous one.

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I read something earlier this evening that really got me thinking about trust vs. jealousy in relationships. In a nutshell, it went like this:

Couple 1 went to a party one night and had an amazing time, but Couple 2 who they are friends with had some difficulties due to the male having jealousy and trust issues. The girls in both couples had been receiving a lot of attention from others throughout the evening and loving every moment of it, occasionally going back to their partners for a few moments just to check-in so to speak. This worked great for Couple 1 who were each doing their own thing for the most part, but the male in Couple 2 would put on a fake smile then continue sulking about his girlfriend. He didn't understand how it couldn't bother Male 1 that his girlfriend was so flirty with other people instead of being with him, to which Male 1 replied it didn't bother him as he trusts her and in the end he knows the girl will be going home with him.

Male 2 obviously feels jealous when his girl gets attention elsewhere, yes he cares but his actions negatively affecting their relationship and enjoyment of the evening. Male 1 however felt proud that he was lucky enough to be with such a beautiful girl who got so much admiration from others, and enjoyed seeing her enjoy herself because there was a level of trust.

Now, from what I understand I assume Couple 1 have a somewhat open relationship whereas Couple 2 is very strictly monogamous. Yet it is Couple 1 who display the deepest level of trust and Couple 2 who battle with emotions of jealousy. Why is that, I wonder, and (how) can we change our own emotional reactions to situations to display the better traits that lead to more enjoyment all round?

Thank you ar1 that's a perfect story and I very much appreciated it.

You are more than welcome LO1121. I always gain a lot from the insights of others in this unpredictable world, it's nice to be able to share stories and feelings.

I think the only way to "change" this jealous behavior is for that husband (through some sort of counseling or 12-step -like group) to work through his issues. Definitions must be created for this discussion. We also need to use them properly. I submit that he is not jealous ... he is "possessive" which is much more sinister in nature. He sulks: a manipulative action meant to cause harm to his wife, to force her back to his side. It is controlling, in effect, her actions. It is also punishing. I believe that jealousy is a normal, healthy "pang" .... a momentary knee-jerk reaction to seeing someone you love gaining more attention, etc. but it is quickly overcome and the healthy attitudes (as you mentinoned above) spring in to complete and therefore mitigate the initial feeling of jealousy. I suggest that persistent jealousy, in which the healthy attitudes of love and selflessness are never manifested, is a synonym for "possessiveness" and will always result in an impossibility for "enjoyment [to be had] all around."

Wow I definitly agree and could never have said it better

*smiles* this one knows what he is talking about thus far...

As I understand that, jealously is defined as 'Feeling or showing a resentful suspicion that one’s partner is attracted to or involved with someone else' yet 'Possessive deemed showing an unwillingness to share one’s possessions' (Oxford UK) definitions apart, agreed.

I agree that the actions described, are totally punishing, as trust should be mutual within clear boundaries. Sulking is such a totally, manipulative thing to do and hell unpleasant for those involved. Given that, which is born from annoyance or disappointment cannot be healthy? Do we not all want successful, happy, fun relationships? But consider what she and he is doing, is hurting' the other person, clearly communication is required. Albeit, I suspect that this is more than likely to be without intent, he/she needs to tell he/her what is required, agrees or disagreed, decisions made.

Just my thoughts, Sett

theres a really good erotic fantasy series based around a hockey team the Dartmouth Cobras which shows quite well how it can work. It's not the perfect series but there is some good stuff in there. I also know quite a few kinksters who are in such a relationship and it just works, theres no issues. Only problem is trying to stop their daughter getting bullied for telling people that she had two Dads and a Mum

I believe the root of jealousy is insecurity. If I am secure in my relationship/s (whether mono OR poly) then there would be no reason for jealousy.

Thus:

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Now, from what I understand I assume Couple 1 have a somewhat open relationship whereas Couple 2 is very strictly monogamous.

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I'm not sure if one can simply make such an assumption.

My 'read' on the described situation is rather:
The man from couple 1 is secure in the place he occupies in his partners life.
The man in couple 2 imo feels threatened. He is insecure about the place he occupies in her life. If he wasn't worried he wouldn't be jealous and most certainly be sulking.

My Doms other girl is my best friend. I Love knowing they are spending time together just as she feels the same way when He is spending time with me.
Why don't I feel jealous? Because I am secure in knowing the role I play in His life.
When I feel a slight twinge....I recognise it as a sign of insecurity and I make sure we address it. And things settle again.

Now, I'm certainly not suggesting All monogamous people who prefer not to share are inherently insecure in their relationships, but rather that jealousy is a flashing light (in mono and poly) of a deeper problem.

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Originally Posted by just_ine

I'm not sure if one can simply make such an assumption.

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Oh my assumption was not based on the story, but on the fact that she goes off and features in porn shoots without him... :-P

*grins* Point made.
Thing is, the point of my post still stands, imo. He is not feeling insecure. Guy nr 2 is.

Bdsm outside of marriage is a sticky proposition. Choosing my words carefully, love and sex are not necessarily the same thing. For instance, I surely love my wife, and our sex life is great. However, there have been women with whom I have had bdsm scenes, which included sexual activity. But, I did NOT love any of them. In fact I have had relationships with women, that were strictly via cyberspace. A lawyer would probably see that as adultery, and it probably is. On the other hand, if a man and a woman have a solid foundation, where jealousy does not rear it's ugly head, I don't see anything wrong with a cyber bdsm relationship.

That's my take on this subject.