Not sure why the thread has inverted like that. Very odd. But yes, NK, it was knowing something about it (and knowing that it was coming from something inside the sub that was causing them pain) that lead me to believe it was unethical. Certainly I'll be giving it deeper thought.

Oh, and Tom, I don't believe it's arrogant of me to care for the people I play with. Maybe I'm making an assumption here, but it was one (in the specific case that made me want to talk about this) that was based on solid information and understanding of how they think and feel. I do not believe that deviating from heteronormative patterns necessarily stems from anything bad. I myself am bisexual and know that there's no trauma or inbuilt problem that caused that, I'm simply seeing a link that I know to be there in a specific case. If that's arrogance, then sure, I'm arrogant.

Thanks for the replies, though, very thought provoking,