Education... where is it these days?

[The Lord Winter]

I disagree.



And therein lies the crux of the problem with your vision.

The entire lifestyle is based on consensuality. The moment you remove that you commit what is called false imprisonment or in some places kidnapping. Both slave and submissive must have the ability to leave a relationship should they desire. This single requirement invalidates your definition, and makes the definition of submissive and slave nearly impossible to define for everyone.

Actually, consent can be coerced, even forced. The entire lifestyle is based upon TRUST. The moment you remove that, you create resentment in your partner and they start looking for a way out of your control, and out of your life. The requirement of consensuality, while valid, is tagential to the point you make on slavery. A slave is, by definition, a piece of property. If you, as a Master or Mistress, do not make the slave feel owned, you are falling short in your duties, and will soon find yourself asked for the release of your charge. Ownership and possession are paramount to the mindset of a slave, and must be tended first and foremost in all aspect of the relationship... personal life included.

The better way to proceed would be to give someone who's new an idea of what a slave mindset might be based on, and what a submissive mindset might be based on. Then let them decide how they want to apply either or neither to their relationship.

For example, you did say that a slave derives pleasure out of serving their Master. This a submissive can also do. Derive pleasure out of serving their dominant. A foot rub, cleaning house in a maids outfit are two examples that can be done by either submissive or slave. It is the mindset while doing so, and the context in which it is done that makes the difference. Both are individual to the people involved, and so makes it impossible to define.

Well, to start with, you quoted me accurately with the website function, then misread my words. I said a slave DEFINES their pleasure through PLEASING their master. There is a fundamental difference here. One does not have to serve directly or even indirectly to please. It may be the master's pleasure to treat the slave as a complete pain toy, yet the slave has no particular affinity for pain, but enjoys being treated as such because it is pleasing to their master. You also neglected the rest of my definitions on submissives and slaves entirely. Slaves do not believe they have the right to set limits. It becomes the master's responsibility to uncover what is traumatic for the slave, what is neutral, and what is enjoyable. This is vastly different from a submissive, as the sub as the right to set limits from the beginning. Furthermore, the sub has the right to walk away from the relationship, collared or not, without question. The slave, while in the eyes of the law, does as well, if the Master or Mistress is doing their job correctly, then the slave will feel that they MUST beg for release or else remain until released.

Principles are not rules, they are principles. Rules are laws, and save for the consensuality aspect of our lifestyle, there are no hard and fast rules or laws. So how is a sub to expect to be treated fairly you ask? By negotiating the conditions of their submission. Each person, bottom/submissive/slave, does this before entering into a relationship with a Top/Dominant/Master. How else would you be able to come to an agreement of what safe words to use, what things are limits, both hard and soft? Once those conditions have been agreed upon, the person submitting, be it a single scene or a 24/7 relationship, has the expectation that the Top/Dominant/Master will respect those boundaries. Not doing so removes the consensuality aspect I mentioned earlier, and becomes abuse. People who are abusive have no business in BDSM, nor any relationship for that matter.

I could not disagree more with your use of semantics here. Principles are rules if nothing else, especially when they become personal principles. These principles serve as a guide to all aspects of the person involved. Rules are NOT laws. I have yet to visit a public pool where the rules were codified law, or any other public locale for that matter. I have already addressed the issue of consensuality versus trust in my previous paragraph, and will not resort to redundancy in order to drive that point further. Also, in my previous paragraph, I addressed the issues of limits and the slave versus sub mindset, though, I freely admit to agreeing with you on the negotiation. It is paramount to forging any BDSM relationship. However, once again, when dealing with a slave, it becomes the Master's responsibility to discover what is traumatic for the slave, as the slave will not likely be willing to set limits upon the Master if the person sees the Master as someone suitable to meet their needs.

There are multiple ways to swing a flogger. The key is knowing what areas not to hit, and how to prevent serious injury. There are multiple ways to use a cane, knowing how to prevent serious injury with it is the part we can pass on. Technique for either is something we can show, and let the person learning decide for themselves if that is the technique they wish to use. So is it windmill or Florentine for swinging a flogger, wrap-arounds or not when striking the body? Some people want the wrap-arounds, some don't. Some people can't do windmill, some can't do Florentine, so give both, and let them decide. Again principles of technique, rules of consensuality and what areas of the body to avoid are things we teach, the rest is up to them to define for themselves.

While I agree that there are multiple safe ways to swing a flogger, and also to use many of the tools of our trade, I must call you to task on the issue of wraparound. Wraparound is a result of a poor aim. How can you defend something so obviously a result of poor technique, when you spoke just a few sentences before that to the importance of preventing serious injury. If one cannot properly hit where one is aiming, how is it that injury is to be avoided?