Deconstructing O,

[Mad Lews]

I had the audacity to post a story several months ago concerning the final fate of O. I was chastised a bit for my crudeness and cruelty and it was patiently explained to me that I just didn't understand the story. This lead to some interesting conversations with my part time proof reader and editor as to both the legality of appropriating fictional characters, and more interestingly Why "The Story of O" is such a literary icon to the BDSM community. I mean Rice's Sleeping Beauty is all right and Hamilton writes an amusing yarn but nothing really comes close to "The Story of O". Part of it's allure is it's one of the first to be widely published, part is the language and sensitivity,. Some would say it's because a woman wrote it I think a good part of it is the way the eroticism is so laconic. Much is said with so few words and the reader is made to imagine the details. I would be interested in other's thoughts on the matter. Mad Lews

[Mobius]

If I am not mistakin, at the end of the story of O in one of alternative endings Sir Steffen wanted to give her to another and O would rather die than leave sir steffen so he abliged her.
So in effect Stoy of O is a snuff story.
So I do not see how you could be crueler than that.

[Mad Lews]

Ahh there is snuff and then there is snuff. but what I was curious about was not the ending or other alternative endings but what makes the story itself so diffrent from other BDSM tales

[Ruby]

Its hard to discuss this particular book because it evokes so many different feelings...

I read your ending and thought you did a nice job of capturing the
way I felt about Stephen.

O, like Beauty, fell in love with her submission.
Beauty fell in love with each master for what
they could give her and teach her. She was a cherished slave
and eventually discovers herself and what she wants/needs and
is willing to pursue it.

But unlike Anne Rice's Beauty, O's relationship with her masters, including Stephen, was especially abusive. She is permanently marked - branded - and as Mobius points out she is allowed to end her life. If you read the other alternative ending, then she never regains her freedom.

With a healthy relationship, submission is a form of its own power.
I often wondered what power O had besides submitting. She didn't
seem to ever say "no".

* Steps away and prepares for the flaming arrows to arrive *

For those of you who haven't read the tale, it is available in text format free on many web sites.

[Mad Lews]

Its hard to discuss this particular book because it evokes so many different feelings...

I read your ending and thought you did a nice job of capturing the
way I felt about Stephen.

O, like Beauty, fell in love with her submission.
Beauty fell in love with each master for what
they could give her and teach her. She was a cherished slave
and eventually discovers herself and what she wants/needs and
is willing to pursue it.

But unlike Anne Rice's Beauty, O's relationship with her masters, including Stephen, was especially abusive. She is permanently marked - branded - and as Mobius points out she is allowed to end her life. If you read the other alternative ending, then she never regains her freedom.

With a healthy relationship, submission is a form of its own power.
I often wondered what power O had besides submitting. She didn't
seem to ever say "no".

* Steps away and prepares for the flaming arrows to arrive *

For those of you who haven't read the tale, it is available in text format free on many web sites.

I have to agree with you that unlike R/L O does not exchange power but revels in surrendering it. Therefore she becomes the perfect (if unreal) foil for the true sadist. (and perhaps the perfect hero for the true masochist).----Mad Lews

[Ruby]

...Therefore she becomes the perfect (if unreal) foil for the true sadist. (and perhaps the perfect hero for the true masochist).----Mad Lews

That's it! Well said. And perhaps the reason why her character remains so beloved long after the tale itself fades into memory.

[Athenna]

I have to agree with you that unlike R/L O does not exchange power but revels in surrendering it. Therefore she becomes the perfect (if unreal) foil for the true sadist. (and perhaps the perfect hero for the true masochist).----Mad Lews

Just like all the legends that has been remebered much better than others, the only factor that keeps this story alive in people's head is .. the DRAMA.

Even in BDSM, similar to normal life, people look up at different characters as role models, and sympathize with them, specially when they have not been treated well for their achievements. Like the female submissive character in Story of O, and Male sub in Venus in Furs. Both are remembered cause of the sad endings.

... And after all, melancholic sad ends effects rather more than happy ones!!

AconitE.

[ProjectEuropa]

I can't say the Story Of O ever did anything for me. I saw the film in France in the seventies but didn't realise it was the Story Of O until I saw the film again on late night TV only last year. I never read the story until a couple of years ago. Maybe I came to it too late and time has rendered it too polite and reserved. Certainly compared to writing you find on this site the Story Of O is a walk in the park! It's obviously an icon but its attraction is still lost on me.

[masterk]

Does anyone know where I can buy the DVD in the UK?

[masterk]

Does anyone know where I can buy the DVD in the UK?

[Mad Lews]

Does anyone know where I can buy the DVD in the UK?

I guess not, sorry

[Nikita]

I guess not, sorry

*snicker* Try eBay.

[Mad Lews]

Actually Amazon.com.UK has it for between seven and twenty pounds
http://www.amazon.co.uk/

[Satan_Klaus]

It has been said before that the men of 'the story of O ' are a sad lot and the reader feels pity for O because she is left in the end. But maybe that is one of the main points why O captures the mind of the dom reader. For me, the protection instinct is a strong factor in my D/S thinking (Even if it is myself who put the girl into her helpless position in the first place). So because there is no man in the story who will protect and take care of O, the reader is enthralled to do so himself in his mind.

Satan_Klaus

[Mad Lews]

It has been said before that the men of 'the story of O ' are a sad lot and the reader feels pity for O because she is left in the end. But maybe that is one of the main points why O captures the mind of the dom reader. For me, the protection instinct is a strong factor in my D/S thinking (Even if it is myself who put the girl into her helpless position in the first place). So because there is no man in the story who will protect and take care of O, the reader is enthralled to do so himself in his mind.

Satan_Klaus

You may be on to something, the instinct to protect the "damsel in distress" may not be so far removed from a desire to see distressed damsels, even if one must apply the switch themselves. (Or in Rene's case have someone do it for him whilst he watches)

[gagged_Louise]

Psychologists have sometimes suggested that the damsel-in-distress fantasy theme is somehow based on the Oedipus complex: the bound woman represents Mom whom the boy is trying to win over and protect from his evil father. Now, the point whether the oedipal fixation actually exists, and in what sense, is a critical bone of contention among psychoanalysts too, and in any case that theory doesn't explain why girls feel thrilled by seeing bound and helpless women on tv and so on.

I think you're on to something in that Story of O invites an instinct to protect her, even if it's a hopeless one, but the way the story is told it also invites identification with her. What O feels when she's bound, whipped and used is never described, so if you're a sub you're compelled to imagine for yourself her pain and the way her mind and soul turns to find release in being used and tortured.

[Mad Lews]

Psychologists have sometimes suggested that the damsel-in-distress fantasy theme is somehow based on the Oedipus complex: the bound woman represents Mom whom the boy is trying to win over and protect from his evil father. Now, the point whether the oedipal fixation actually exists, and in what sense, is a critical bone of contention among psychoanalysts too, and in any case that theory doesn't explain why girls feel thrilled by seeing bound and helpless women on tv and so on.

I think you're on to something in that Story of O invites an instinct to protect her, even if it's a hopeless one, but the way the story is told it also invites identification with her. What O feels when she's bound, whipped and used is never described, so if you're a sub you're compelled to imagine for yourself her pain and the way her mind and soul turns to find release in being used and tortured.

Dear gagged_Louise,

You present an interesting interpretation of the DID reflex most males exhibit. Males do tend to interact in a hierarchical manner while females prefer (dare I say) bonding. This means that “normal” male maturation involves a testing of one’s place in the hierarchy, usually by rebelling against the patriarch at some point. I suspect that has little to do with the matriarch in most cases.

The ‘instinct’ to protect the weak, is at its root quite possessive, (at least speaking for myself) though gentlemanly behavior and chivalrous codes try to mask this. From the basic biological POV the male’s only claim to his progeny is through possession of the woman that bears them.

The thing about O though, the reason I started this thread, oh so very long ago, is that I sense she is flawed, deeply and fatally, and that is the reason the story had no workable ending. I’m just not sure what that flaw might be and I’m very open to suggestions.

Mad Lews

[tessa]

The ‘instinct’ to protect the weak, is at its root quite possessive, (at least speaking for myself) though gentlemanly behavior and chivalrous codes try to mask this. From the basic biological POV the male’s only claim to his progeny is through possession of the woman that bears them.

This is a rather fascinating idea to me. I have never heard it presented quite like this. I do appreciate it. And it comes from you, Mr. Mad. I do enjoy what comes from you.

The thing about O though, the reason I started this thread, oh so very long ago, is that I sense she is flawed, deeply and fatally, and that is the reason the story had no workable ending. I’m just not sure what that flaw might be and I’m very open to suggestions.

Dare I have one? A suggestion, that is. I'm not referring to that chocolate candy sitting so invitingly on my kitchen counter. I'm not. I'm not. I'm NOT!!~sighs~

I read "O" several years ago, when understanding any of my basic wants and desires was impossibly elusive. I do remember feeling greatly frustrated while reading it, feeling as if O was not being utilized to the fullest extent possible, leaving her as frustrated as I felt. And then the ending...I think I threw the book across the room upon completing it. It just wasn't right to leave a reader so lost in a moment. But reading your words, Mr. Mad, the thought that O was just too flawed for the author (whomever she may or may not be) to be as lost for an ending as I was in it, well, that makes sense to me. Perhaps the author, not being flawed deeply enough, had no way to complete the character of O herself, therefore leaving the ending of the book flawed in it's own irreprable way?

You did say you were open to one, although I'm not at all sure if what I had to say is suggestion or not.

But (and isn't there always one?), this tale stays with me, frustrated bugger that it is. Here's the reason "O", the story, is forever in my mind-

She ceased resisting and, crestfallen at the idea of having been found wanting in the presence of Sir Stephen, she repeated, this time almost in a whisper:

"It's not true, I swear it's not true."

Without uttering a word, without so much as a glance at Jacqueline, Sir Stephen made a sign to Rene to let O go, and to O to go into the other room. But on the other side of the door O, who was immediately wedged against the wall, her belly and breasts seized, her lips forced apart by Sir Stephen's insistent tongue, moaned with happiness and deliverance. The points of her breasts stiffened beneath his hand's caress, and with his other hand Sir Stephen probed her loins so roughly she thought she would faint. Would she ever dare tell him that no pleasure, no joy, no figment of her imagination could ever compete with the happiness she felt at the way he used her with such utter freedom, at the notion that he could do anything with her, that there was no limit, no restriction in the manner with which, on her body, he might search for pleasure. Her absolute certainty that when he touched her, whether it was to fondle or flog her, when he ordered her to do something, it was solely because he wanted to. Her certainty that all he cared about was his own desire, so overwhelmed and gratified O that each time she saw a new proof of it, and often even when it merely occurred to her in thought, a cape of fire, a burning breastplate extending from the shoulders to the knees, descended upon her. As she was there, pinned against the wall, her eyes closed, her lips murmuring "I love you" when she could find the breath to say them, Sir Stephen's hands, though they were as cool as the waters of a bubbling spring on the fire coursing through her from head to toe, made her burn even hotter. Gently he released her, dropping her skirt down over her moist thighs, closing her bolero over her quivering breasts.
"Come, O," he said, "I need you."

I didn't understand much at the time (still don't ). But I understood this.
Completely.

Thanks Mr. Mad, for the gentle push in this direction. In the spirit of coming clean (which is a difficult thing for a woman like me to do ), I saw this thread the very first week I joined up here at the Forums. I was much too much of a newbie to even attempt a posting. Actually, I still feel that same way. But desirous necessity is quite the motivator.

Always a thrill, Mr. Mad. (Lews, you certainly make that so as well.)

tessa

[Mad Lews]

A cool wet tongue crosses her burning cheeks. A kiss planted on the heat draws an involuntary shiver. Why? Why would he who causes pain then heal her throbbing bottom? He feels no need to explain to her; maybe it's simply because he enjoys seeing her tremble.

tessa,

Go ahead and have that chocolate (ONLY ONE!)

I understand your frustration with the characters. They are all flawed as real characters should be. That isn't really my problem with the book. What you have pointed out is (I think) one of O's strengths. She absorbs the needs of others and finds comfort and purpose within them. Yet like a used sponge she is being constantly discarded by those who should cherish her. My immediate question is why? If it were just happenstance I'd say it was her choice in partners (and yes she always had a choice.)But it's a list of every significant person in her life. All use and discard her; Rene, Jacqueline, Anne Marie, eventually Sir Stephen and (in one or maybe both endings) even herself. I've come to suspect the flaw is O's. Then again it might just be hard to write a "Happily ever after" ending for a book on BDSM and a life of sexual slavery.
Your thoughts...

Mad

[tessa]

I thought I posted to this already. Goodness, I can be such a blonde sometimes. ~slowly licks at the chocolate off the candy as I compose myself~

She absorbs the needs of others and finds comfort and purpose within them

I think what you said here, Mr. Mad, Sir, is exactly why O is discarded so often. It is draining (no pun intended, but double entendre welcome) to be the focus of and source for such need. If the others had not stepped back away from her, she would have used them up as completely as she was used, just in a highly different and concentrated form.

(Why did that last part make me think of dishwashing liquid? )

Not so much a flaw of O's as it is an intensity of being that is difficult for others to sustain? Just my thoughts.

tessa

[gagged_Louise]

Interesting Lews, this would imply that O could be seen as almost a femme fatale - if the story hadn't been overtly about BDSM (and if you're right, and you could well be) the interplay between her and the men would have had something of that "dangerous and beautiful woman" motive in it. Lawrence Durrell's Justine has a kind of similar angle to it: the glorious and mysterious woman comes across as a Goddess of eastern sensuality dangling the romantic young writer Darley at her fingers, while he thinks she is more or less the prisoner of her high-status marriage, but as the book and its sequels move on it turns out she may have had other motives for the affair....hmmm...

[storyofO]

is there something like a roissy anywhere?

[Ozme52]

Presumably so... websites too. Google roissy for starters.

[Mad Lews]

Roissy France is 30 odd Kilometers NE of Paris near Charles De Gaul airport. De Gaul airport did not exist in 1950 which was when O was written and published. The Town was out in the country, now it is a midsized city.

Chateau and Chateau de Roissy societies are abundant and can be searched for on line. A google search of Roissy France will yield a lot of aeroport info.

Yours
Mad Lews

[leo9]

Roissy France is 30 odd Kilometers NE of Paris near Charles De Gaul airport. De Gaul airport did not exist in 1950 which was when O was written and published. The Town was out in the country, now it is a midsized city.

Some online friends of ours took in the locations as part of a holiday in France. They discovered that today, Samur (the location of the Domme's mansion) has a jazz festival as its claim to fame. He took a photo of her posing in a Festival teeshirt beside the road sign saying ROISSY, and she made Xmas cards of it with the message "My Master took me to Roissy and Samur and all I got was a lousy teeshirt."