Evolution: Science or Philosophy

[Rhabbi]

Let me state here a law of nature.

[I]The total entropy of any isolated thermodynamic system tends to increase over time, approaching a maximum value.[/I]

This is known as the Second Law of Thermodyanamics, and what it generally means is that as time progresses, things fall apart and become less ordered.

Yet those who believe in evolution want me to ignore this law, and accept that in the case of life, this law does not apply.

There is a difference between a law and a theory, one is proven by experiment and math, and has no exceptions. The law of gravity is an example of this. Planes may appear to violate this law, but they actually use other laws, (ie. aerodynamics) to accomplish this. Theories explain observed phenomenon and then tries to account for everything that it sees. If it fails to do this, it is adjusted and rethought, and new experiments are carried out. Einstein's theory of Relativity actually explained that light moved at a constant speed before ir was proven.How did he do this? He was just smarter than anybody else. But his theory has stood the test of time, with some tweaking to the math along the way.

Evolution is, at best, a hypothesis. In other words, it is only an idea on which to hang a theory. As far as I know, the only people that have offered any explanation of how evolution violates the laws of thermodyanamics are people who believe in God as the motive force behind evolution.

I would like someone to explain to me how evolution can violate this law, and please do not try to tell me that because of the sun shining on the eart the biosphere is not a closed system. Adding energy to a system actually increases the rate at wich entropy occurs, although it delays the actual point at which entorpy reaches the maximum rate. Besides, if we take te universe as a whole, it is a closed system, yet life exists.

[TomOfSweden]

Let me state here a law of nature.

[I]The total entropy of any isolated thermodynamic system tends to increase over time, approaching a maximum value.[/I]

This is known as the Second Law of Thermodyanamics, and what it generally means is that as time progresses, things fall apart and become less ordered.

Yet those who believe in evolution want me to ignore this law, and accept that in the case of life, this law does not apply.

There is a difference between a law and a theory, one is proven by experiment and math, and has no exceptions. The law of gravity is an example of this. Planes may appear to violate this law, but they actually use other laws, (ie. aerodynamics) to accomplish this. Theories explain observed phenomenon and then tries to account for everything that it sees. If it fails to do this, it is adjusted and rethought, and new experiments are carried out. Einstein's theory of Relativity actually explained that light moved at a constant speed before ir was proven.How did he do this? He was just smarter than anybody else. But his theory has stood the test of time, with some tweaking to the math along the way.

Evolution is, at best, a hypothesis. In other words, it is only an idea on which to hang a theory. As far as I know, the only people that have offered any explanation of how evolution violates the laws of thermodyanamics are people who believe in God as the motive force behind evolution.

I would like someone to explain to me how evolution can violate this law, and please do not try to tell me that because of the sun shining on the eart the biosphere is not a closed system. Adding energy to a system actually increases the rate at wich entropy occurs, although it delays the actual point at which entorpy reaches the maximum rate. Besides, if we take te universe as a whole, it is a closed system, yet life exists.

He he. In rhetoric you are using what is known as weasel words. Evolution doesn't have to break the the second law of theromodynamics. It states that over time, differences in temperature, pressure, and density tend to even out in a physical system which is isolated from the outside world. The law doesn't state anything about the entropy being symetrical. Order can apear spontaneously. The only thing important is that in average the differences in temperature, pressure and density don't increase.

So life can apear by itself without breaking the laws of thermodynamics. But without anything outside this universe keeping it going, it will finally blink out. This is if we count on the laws as we know them being correct. Since the theory of relativity has a huge gaping hole in it, (and quantum theory), we know for a fact that we're missing a critical bit of the puzzle. So let's not asume too much.