Safe Words and Safety Concerns

[sisterhoney61 {RW}]

I belong to a forum/message board that is geared towards women, but men are welcome as well. It has message boards on parenting and child care, diet and health, home and gardening, etc. It also has several boards about sex. The vast majority of the people there are vanilla, though there are a few kinky people there. Anyway, there is a male sub on that board who is married, but his wife isn't in the scene. He is going to spend some time with a Domme at a play party where he will serve her and the other people there. The thing is, that if he uses his safe word or stops the action in any way he will not be invited back and the Domme will cut off all contact with him.

I've been trying to come up with a way to respond to him that doesn't sound alarmist. By not allowing the use of a safe word that is telling me that the safety of the sub is not paramount to the Domme. I have been with my Master for 10 years and I always have the use of my safe word. You never know when something is going to go wrong. This male sub says he knows this Domme "very well," but that doesn't mean that she won't unknowingly push him too far.

What is everyone else's opinions about the use of safe words? I know that there are couples in M/s relationships that say that the slave has no right to use a safe word, since the slave has no rights and has surrender all control to the Master. I won't argue that point, because I was a slave in the past. But what about Dom/me/sub couples? Do all subs have the right of the use of a safe word? Should not the safety of the sub be the Dom/me's main priority? Should not the sub's own safety also be his/her concern and when the sub needs to stop the action he/she should be able to and not have to worry about the Dom/me getting pissed off about it?

[sadiej]

i will admit that i am very new to all of this. but my opinion is that forbidding the use of a safe word is like having no safe word at all.

even if i know my Master well and trust him. knowing that he demands that i have this for our mutual protection makes me trust him more... not less.

that trust makes me less likely to ever use or need that safe word,

just a the 2 cent opinoin of a "newbie" sub.

[Hime]

Yeah. In an M/s relationship, the idea (at least in those I've heard of) is that the two people know each other well enough that they can communicate without using a safe word. On the other hand, the people you're talking about are total strangers. It seems ridiculously unsafe to me to go into a scene with a Domme you've never met before who has admitted that she intends to pressure you to not use a safe word or otherwise consider your own safety. Nobody should be shamed or pressured about their limits or safety concerns -- that's how very serious accidents and injuries happen.

[Euryleia]

My ears are ringing from the alarm bells. It is one thing to have a relationship that has moved beyond the use of safewords (a concept I'll happily debate). It is entirely another to use the threat of ending the relationship if someone uses their word. A safe word is there for the health and wellbeing of the submissive, not a weapon of the Dominant.

Further, going to a play party, where other people are involved, under such conditions is very unsafe. The Domme has no idea what could possibly happen and to hold such a threat over her sub shows a striking lack of concern for his personal safety.

[denuseri]

i have never used or even mentioned the use of safe words with my owner, but as others have allready stated we have a long established relationship, though knowing my Master so well, i am sure he would never push anyone to far

i once had a dom that said the very same thing you are talking about sisterhoney, if i had used the safe word he had given me it was tantamont to me breaking all future contact with him,,, which eventually i did

its a classic sign of dominant insecurity in my opinion to manipulate a safe word in such a way, some of us press on and deal with it, some of us avoid those types of doms, and others even see it as a kinda ironic carrot with repercussions to dangle in front of the sub

based soely of the information provided however, i would reccomend that he seek to communicate to his dominant the need for a more stable relationship and that for him to really build up a sence of trust with her he needs for the time being a safe word that doesnt hold a sword of deamocles with reprisal over his head

[dewran59]

Safeword is vital for both parties. Doing a play party where two people doesn't even know each other well is like playing a Russian roulette.

I would be concerned and place a huge??? regarding with the Dommes action if he uses safeword. Fair enough, if the Dommes doesn't like the safeword, it's her responsibilities and obligations to protect her sub for safety reason specially where there are other people involved. As what everyone point out here...communication, communication and get to know what your limits are and be able to trust the person involved.

Lastly, use your common sense...

[mighty_marc]

Basically the bdsm community strognly believes in the significance of a safe word and it is obvious that a dom who forbids his sub the use of such a word has got anything else in mind than his subs wellbeing.

It is however so that I had never had a safe words in my former relationships, not because I didn't believe in it, but first of all because it didn't come into our mind. With my first bdsm partner I had been leading a long relationship before whe have entered into the bdsm world together and very slowly. We could read each other's mind and there has always been a lot of coummunication about how a scene would be played in the beginning.
Well, this certainly is a very beautiful was of living bdsm, not because the lack of a safe word enhances the dom's power, but because such a relationship shows how close two people can melt together, how eternal trust is and how important the sub's happiness is for her dom.
I anyway lov the thought of a man being able to read the woman's mind, to see her feelings and mood before she realizes them herself, so that he will always create the atmosphere in such a way that she feels beautifully loved and taken care of, be it in vanilla or bdsm.

It is however so that if I entered a bdsm relationship now (Silvie, if you read this, please catch my virtual kisses; I adore you), there definitely had to be a safe word, as it takes long time until two partners come so close that there is 100% certainty of no misunderstandings. It is however so that I first of all believe into the necessity of communication and the necessity to first give warmth and love to a partner before it comes to bdsm. I am not the one who could see bdsm as a technical process to satisfy any needs; for me it can only happen in a partnership, in which love, care, respect and warmth are the most important feelings.

[Logic1]

I honestly dont get why the Domme wouldnt allow him to use his safeword. That is just crazy and nowhere near SSC.
I never went that far with my current gf that she needed to use her safeword but then again I dont really intend to get there either.
If he needs to use a safeword the Dom/Domme/Master/Mistress failed imho. Yes I know it isnt really that simple but to take away his use of a safeword just sounds stupid to me.

[leo9]

It's almost reduntant to add another voice, but I have met this "you have a safeword but don't you dare use it" trick, and it stinks. I agree that all it shows is the Dom's insecurity. In a new contact where people don't know each other, safewords are for the Dom's safety as well as the sub's. The only casual sub who ever accused me of abuse was one who got so caught up in her victim role that she forgot she had a safeword!

Established relationships, of course, are a whole nother matter, and my experience is of starting with a safeword and phasing it out over time. Sometimes it's a step in the relationship when the sub is told she no longer has a safeword, sometimes it's just allowed to go out of use. In extremis under sexual torture my ex-slave routinely yelled every safeword she knew, before telling me furiously that as soon as I untied her she was going right round to the police to charge me with rape: but she would have been horribly disappointed if I had stopped.

[DowntownAmber]

You know, I'm not sure why so many people think safewords are there simply for the sub? Even the most experienced couples can have unexpected issues that do not resemble their typical sessions and a safeword is one precaution (note I say "one" precaution ) to help ensure overall safety and success. A friend of mine suffered an annurism (not really sure of the spelling on that) this weekend and there were no outward indications - he had to describe to his partner that there was something wrong and how he felt. They dealt with it based on that - same thing in a session, a Dom/me deserves the safeword and the communication from their sub. It's not a failing, I think it's a sign of respect and depth of relationship.

[Dr_BuzzCzar]

I can't imagine anyone being foolish enough to go into a play party situation with strangers that add that type caveat to the invitation. Every flag and alarm I have go off at that.

I too have been married to my sub for over 10 years and there is no safeword for us. That's what works in our dynamic, other's may vary. I'm not going into a long discussion of how that happened or defending that decision. Suffice to say we're comfortable with things as they are. Having said that, never in all my years have I scened with a sub without a discussion and a safeword. Trust must be earned and the domme in this situation gives off a very untrustworthy vibe.

[sisterhoney61 {RW}]

Thanks for E/everyone's replies so far. Apparently this sub went to the play party with the Domme and her friends. He's giving the forum bits and pieces about what happened there and so far he's said that everything went well. This time anyway. Oh, yeah, besides not being able to use his safeword he had to be deemed "worthy" of being with Domme and the others. Sometimes I think that should be the other way around!

[leo9]

I can't imagine anyone being foolish enough to go into a play party situation with strangers that add that type caveat to the invitation.

I can, alas. Since there are (for reasons that would make another thread) dozens of male subs for every Domme, needy subs can be desperate enough to go along with any condition however abusive. That's why it's good to have communities like this to uphold standards that protect vulnerable people.