Need help to accept submission with joy

[steve_submits]

I am in my mid-50s, married over 30 years, and came to BDSM only within the past few years. My wife and I have had an extremely vanilla relationship for most of our marriage. About four years ago I discovered BDSM on the Internet and realized through reading and chat experiences that the sexual passivity I had demonstrated through most of our marriage was the result of a deeply submissive nature. I had cyber affairs with several Dommes I had met online and agonized over the fact that I was betraying my very loving and devoted wife. Two years ago, to my amazement, my wife, most unexpectedly, finally allowed her natural dominance to assert itself and we quickly and happily transitioned to a very exciting D/s sexual relationship. We both discovered things about ourselves that we had never suspected, and our marriage became incredibly exciting. But...

My wife is extremely comfortable with herself in her role as Domme. I am not so comfortable as a submissive, now that I am a sub in real, rather than cyber, life. As her sub, I abandon all inhibitions and, and while this is extremely satisfying sexually to both of us (I think she gets as much, if not more, pleasure over her ability to make me lose all control and put myself completely in her power as she does from the orgasms I am able to give her), I am left afterward with a lingering sense of shame and embarassment for my totally "shameless" behavior--my total lack of sexual restraint and the fulfillment of dark fantasies and the shocking desire to fulfill even darker ones. This has resulted in some strain in what had been an unbelievable rejunevation of our marriage.

I am the product of a very repressive childhood and adolescence in which sex was not even a concept much less a reality, so my new-found sexual abandon is hard for me to accept. Indeed, I was brought up to think of sex as something shameful and I was certainly ashamed by the very active fantasy life and compulsive masturbation that I was unable to control. So the kind of orgiastic (not literally) play my Domme and I have enjoyed over the past few years is a total dissconnect with the sexual repression I had been conditioned to believe was the norm.

I am hoping that more experienced dommes or subs might be able to give me some advice as to how to overcome feelings that I suspect are caused by the conflict between my true sexual nature and the conditioning of family and society that is preventing me from accepting with full joy the miracle that has occurred in my life when my vanilla wife became my Lady of Pleasure. I am open to any suggestions....

steve

[Ruby]

Dear Steve,

You are a grown-up. It's time to put away the childish definitions you grew up with and accept yourself for what you are: a loving, sensuous man who is making his wife very happy.

To address the shame or guilt of your new found freedom of expression, ask yourself a few questions:

Are you harming anyone?
Are you giving your wife pleasure?
Does what you do when you play bring yourself pleasure?
Are the boundaries and safeguards between the two of you protective and loving?
Is she asking you do to do something you don't want and can you say no?
Does she respect you any less or more because of your gift of submission?

The more you look at it as what goes on between the two of you and not the rest of the world, then it's easier to remove any lingering doubts. It's your relationship, however, you define it, and if its healthy and working for both of you, then continue.

If you need to forgive yourself for stepping outside your childhood boundaries, then do so. With forgiveness comes acceptance.

Ruby

[RubysPet]

steve, I feel you should approach your situation not as a problem but as an opportunity. Your wife has given you a wonderful chance to explore not something you have become, but something you always were. You should be forever in her debt for helping you to discover this essential truth about yourself. Think of all the other male subs who are not so fortunate as yourself. The majority of them suffer in silence, unable to find a Lady to serve. Others, like myself, are so blessed in having a wonderful Miss, but she is on the other side of the ocuntry, and our relationship remains a long distance one. You, on the other hand, are living with your Lady, and even married to her! Rejoice in your fate, don't bemoan it!

Miss Ruby is correct is counselling you to relax and put your past behind you. Your body will tell you the right course of action. You already know what that course is...submit!

[steve_submits]

Dear Mistress Ruby,

Thank you so very much for your wonderful and sensitive post. You are absolutely correct, that by my submission I have made my wife very happy. However, by my questioning it, feeling guilt because of the pleasure it gives me, she has become less so. It is, indeed, high time to accept myself (50-something) as a sensuous, loving adult whose task is to make his wife as happy as possible and to give her as much pleasure as possible.

Your questions are extremely insightful and have enabled me to put my feelings about my submission and our relationship into perspective:

Are you harming anyone?--ABSOLUTELY NOT
Are you giving your wife pleasure?-- ABSOLUTELY YES
Does what you do when you play bring yourself pleasure? ABSOLUTELY YES
Are the boundaries and safeguards between the two of you protective and loving? --TOTALLY PROTECTIVE AND LOVING
Is she asking you do to do something you don't want and can you say no?--She is not asking me to do anything I don't want and I can say no whenever I choose
Does she respect you any less or more because of your gift of submission?--I believe she respects me more because of my gift of submission.

And you are, of course, correct that I am judging myself from the perspective of the outside world and how "different" and, yes, somewhat "kinky" ours is. We have discussed this issue, and she is completely OK with it and completely comfortable with herself as my Domme and completely accepting of me as her submissive. She has told me several times, I think to reassure me, that each relationship is different, no one knows what goes on in anyone else's marriage/relationship, each relationship has its own dynamics based on the needs of the partners--and this is the one that works for us. She has told me that her greatest pleasure is derived from seeing me released completely from all sexual constraints through my submission to her. It is ironic that it is my submission to her that has freed me from the psychological bondage to those inhibitions and fears that have so long blighted my life and our relationship.

Thank you so much,
steve

[steve_submits]

RubysPet,

I think that one of my problems is the difficulty I seem to have had accepting what I am and always have been--a male submissive. It (1) flies in the face of how men are supposed to see themselves and be seen by women, other men, and society; and (2) it explains much about the mutually unsatisfactory nature of the past history of my marriage. My wife and I had both accepted the labels we had been given by parents and the world. To be a good wife, a girl was taught (at least when my wife and I were growing up) to be submissive to her husband and a boy was taught that he must be assertive, aggressive--a dominant alpha male. Well, I am not sexually assertive while my wife is, and for years she felt that my lack of sexual aggressiveness was lack of interest in her--that was the farthest thing from the truth. I was simply constitutionally incapable of being the kind of male that was expected. As it turns out, it was my wife is the "alpha woman", the sexual dominant, and it was I who had to submit to her--We had been struggling over this for years. And you are right--I am in her debt because if she hadn't had the courage needed to understand the truth about our relationship and act on that knowledge, I never would have discovered the truth about myself and would not have come to understand much about my life that had been so confusing.

Also, it had not occurred to me that what I saw as a "problem" others would joyfully accept as a wonderful gift--a Domme who loved me and to whom I was actually married. Both you and Miss Ruby have helped me very much understand and resolve this conflict that I have been struggling with for so long. And, of course, when I relax and allow my body and my inner voice to guide me, they tell tell me what you (and I) already knew I must do--submit to my incredible Lady.

I truly pray that your relationship with Miss Ruby will ultimately cease to be a long-distance one and that you will finally be united with her.

Thank you and best wishes,
steve

[her_Joe]

Steve,

it sounds to me like you've got your head on straight except for when the old demons come out to play in your head .... and what Ruby and her pet have told you seems to make some authentic sense to you too and you're not having much trouble accepting their commonsense advice while you're here.

But you and we all know that some night when it's late, they're going to trundle out that old guilt bed again --

one option is to ask your lovely wife to punish you for what you've done wrong. But I don't think that will work nearly as well as the next:

print this thread out and read it for a reality check every time you get thinking crazy, mixed up thoughts.

her_Joe

[Ruby]

Steve,

It was my pleasure to be of service.

I agree with Her_Joe, this is something to print and review, often. :-)

Ruby

[steve_submits]

Joe,

Ruby and Nathaniel's advice was excellent and has been well assimilated. But you are correct--the old demons refuse to die no matter how often they are killed. (One of Ruby's sexy vampires perhaps?) Your advice is well taken--I am saving the thread for future reference.

As for punishment, unfortunately, Lady L does not believe in inflicting pain--she is into pleasure and sees her sub as her pet who she is reluctant to make suffer. However, you are correct--this sometimes misguided sub might benefit from a few well-directed strokes when he misbehaves or strays.

Steve

[steve_submits]

Dear Mistress Ruby,

Yes, Ma'am. And thank you again.

steve

Steve,

It was my pleasure to be of service.

I agree with Her_Joe, this is something to print and review, often. :-)

Ruby

[Ranai]

Dear Steve,

I will add some thoughts even though I am one of the much more inexperienced ones and you asked for ideas from experienced people. I believe Ruby, RubysPet and her_Joe have given you excellent advice. Ruby’s questions address the core of the matter: the facts. If your submission causes no harm, but pleasure for you both inside a loving relationship, it is a good thing.

Now for the unwanted lingering side-effects. I can understand that your wife is not overjoyed when you talk to her about that lingering sense of shame. In the afterglow of passion, and in moments of emotional intimacy, who would be thrilled to have to deal with that? But you are her husband and her submissive. With all there is to you. So it is for her to listen when you have something to say that troubles you. Even when it’s no enormous fun, and even though she can not perform a miracle and make it suddenly go away. Yes, it is important to appreciate the lady you are so lucky to have in your life. Yes, it is good to do your best to please her with your submission and devotion. But you are under no obligation to be perfect.

How are you to dictate and control your feelings and thoughts? No human being can. When we discover the joys of BDSM for ourselves we don’t need to turn shame around by 180 ̊ degrees. I mean, there’s no point in feeling ashamed because you have been feeling ashamed? I certainly had heaps of misconceptions, prejudices and stereotypes concerning BDSM before I made an effort to look at facts instead of myths. We don’t learn that many useful facts about BDSM in mainstream education. And as you say, each relationship has its own dynamics. We need to listen inside ourselves to find out what is good for us. As for cultural stereotypes how all men and women are supposed to be and act and feel – nobody is immune from them. The trick is to recognise stereotypes as what they are.

If thoughts and feelings of shame that you know to be irrational and unfounded in the light of your loving and mutually satisfying relationship show up in your mind, there is no need to battle against them. Look at the thoughts. Name them. Identify them. Identify where they come from. Let them pass. If they show up again, let them pass again. Another idea: Some old demons don’t support being made fun of very well. If you can find an amusing angle, use it.

As for the factual part, your answers to Ruby’s questions: The joy is there. The happiness is there. You have every reason to celebrate. So when the joy is there, let it soar and savour it!!


With a certain lack of originality I’ll add a quote. This dialogue is from a favourite book. It is not about desires of domination or submission, but seems applicable – and I like it! The speakers are Miss de Vine, a historian, and Harriet Vane, a novelist. Dorothy L. Sayers: Gaudy Night, chapter 2.

'...I imagine you come across a number of people who are disconcerted by the difference between what you do feel and what they fancy you ought to feel. It is fatal to pay the smallest attention to them.'
'Yes,' said Harriet, 'but I am one of them. I disconcert myself very much. I never know what I do feel.'
'I don't think that matters, provided one doesn't try to persuade one's self into appropriate feelings.' (...)
‘But (...) how is one to know which things are really of overmastering importance?’
‘We can only know that,’ said Miss de Vine, ‘when they have overmastered us.’

Finally, I would like to congratulate your wife on having such a wonderful man by her side and occasionally at her feet.

[steve_submits]

Dear Ranai,

I have been trying so hard to figure out the possible psychological sources of the feelings of "shame," which my conscious mind knows are unfounded, that I never considered your most practical suggestion:

"If thoughts and feelings of shame that you know to be irrational and unfounded in the light of your loving and mutually satisfying relationship show up in your mind, there is no need to battle against them. Look at the thoughts. Name them. Identify them. Identify where they come from. Let them pass. If they show up again, let them pass again."

That is so sensible and practical compared to the nearly impossible task of uncovering those "deep" reasons for the irrational feelings. Identify the source (negative cultural conditioning, in the case of D/s or BDSM), then let the feelings go....eventually they should pass on to the graveyard of false premises. I am putting your concept of naming and letting go into practice starting--NOW.

I only wish that I were able to fully live up to your most gracious conclusion in which you congratulate my wife "on having such a wonderful man by her side and occasionally at her feet."

In reality, it is she who should be congratulated for having put up with me for so many years and for forgiving me for endlessly backsliding. She is the most loving and forgiving of Dommes and it is I who must do far more to earn the right to be not only by her side but also the right to worship at her feet.

steve

P.S. I have always enjoyed Dorothy Sayers and her Lord Peter Wimsey. The quote is most appropriate.

[her_Joe]

[QUOTE=steve_submits]

In reality, it is she who should be congratulated for having put up with me for so many years and for forgiving me for endlessly backsliding. She is the most loving and forgiving of Dommes and it is I who must do far more to earn the right to be not only by her side but also the right to worship at her feet.

QUOTE]

A lovely bit of submission, Steve. She will, I'm sure, appreciate your effort and you will both thrill at your success.

[Desdemon]

I too am not 'experienced' but I offer my observations any way, cuz I'm like that
I find that I struggle with feeling selfish and demanding after the fact. I melt and cannot focus on anything but the sensations he plays out on my body when he does certain things to me...I found this very troubleing, and still do a bit I guess...

But, I asked him about it. He reassured me that *having* that effect, that control is what satisfies him, for the most part. If he desires something more specific, all he need do is tell me what he wants.

I sometimes have trouble 'accepting' my responses, after we play. He seems more tuned into my residual feelings than I am sometimes...Things, emotions I've learned to just brush off, he forces me to deal with. And that's an amazing and wonderful gift. If something is emotionally challenging for me, I'll tend to swallow the frustration if left alone. He is relentless in insisting that I let out whatever the emotion is. It is uncomfortable for me, but so much healthier...

Is it possible that your Domme, being as new to her role as you are to yours, might need to learn *how* to bring you back to ground without allowing you to assigne blame? This sounds so simple that I cringe in posting it, however in my experience, it's the glue that holds me together after he breaks me, and keeps me coming back for more from Him.

[Locked Advantages]

From what I've learned from being in the lifestyle is you need to accept who you are and most just listen to society and are afraid to do just that since they don't see the truth in what life has to offer them and what they can hol throughout their lifes...most don't see all the goodness,they just look at the negativity. I know this isn't a good explaination but in my eyes it worked for me

[steve_submits]

I find that it is the feeling of becoming more "animal" than "human" when I submit so completely that I enter subspace that I have found disturbing. I relate very much to your Petgirls concept: "Being a pet shows one that you love and adore them, a object is something they can use. But when your Less Than human, can they love and cherish you more than anything through this deep submission?" I do believe that my Domme does love and cherish me more than anything when I submit so deeply...but I must learn to love and cherish myself when I go into that state.

Is your website limited to female subs or can males who feel that they have become "Petboys" join the discussion as well?

steve