BDSM as Utopian Society?

I found this article on a link from the NCSF. Found the subject interesting, and thought it would make a good discussion on here.

Would any of us agree or disagree with the author. Personally I agree. I agree in that BDSM practiced to such an extent to lead your submissive around on a leash all the time will get you, and your partner, uninvited from locations that don't agree with you. Would I enjoy something like it, if it were to work? I doubt it. I doubt it because I enjoy many of the vanilla acitivities that my wife and I enjoy as a couple, outside of the structures of BDSM.

Thoughts?

V/R
ID

Yes I guess I agree with him, but then I'm not interested in a 24/7 M/s kind of relationship anyway.

I'd rather have a 'normal' lifestyle interspersed with D/s & bondage play myself.

Tojo

I found out very quickly yesterday that I can't sub for more than about 2 hours at a time. There are a lot of reasons why that's true for me, but in my present lot in life, I'm not going to be able to find out if any of them can be changed. I spent a lot of time and effort learning how to think for myself; I'm not easily able to give that up for a society like he describes.

Even if I could handle being in "sub mode" for longer periods of time, I still don't think I'd want to live in a 24/7 world.

I think he's dead right with this quote:

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Well, for one thing, healthy BDSM demands some self-examination. In fiction, the characters can sit chained to a wall in a dungeon after a hot, nasty BDSM scene and have a lot of deep thoughts about why they’re so into it. However, in real life, I think a bit of distance, with a head unclouded by endorphins, lends a needed perspective.

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Not to be picky. The article was writen by Mistress Matisse. I don't know if she reads this board, but If I were the one who wrote it, I would want to be correctly refered to. Not a He, but a She. Though I did assume it was written by a male at first as well. No disrespect intended here.

V/R
ID

Absolutely agree with the author. Lee Thompson must be one very, very dedicated chap, because the town in which he was openly displaying his Gorian lifestyle is a pretty backwards place where even a strange hair-cut will draw stares and comments. I know, it's only 45mins down the road from me

Plus, isn't part of the BDSM appeal that you're indulging in an alternative lifestyle and wouldn't you "normalize" by living in a group? Wouldn't you then want something different and more individual? Of course I'm conjecturing based on my own viewpoints and may be taken to task, but I'm fairly sure individualism is part of the appeal, I mean who wants to be "normal" ? :dunno:

Oops. Sorry. Didn't notice the author's name. My apologies.

As for BDSM and being an alternative lifestyle: Sure. But I don't want to live it all the time and I'm pretty sure I don't want to be surrounded by it 24/7.

I think utopian ideas in general would never work. I agree with the author that rigidly-proscribed roles are a very bad idea, especially when you're dealing with something so intimate. The rules of a BDSM relationship should always be set by the individual couple.

I think a lot of utopians just take their own preferences and lifestyles and assume everyone else would flourish under those conditions- and that seems like exactly what this group is doing. It's arrogant and it promotes closed-mindedness.

The REAL "kinky utopia" would be one in which nobody presumes to tell other people what they should enjoy, and no sexual preference is considered unnatural as long as it's safe, sane, and consentual. And we all know how possible that is.

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The rules of a BDSM relationship should always be set by the individual couple.

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My thoughts exactly arwcuw. :wave:


Tojo

I agree with the article. I also believe that anyone who leads another human being around on a leash 24/7 is asking for ridicule. No wonder he is banned from shops in his town.

Also I'm amazed that in todays world he could think that only males could dominate and no male should be submissive. I wonder how many here agree with that. I don't and I'm betting many here in this forum don't either.

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Originally Posted by Warbaby1943

also I'm amazed that in todays world he could think that only males could dominate and no male should be submissive. I wonder how many here agree with that. I don't and I'm betting many here in this forum don't either.

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Hear hear. I've actually read that female dominants are much more common than male dominants. Not sure how reliable the source was, but in any case, it's really stupid to think "men can only be such-and-such". It's really unfair to the men.

i remember reading that article when she first wrote it...I read her column & blog regularly, she's a smart & interesting lady.

I can pretty much just chime in and say that Mistress Matisse is totally right on this one. And I like her observation that she's never heard of an enclave of bisexual switches, they tend to be far more rigid than that.
I prefer my BDSM mixed into my daily life in doses, not as the be-all and end-all of what I do.

Could someone direct to article, it sounds very interesting and would love to read.
Is there a link someone could PM me?

Thank You

It's linked in the original post of this thread, click on 'article'

Or here's the address, without any coding in it

http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/Content?oid=37220

Got it, thank you vistana:)

I think I would rather like living in a community where people wouldn't stare at me if I'm being led around on a leash by some guy. But it would have to also be a community where people wouldn't stare at me if the next day I was leading the same guy around on his leash.

That is to say, societal acceptance and celebration of kinks, yes. Rigidly prescribed roles like that Gor group the article mentions, hell no.

To Curious George - individualism is all well and good, and I'd certainly hate to think of myself as "normal", but I don't think that's why I like BDSM. I'd like not being seen as weird or sick for being submissive.

Could not agree with you more Natalie. I delight in my submission and am not ashamed of it, but have no wish to offend anyone by it either.

In my Utopia, he would have me on his leash when it felt appropriate, but I would also be able to pursue my professional life, albeit wearing an undisguised collar. In practice we are both sure that such behaviours would be disturbing to strangers, many friends and our colleagues.

A 24/7 gorian lifestyle does not appeal to either of us - but being able to freely express - smiles contentedly at the thought.........

cariad

Since I am not good with words, I will just say ditto to cariad

And by the way there were male slaves and female mistresses in Gor.
Just see: Outlaw of Gor, and Fighting slave of Gor for examples

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Originally Posted by Warbaby1943

Also I'm amazed that in todays world he could think that only males could dominate and no male should be submissive. I wonder how many here agree with that. I don't and I'm betting many here in this forum don't either.

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I definately don't agree with that article however, let's face it. In today's society It's not acceptable for men to be submissive(Which is sad to begin with) I can go into detail after detail but, it won't change anything.

In principle I agree with the idea. There is a certain happiness that comes when you are living as you love to live. Whether that is Master or slave, Dom/sub, etc. And whether you male or female.
I live in a Master/slave relationship with my wife, and we can't imagine living any other way. There have been times in our happiness that we have thought how great the world would be if every one lived a M/s life like we do. :span:

It certainly is a wonderful thought, but reality is as it is. Let every one live as they are called to live by their own conscience. That is probably as close as we could ever get to utopia.