Questions on collars

[usafmedic22]

Sir and I were talking about collars last night, and our views on their meaning and significance. Since I am very new to the lifestyle, I am interested in hearing the opinion of others, in all roles. I am going to attempt to explain my views, but please keep in mind that I am very new, and I am not trying to offend anyone or step on anyone’s toes, I’m just tossing it out there to try and help clear up any misconceptions that I have. (And forgive me for rambling)

One of the major hang ups that I’ve had recently is the submissive versus slave debate. Many things that I’ve been told/read about slaves does not appeal to me at all. I guess one of the biggest questions that I need opinions on is What is the difference between a slave and a collared submissive? To me, there’s a big difference. It seems to me that slaves give up much of their individuality, and their independent thought; that their entire worth is dependent on their Dom(me). IMO, a collared submissive retains her individuality, and is much happier collared by their Dom(me) than they would be alone, but does not lose any of their worth in being alone. Another major distinction to me is the idea of a slave being her Master’s property. That makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up, as I wouldn’t take kindly to being told I’m property of someone else. It bothers me because I feel that it reduces me to an inanimate object. I understand that some submissives/slaves enjoy that feeling, but I myself do not. Here’s another example of my view of the differences. I have been told that a slave is very restricted in what they do/say. Things like using the bathroom, etc, have to be requested. I can understand if my Sir and I were at a party, or in conversation, I would certainly ask if he’d mind excusing me for a minute. But if we were just alone in the house or something, I’d probably let him know I’d be right back, but I wouldn’t necessarily ask permission to go to the bathroom. Forgive me, but if I have to go I have to go….lol.

Sir and I are in agreement that a collar is a serious commitment, and has far reaching implications. What those exact implications are, and how far it reaches into the relationship, I’m still unclear on. Overall, I guess I really have two questions that I’m trying to answer…

What is the difference between a collared submissive and a slave?

What changes when a submissive is collared by his/her Dom(me)?

Again, forgive my rambling, and thank you in advance for your help.

medic

[wingsofanangel]

to be honest I think that it really depends upon the Dom and sub. For every couple those terms could mean something different. I tend to believe very closely as you do. But some may take a lighter meaning to the word slave...or even for it to mean the same thing as a sub.

I think really the only way to discover what it means is to have it applied towards you and find out how it makes you feel, what the implications are, how its effects you and your Dom.

I like the term submissive better than slave, however there are times I enjoy being called a slave. As a submissive, there are many ways in which you are a slave to your Master. Does this have to be negative? No, not at all. People can be slaves to.... music... hobbies... food.. etc. Why not a person? Its does not have to suggest an unwanted servitude, only if thats what you and your Dom decide thats what it means for you.

As far as being collared vs. uncollared... nothing -really- changes.... many things stay the same. BUT.. things like trust, bonds, love, can grow. Often times this is when a D/s choose to focus on one another and no longer play with others (unless it is an open relationship)..... more terms may be agreed upon, more training, greater tasks and expectations. BUT with all of that comes much more loyalty, trust, love, etc... you become closer.

Its similiar to the change of dating to marriage. Nothing realllllly changes, the changes are small, but signifigant, meaningful..

Thats what it all means to me anyway.

I would suggest you find out what being a sub and a slave truely mean to you.. without the stereotypes that accompany them, because all things in this lifestyle can be tailored to fit you and your needs with the help of a crafty Dom.

So don't settle on one thing.. describe what you want and need and go from there.. then you will find your place.


I hope that helps.. :/

anya

[MajesticFae]

I agree with wings.

[TomOfSweden]

The collar is a symbol, and as with all symbols we can charge it with what ever we like.

My slave has a dog collar which off-course is because the collar is associated with her being like my dog. Obedient and grateful no matter how harshly I treat and discipline her. And above all, we do love our pets don't we?

The difference is up to you. In a relationship it's the two participants who make the rules.

When my slave got her collar it was like an engagement ring. Very powerful, but nothing changed. We didn't behave any differently and our commitment to each other was the same.

[Eponine]

Hi USA-

I think Wings and Fae and Tom are right- it is just exactly what you and your Sir decide it all is.

But I did want to comment on the slave/ submissive debate...

It's funny, b/c before I ever knew there was a BDSM community, I always dreamed of being somebody's slave (man or woman)- always using that word to myself.

Then, I discovered all this online stuff (around ..22 or so), and got the impression "slave" was a 4-letter-word, so I switched to "submissive", though I never really liked it. But I had understood from many people a slave has no rights, etc... and is the other things you described... which seems to mean that they will allow themselves to be abused.

But I think that's where there's a misconception. A slave does not have to have an abusive Master (or Mistress).

So now, recently, I've met a man who shares all the original thoughts and feelings I had discovered in myself at a very young age, but had to stuff away because I thought it was impossible to be someone's slave.

So I just wanted to share with you my Master's, my sister's, and my view of being a slave-
no, technically we do not have any "rights"- we have given them to Him (and honestly I am still learning, it's a process, though it feels good, it doesn't always come easily, having had to learn survival skills in this world).

But He does not, and I believe will never, abuse that gift. People debate about service being a need or a gift... bla bla, well, yes it's a need I have, but it's still a gift because I will not be just anybody's slave. And it is a gift for Him to be my Master too, of course.


"It seems to me that slaves give up much of their individuality, and their independent thought; that their entire worth is dependent on their Dom(me)."

I have struggled with this concept myself, but so far ( in the very short time it's been), Master didn't just pick anyone to be his inanimate collared property... no, He picked me because He likes my personality and individuality...
Though, if you mean, lose your individuality as in being a separate unit- that's true, but that's so in a marriage... and I don't want to be separate from Him... but it doesn't mean He doesn't hear and encourage and appreciate my own opinions on things, for me to critically think and give input on situations...

About my worth being dependent on Him... well, after 31 years, if I finally found someone to make me feel incredibly valuable, so be it. Even if it's not exactly acceptable in our society, the truth is I wasn't getting it on my own, no matter what I tried.

"I have been told that a slave is very restricted in what they do/say. Things like using the bathroom, etc, have to be requested."

This is totally up to the individual Master/ Mistress. And it could be so with a Dom/ sub as well. But, no in my case, generally, joie and I speak freely- as I said, Master welcomes our opinions anyway. But we just must be respectful- as in I couldn't/ wouldn't sit there and argue and raise my voice (again, a learning process for me now... lol.. yes, mari, mari is quite contrary at times lol), etc...

Sometimes, I think, even if I were a vanilla girl, I would wholeheartedly want to be this man's slave, just to be with Him, because He is so wonderful.

Anyway, I'm sure I rambled as well- it's 4:00 in the morning, and I'm woken up by a roommate clanking around dishes...

But, I just wanted to give my view on it that I don't believe slaves, being property without rights, are or should be treated as inanimate, abused, or lacking individuality. I think that's the Master or Mistress's problem, then, and I wouldn't consider them true Masters or Mistresses if they don't know how to treat a person who is willing to do whatever they wanted and give up their whole lives to them.

I am just so tearfully lucky that I met the man I did. He really is a master, my Master... and I couldn't imagine giving any less to Him. And I wouldn't want Him to want any less than everything I could possibly give Him...

Wow... i hope this makes some kind of sense.. .lol.

I may have gone off on a tangent, I apologize.. but I had been thinking recently about this slave/ sub debate and wanted to ask some questions, post some two cents.

Either way, USA, good luck with your collaring (as Wings said, that's just like getting married, it's still the same relationship, hopefully with a foundation to keep growing stronger) and your relationship! Congrats as well!

[Warbaby1943]

Talk it over between the two of you and as everyone else has said make it fit what you need. Give up only the control you feel comfortable giving up. If anything is forced from or on you you could end up resenting the relationship.

What I find most rewarding is being able to talk things over before, after, or even during any activities. As long as you both are happy with what you decide it will work out fine for you.

A collar is what you want it to be and what you want it to mean. Ours is a ring and it means commitment to each other in all we can commit from what our lives allow.

I won't get into the slave vs. submissive debate except to say I personally don't like the term slave.

[annie]

The term slave it just that a term... just as submissive is no more then a term.

i know "subs" who are actually slaves (from my perspective) and "slaves" who make me question at times if they are even subs because of how much freedom (one again from my perspective) they are given. The term that fits best for your relationship is what is important, nothing more. Just as the rules established by your relationship is what is important.

i do need to say that "slaves" do not become inanimate objects, give up much of their individuality, and their independent thought or have their entire worth is dependent on their Dom(me). That may be the "impression" that is given but 99.9% of the "slaves" i know still have themselves and make the choice, in all things, to follow the lead of their Dominate. i personally think that makes them understand their entire worth more so. Because of the training, dedication and commitment needed to give that type of free service. And yes, i am a firm believe that even a slave is giving their services freely... if they didn't want to be a slave for that Dom/me, they wouldn't be there.

The slave/sub debate is an old one and as everyone knows just a matter of definition which needs to be worked out in advance with one's Dominate.

As to the collar... it is a symbol. Just like a wedding ring and means a higher level of commitment, trust, etc. But, once again, it is what each couple views the symbol. i know some who believe in velcro collars, which can be easily removed when the next "more interesting" person comes along and some who believe in the permanent collar, that will never be removed. It is what works for each person/couple in a relationship, as long as no one is hurt unnecessarily, etc. and enters the relationship with a full understanding of what the collar means.

Just my 2 cents worth.

[Flaming_Redhead]

What is the difference between a collared submissive and a slave?

These definitions were obtained from Wikipedia. I hope this helps to alleviate your misgivings. It can be hard to come to terms with your innermost desires versus what your brain tells you is "right." The great thing about having a mind of your own is that you can assimilate the information people give you and either accept it or reject it depending on what works best for YOU.

A submissive is one who enjoys having any of a variety of BDSM practices performed upon them by a dominant; or one who holds a submissive position within a relationship based upon dominance and submission (D/s). This enjoyment can spring from a simple desire for submission or an enjoyment of the interplay of wills involved in such a scenario. A submissive is also referred to as a "sub", where the dominant in a D/s relationship is the 'Dom.'

The main difference between a submissive and a bottom is that the submissive ostensibly does not give instructions, although they do set limits on what the Dominant can do.

There are also indications that submissives substantially outnumber Dominants[citation needed], in both males and females. Professional Dominants provide stimulatory services (which may or may not include sex) for those unable to find a compatible partner for this activity.

There are some indications that preference in D/s activities follows a 'compensatory' pattern[citation needed], with people who have much power and responsibility in real life often preferring a submissive role; no hard scientific data to either confirm or reject this hypothesis seem to exist, however.

In many BDSM communities, there is a distinction between a submissive and a slave. In this context, a slave's goal is surrender and obedience. In contrast, a submissive tends to expect some gratification in return for his or her submission.

Slave is a term often used in BDSM to connote a specific form of submissive. A sexual roleplay or consensual slave could also be a masochist or bottom, but this is not always the case.

Connotatively it refers to highly committed domination and submission (commonly abbreviated as D/s) relationships, as a person who has surrendered their personal property and freedoms to another, who has become the property or chattel of their owner(s). This term is widely used, as it has a certain self-affirming weight.

Some practitioners feel the difference between submissive and slave is the degree of submission. However, many who are involved in Master/slave relationships see the difference as one in kind, not in degree. In particular, some slaves do not have a naturally submissive personality, but simply choose to surrender their will and volition to another.

It should be noted that the Owner/slave relationship is entered into on a strictly consensual basis, without the legal force of historical or modern non-consensual slavery. It is also worth mentioning that the laws of most countries (for example the Thirteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution) strictly forbid the practice of slavery.

Various forms of symbolism are sometimes used to affirm the Owner/slave relationship, such as wearing the owner's collar, being registered in a slave register, adopting (sometimes legally changing to) a name chosen by the owner, or engaging in a public declaration or ritualized ceremony of some type. Some people draw up a slave contract that defines the relationship in explicit detail, but these have no legal weight and are therefore not intended to be used in any court of law.

In some traditional rituals, after signing a slave contract, many people celebrate the commitment to the relationship with a collaring ceremony, which can be simple or elaborate and friends are usually invited. The slave then wears a collar, which symbolizes their status. The collar may be an actual piece of neckwear, or may be a bracelet or other piece of jewellery that symbolizes their slavery. These collars are generally never removed unless or until the relationship is dissolved, although some slaves exchange a formal collar for a more subdued (or less obtrusive) one in work and vanilla situations.

There is considerable debate over the exact definition of the word "slave" as it pertains to BDSM. Many people believe that you are a slave if you consider yourself one, whilst others believe one must be in the emotional state of Total Power Exchange or Internal Enslavement for the term to apply.

There are differences of opinion about whether one needs to be currently owned to be identified as a slave. Many in the Mistress/Master-slave community do not feel that ownership is a requirement.

What changes when a submissive is collared by his/her Dom(me)?

That's like asking, "What changes when one gets married?" Nothing....everything. *smiles* Hopefully, the relationship will continue to develop as trust and respect for each other grows, allowing you to explore your desires, fulfill your fantasies and live a life you have only dreamed of....one where you are free to be yourself and encouraged to be totally honest. One in which you are regarded in the highest esteem by your dominant for your service, giving you the confidence to command the respect of others as well as having a healthy self-respect. Of course, this is just my opinion. It all depends on what your expectations are and whether those expectations are voiced and acknowledged/agreed upon. It's usually a good idea to write them down so they can be included in your contract. That way, everyone is in agreement on what is expected. As far as the different stages of collaring as given by Wikipedia, I haven't read about this still being followed by many, if anyone, in today's community. Like I said, it's whatever works best for YOU.

In the old guard leather community there were three stages of collaring. These are still informally followed by some in the BDSM community. The "collar of consideration" was the first and roughly analogous to a pre-engagement ring. This collar could be removed at any time by the submissive with no ill will and the relationship would be ended. The "training collar" is roughly analogous to an engagement ring and indicates a deepening relationship in which the submissive is being prepared by the dominant to serve to the standards the dominant wishes. Again, the submissive may ask to be released but the break is considered more serious and painful for both parties. Finally, the "slave collar" is analogous to a wedding band and at this point the submissive is considered a formal slave and owned by the dominant. In the old guard leather community this was considered permanent with no chance to end unless the submissive was released by the dominant for some exceptional reason. Simple failure of service was not adequate since that showed a failure on the part of the dominant as well as the slave. As with engagement and wedding rings there are traditions with collars in regard to type of materials and colors that are appropriate to each type, usually becoming more elaborate.

[Guest 91108]

Hrmm ..
I consider WV both ringed in marriage and collared permanent as submissive.
I consider Wlg to be more "velcro" collared as i know in time she may grow and we may grow apart. I can accept that.
I think as has been stated above .. each relationship is different and is all up to the discussions between the two.
Both are very workable if worked out ahead of time. And openly discussed when the need arises from either side.

[Masters_diamond]

Hi
I just wanted to say that when my Master collared me,everything changed.This meant that i was his owned property and slave. I have no rights,and yes i have to ask permission for everything.but this is what i wanted,someone to control me and own me.

Masters_diamond < owned by Masterdarkone

[Eponine]

diamond:

just wanted to say i too enjoy the "micromanagement" and i wanted to ask you- as your master's collared property and slave with no rights, do you feel less of a person or individual? I just wanted another slave's input, since usafmedic22 expressed this in her original question.

[Ocean_Soul]

Many issues and questions come down to working it out with your partner this included, as you can see. There are no rules that dictate if someone is called on thing they lose their individuality and if they are called another they do not. Does he treat you like an object or not? Are his ideas on how much you should be controlled make you uncomfortable or wet? It’s important to talk about anything that makes you uncomfortable and come to an understanding of each other. Likewise anything that you think you would enjoy should be discussed as well. And hopefully that understanding will lead to a situation that is both enjoyable and beneficial to you both.

[Masters_diamond]

Hello Mari
As my Masters Owned Slave and Property I guess my answer would be i am a person but i am my Masters property and I have to go by what my Master says no matter what.i belong to my Master. I am a person whom is used by him.i don't feel less of a person,but also i am an object for my Masters use.

Masters_diamond

[ceegee{Benz}]

As people has said in posts before this one...each relationship is different.

I myself am slave to Master Benz...I am his owned property for him to as and when he wishes.
but..........
I am also his equal...his partner...his life.
I wear a fine gold chain around my neck that has never come off...that is my perminant collar. I also have a matching anklet made from the same chain as what is around my neck.
Master asks...I do.
I also wear his ring...making me not just his slave but his wife to be.
Altho being his slave..I do also have opinions and a voice and this Master values and is always asking for my imput on things. I have not lost full independancy...not yet anyway but if I want to do something I still have to ask permission for.
Master does not want me to loose any part of my individuality as it is who I am...and it is who I am that made him fall in love with me in the first place.
But...and i am rambling
my soul and my totally being belongs to him

[cadence]

I understand that each couples views on collared submisive vs. slave are based on thier own opinions and ideas.

I have a bit of difficulty understanding the control part of the relationship.
Forgive me if I am hijacking this thread in a different direction, but I was curious about some things.

My interpretation is that a person who loses thier individuality regardless of whether they are an owned slave or submissive is borderlining on more of an abusive relationship. That is just my own opinion.

My curiousity lies in what a sub or slave gives up in the relationship. I am not referring to anything pertaining to any sexual play, but the average daily things vanilla people would not consider asking permission for.

Although my boyfriend and I do not live a D\s relationship, at times I think we borderline it.
While he did guide me and control most of my decisions, he gave me plenty of freedom to do what I pleased. However when I was asked to do something for him, I had never denied any of his requests.
I was happy to do whatever he asked of me, and would even rearrange my schedule to suit him.
Maybe it is because I have that deep seeded need to do this, as I still do, and he appreciates it.
The only thing we lack is any discipline or punishments when I do not do things his way.

So before I start to ramble on more, what are the things a collared sub or slave give up in the relationship, and what are the things you do not have to give up control of.

[_ID_]

medic was looking for some insight on her perceptions on the idea of a collar. The "its what you make of it" she already knew. she was looking for personal views more than politically safe views.

My view of a collar is it states that the bottom/submissive is in a committed relationship.

The dynamic of that relationship is unknown until stated by the bottom. As far as I am concerned, if the sub is collared, and it were to be to me. If she is submissive, then thats just what she is, my committed submissive. Committed to the relationship as we desire it. Committed to submitting to me as I require. On the other hand, if she is slave, and I am talking 24/7 slave, not bedroom slave or playtime slave. If she is slave, then her voice in the relationship is valued, but only heeded when I find usefulness in what she has to say. Safe words as a submissive knows them would be reduced in weight, as they would only be for an emergency, not "I can't do this anymore". When I say emergency, I'm talking "either i get to pee, or i steam clean the carpet" kind of emergency. A slave gets only as much personal freedoms as her Master would allow. If that means she doesn't do anything until told to do so, then thats what it is. Personally, I don't like that level of protocol in a relationship. I find it to be time consuming and monotonous.

medic and I are in lengthy discussions about what a collar means to each of us, and what we want in a D/s relationship. It was from these conversations that I told her to pose the question to the forms, get the opinion of some others. Widen the perspective, and then formulate her own views from what information she gathered. Then we talk some more, and figure out what direction we want to go.

ID

[cadence]

Sorry I just got too curious

[Ocean_Soul]

she was looking for personal views more than politically safe views.

Did you mean to say "personal views as opposed to general views"?

Because I don't think anyone here being coy for the sake of political correctness.

[cariad]

...My view of a collar is it states that the bottom/submissive is in a committed relationship. ...

I would agree with you ID, to me a collar is symbolic of commitment to each other and commitment to whatever that relationship may be.

In the same way that I have learnt to never try and understand how other people's marriages work, I have given up trying to understand how other people's bdsm relationships work, we are all so different.

He whom I choose to serve has not given me a collar since I have not yet agreed to marry him. His logic, which I agree with, is that since I still have a reservation about making the commitment of marrying him, I cannot be fully committed to the relationship, and therefore I am not in a position to accept his collar.

At the other end of the spectrum, I have respect for online collars if it is an established relationship and both parties are as fully committed to each other as their circumstances permit.

I would disagree with one point however - to me a collar shows that both Dom/me and sub are in a committed relationship, even though it is only the sub who wears it.

cariad

[ceegee{Benz}]

I would disagree with one point however - to me a collar shows that both Dom/me and sub are in a committed relationship, even though it is only the sub who wears it.

cariad

My Master wears my collar...of sorts lolol.
When I accepted his collar he also accepted a neckchain of mine that is a family heirloom. The pendant is an anchor.
Not only does he carry a picture of us but he also has a piece of me close to his heart at all times.
is a bit like exchanging weddings rings...is how i can explain it

[MajesticFae]

My Master wears my collar...of sorts lolol.
When I accepted his collar he also accepted a neckchain of mine that is a family heirloom. The pendant is an anchor.
Not only does he carry a picture of us but he also has a piece of me close to his heart at all times.

That's beautiful, ceegee! It's a little funny, that's wonderful that he keeps that piece of you close to his heart.

I agree with Warbaby and cariad too that the collar signifies a commited relationship between Dom/me and sub.

[tessa]

~hugs you tight~

That is beautiful, sweetie!

[Warbaby1943]

I would disagree with one point however - to me a collar shows that both Dom/me and sub are in a committed relationship, even though it is only the sub who wears it.

cariad

I have to agree with this statement. It is how I have felt for a long time and the reason I could never understand how two or three could wear the collar of one Dom/me at the same time. I guess I could understand a Dom/me having more than one sub but I don't understand more than one of them being collared at the same time. I guess I am old fashioned probably because I am old but that is my opinion.

[_ID_]

I would disagree with one point however - to me a collar shows that both Dom/me and sub are in a committed relationship, even though it is only the sub who wears it.

cariad

Since the thread was about what a collar signified for a submissive, I didn't include my thoughts on it from the Dominants perspective, though I did elude to them I think.

So since it was brought up, I will clarify. I did say that a collar signifies that the sub is in a committed relationship, one that I would desire. Just so there isn't a misunderstanding, yes, I would be also committed to that relationship as the sub and I defined it.

[usafmedic22]

cadence...no worries hun, ID's post was not a reply to yours, just another post in response to mine. It wasn't a redirect or anything.
Now...onto your questions...maybe me stumbling through them will help me answer mine...who knows so why not?
As far as losing individuality, I understand what you're saying about it bordering on abuse, but I think that is rarely the intent. And coming out of an abusive relationship myself, I can tell you that it's hard to recognize and even harder to tear yourself away from, despite it destroying you...alas but i digress.....
I can't tell you about what a slave/submissive gives up in a D/s relationship, because i'm so new. What I can tell you is that you are describing a personality very similar to mine. I was always the same way with my husband, constantly working to please and appease him, regardless of how those things affected me. I'm not saying yours are detrimental to you as mine were, just that we are similar in that way. In fact, there is a major difference in the fact that he recognizes and appreciates everything you do for him, whereas mine never did.
Anyway, I'm going to shut up now, but I wanted to make sure that you didn't think Sir was trying to redirect you, I've spoken with him and he wasn't. And I wanted to point out that we have some things in common. I'm hoping the responses to this thread will continue, and we can both learn more...
medic

[cadence]

cadence to help with your question a little it depends on personallity of the sub. My pet is more of a slave than a sub she needs boundries and she wants many things in her like to be decide by her dominate. Collar sub gives up less than a slave. A sub personallity want to keep more of herself. A collar slave has a more rooted personality of being a slave want needs desires boundries want too be told when to do sometime more restictions tha a sub. But just remember which i do she is still the women i love and protect and even her being my slave her well being in everything comes first to me.
MrDom

Thanks for your input.

cadence...no worries hun, ID's post was not a reply to yours, just another post in response to mine. It wasn't a redirect or anything.
Now...onto your questions...maybe me stumbling through them will help me answer mine...who knows so why not?
As far as losing individuality, I understand what you're saying about it bordering on abuse, but I think that is rarely the intent. And coming out of an abusive relationship myself, I can tell you that it's hard to recognize and even harder to tear yourself away from, despite it destroying you...alas but i digress.....
I can't tell you about what a slave/submissive gives up in a D/s relationship, because i'm so new. What I can tell you is that you are describing a personality very similar to mine. I was always the same way with my husband, constantly working to please and appease him, regardless of how those things affected me. I'm not saying yours are detrimental to you as mine were, just that we are similar in that way. In fact, there is a major difference in the fact that he recognizes and appreciates everything you do for him, whereas mine never did.
Anyway, I'm going to shut up now, but I wanted to make sure that you didn't think Sir was trying to redirect you, I've spoken with him and he wasn't. And I wanted to point out that we have some things in common. I'm hoping the responses to this thread will continue, and we can both learn more...
medic

And thanks for clarifying that for me, I thought that maybe by sneaking in my own question, I had overstepped my boundries in someone else's post.
Seeing that I am new to everything, and still trying to understand and learn, I can't really offer any opinions, only those that are based mostly on assumptions.


I think that just_annie explained her feelings towards receiving a collar perfectly. After reading her post I understand the concept of how a sub would feel regarding collars, and ceegee explains that as well in just a simple sentence.

[_ID_]

No. I meant what I said. People don't voice what they think. So they state the view that is more accepted. It's what you make of it, is not how submissives feel about their own collar. medic was looking for those personal views.

[Ocean_Soul]

No. I meant what I said. People don't voice what they think. So they state the view that is more accepted. It's what you make of it, is not how submissives feel about their own collar. medic was looking for those personal views.

My apologies IDCrewDawg. But if the opinions of others are treated with the contempt, only a 6 word sweeping generalization can provide, I hope you won’t mind if I simply not bother sharing them in the first place.

[_ID_]

My apologies IDCrewDawg. But if the opinions of others are treated with the contempt, only a 6 word sweeping generalization can provide, I hope you won’t mind if I simply not bother sharing them in the first place. You clearly know the minds of people better than they do anyway, so no real loss.

No idea where you got the contempt for others thoughts. If your feelings were hurt by my post. I don't apologize, as I state my opinions regardless if they hurt or not. I figure it's better to be honest in how I feel about something, rather than dancing around it.

annie - Yes that was wonderful, thank you!

[Ocean_Soul]

No idea where you got the contempt for others thoughts. If your feelings were hurt by my post. I don't apologize, as I state my opinions regardless if they hurt or not. I figure it's better to be honest in how I feel about something, rather than dancing around it.

*sigh* I'm sending you a PM telling you exactly what I was trying to say. And no, I wasn't hurt.