how do I submit to my lover?

[julise]

I posted this to "My BDSM Life" before I saw this forum. Oops...
Well hopefully now that I have it right I will get some help. Please?

Submitting to my lover...
I have a question. Maybe some of you can help me figure this out. I am very much a slave. There is a slave inside of me just dying to get out. However, I resist submitting and being a slave to my boyfriend.

I have sessioned with guys that I have met online and my obedience and submission surpassed many slaves that they had trained. I loved it, enjoyed it immensely but most times things ended because I could not do a 24/7 relationship.

Well now I have that chance with my boyfriend but I resist him in many ways. I basically top him from the bottom and I am not a very good sub to him, so suffice it to say, I am definitely not his slave.

A lot of it is that he LETS me top him from the bottom and he LETS me do so many things that I shouldn't.
He has never dommed before although he has always been aggressive in bed. He gives wonderful spankings but he will stop whipping me if I beg him to stop. I want him to just gag me and keep going, but he won't. (yes i have told him this).

Then there is the subject of him not knowing how to dom. I can always get out of his bondage and he focuses more on the physical than the psychological and emotional. I need all three for this to be fulfilling for me. I have begged him to study BDSM and speak with other Doms but he refuses.

I am a slave who needs to be trained but I am in love with a vanilla man. Yes this man tries to be a Dom but his "vanillaness" and lack of experience get in the way. I feel like I have tried everything. How do I turn this into a good BDSM Master/slave relationship?

I fear that because he is only trying the Dom thing for me that he is not really into it and that there really is no hope of having a fulfilling Master/slave relationship for either one of us.

Any suggestions?

julise

[GaryWilcox]

I'm a massive geek for using this as a metaphor, but here goes anyway:

There's a scene in the movie X-Men where Cyclops and Professor Xavier are discussing adding Wolverine to their team. Cyclops says, "I don't think he can follow orders." Xavier responds, "Give him an order worth following, and he will."

Don't try to change your vanilla guy. love him how he is. But make it clear that he is incapable of commanding dominance, until he inspires submission in you.

As for you, much of this problem is your internalization. You want to submit... do you really? If you want to submit, all you have to do is let go of control. I'm guessing this becomes troubling for you when you don't get your way.

The solution might come when he pushes you to your limits, demanding exactly what he wants without giving you the impression that he will back down from your safety word. That's a scary place, sure... but that's ultimately what you're looking for, isn't it? Submission to a strong man-- but specifically to the one you already love?

Such a thing might not be possible; you may be unfullfilled. That's the most motivating thing I can think of under the circumstances.

If anything I've suggested offends you, just disregard it as the ramblings of a tired (and creatively frustrated) chihuahua.

[dancingscorpion]

Just want my first post here to be a good one To the above reply by Gary Wilcox, right on! At least, that's what I've had a great deal of trouble conveying to m"Love...he's beginning to get the idea, though. It's taken a huge amount of time for him to realize that this is (between the two of us) a real expression of caring, love and understanding to me. Once he got that, and explored what it really meant to him, everything has gotten better! So if the guy has any desire at all in him to top, I think sometimes he might need to really KNOW (and have time to believe it) what it means to you.

[MrJerseyGuy]

To Julise...

In my limited experience the whole thing is a learning experience. I have a sub who I am totally in love with. I want to hurt her but only as much as she wants to be hurt. We are 8 months into it now and I'm finding more and more that the further I push her limits...the more she likes it. Be a little patient and maybe he'll come around.

Consider having one of those conversations over a couple glasses of wine about both of your "ultimate fantasies" Just be careful...you may be surprised where it takes you!

Good luck

[Jones, Nikka]

To Julisse:

I am writing this in the forum instead of a PM because sombody else may need to read it.
Seven years ago I was in your shoes. I was trying to get my boyfriend to understand how I wanted to be dominated. He wanted to please me but just could not do it. Until one night we had a talk about it. Not about what but about why.

It was a long and tearful conversation. He had secretly considered leaving me, as my desires were too intense for his taste. But also he was sure that he loved me. He even wondered whether or not he may have been a sub himself. Above all he could not reconcile his incipient dominance with his feelings for me.

We realized we did not know each other enough to be intimate at such extreme level. We gave it just one more try and we spent the next eight months learning more about each other. Not in our dom/sub roles but as students of each other's minds. Everything was fair game. Every aspect of our lives that had led us to that point in our relationship was explored. Some of it was not romantic at all. Some of it hurt. But we were protected by the certainty of our love. In the end, paradoxically, he learned more about submission and I learned more about dominance.

We got luck, I will admit. It worked out. It is a compromise but it makes us happy. He still thinks I am too extreme. Some times he switches. (It keeps him in touch with my reality) Sometimes, I do.
But I believe we can keep on compromising.

He know what I am writing and he just gave me his trademark "I know how important this is for you " smile. I hope you have someone in your life as wonderful as him.

Nikka

[julise]

If anything I've suggested offends you, just disregard it as the ramblings of a tired (and creatively frustrated) chihuahua.

You didn't offend me at all. How can I be offended when I have sought your advice? I appreciate your words GARYWILCOX.

I would just like to say thank you to all of those who have given advice on this subject.

Well a quick update; I have just accepted that my boyfriend will never be the Master that I need. He will not push me past my limits, and YES that is what I want. I have told him this time and time again, but he stops everytime as soon as I show the least bit of pain. And to answer you GARYWILCOX, I don't use my safeword to make him stop. I have never used my safeword. And I will not unless I feel that my life is in danger. So he stops just from my asking him to stop even though I have begged him not to when I am not under the whip. I have told him that it is just my reaction to pain and that he should just gag me and ignore me. He seems incapable of doing this.

Well I have come to the conclusion that I will just have to push aside these feelings. Nikka, thank you so much for your story, and I have tried to do the same thing with my boyfriend, but he doesn't really want to get that deep into it emotionally. It just doesn't work with him.

And to those of you who think that I am giving up, quite the contrary. I have been trying with him for three years. I started this thread out of desperation.

Being that I cannot push my love aside for him, I will just have to accept that I will not have a full Master/slave relationship at the moment. A little unfulfilling, yes, but my love for him is too strong to put my fulfillment first.

Writing BDSM stories as an outlet will just have to suffice for now.

julise

[MrJerseyGuy]

I will agree that it sounds like he just might not have it in him to be as punishing as you want. Have you tried letting him read stories that you write? Maybe that will give him a more "graphic" and "in your face" representation of what you want.

I am very in love with my partner and would never do anything to hurt her that she didn't want...but at the same time I don't mind beating the piss out of her if it turns her on!

[pop_54]

You've done the right thing julise, if a guy hasn't got it in him, most times he can't be turned fully. I too could have PM messaged this but maybe some others will find it informative as with nikka's post

My wife has always been like you, she cries out for the punishment to stop but wishes it to continue in reality, the cries for mercy are part of the game. She's the slave being punished and dominated, no punishment if she's not pleading for mercy is it.

She has never used the safeword, I worry sometimes she'd allow herself to be seriously hurt before she did.

For this reason I didn't consider myself to be competent enough to feed her fantasies while maintaining the correct level of violence and or restraint for her pleasure and safety.

I love her deeply and wish to please as well as dominate her, a good slave master considers the feelings of the slave as well as his/her own urges and lusts. With the safeword mechanism in place the slave is ultimately the boss after all.

The outcome of our little problem with me not being able or willing to perform the task properly is that Lorri now goes to a professional for her big kinky sessions, I just give her the mild beatings for being a naughty girl.

We found a couple who have all the facilities and all the correct equipment, the guy is an expert torture master and his wife is an expert assistant, she's also a qualified hospital nurse.

I drop Lorri off at their house and leave her with them for a couple of hours then pick her up and take her home after her treatment, it works out just fine for us, maybe this is something to consider for other folks who can't seem to gel together in the extreme punishment stakes.

Lorri and I love each other, but we have slightly differing needs, we felt it important for our security to ensure our needs were fulfilled with little real risk. We felt that if we didn't get her what she needed, she may go looking for it elsewhere and put herself in danger, this way it's all controlled.

There are implications with all this of course, don't attempt it if you aren't truly liberated or the old idiot possesive jealousy will destroy you both. We don't suffer that jealousy stuff, I know when Lorri's at her slave masters, the guy and his wife are going to have full on sex with her during the kinky session, part of Lorri's fantasy is to be raped during her beating and torture, it turns me on more than worries me the thought of her being screwed by someone else. You have to be prepared for this side of it as well.

Some of you may want to chat with partner about this kind of possibilty, but as I say, make sure you and they can really handle it if you do.

pops.............

[bearbeast]

all the info that you have shared my mistress and i have been together for ten years i know what makes her tick, keep exloping listening and watching making cheeky conversations he'll soon warm up to the ides, there's a beast in all of us waiting for the right moment to pop out

have fun and pateints can be fun to