Pain and its place in BDSM

[master_kyrk1]

lets look at it in another way. When people say look at the person they are a pain slut do they mena if they stub there toe they have an orgasm? That is a pain slut give them pain of any kind and they respond to it.

my wife can handle a good deal of pain in the course of a scene, but there has to be a warm up first. Caressing light smacks strokes form the flogger. all with the intnet to get the nerve endings warmed up and the endorphins flowing. At that point it can be built upon till she may reach a point where she can achieve or border an orgasm.

She is not getting it for the sake of pure pain. it is a way for me to add to her pleasure in anoher formto push her into new areas of sexuality. Is this effective for everyone of course not. is there a reason for the pain yes mutual pleasure. If i told ehr bitch bend over and get 50 strokes she probably would but would be in tears for it especially if no reason. However if i say time to play and warm her up she can take easily 50 hard stroeks and that will push her into a new place.

The lines between pain and pleasure or close. have you ever had an orgasm so powerful that it has casued physical pain or discomofrt. or has a sensation that you ennjoyed so much you had to ahve it stop becasue it hurt. Just becasue you can handle certain things as pleasure at one momnet in time does not eman it will be the same at a different moment.

My wife and i had an opportunity toi play the other night with out kids being around for the first time in over 2 years. The first session went poorly things she normally liked were not sending her into her normal subspace she could not relax and get focused. Even though everything was relatively mild she couould not mentally get hwerself to where she need to be to progress. Later that night we did another scene. Where she was waxed beaten and knife played with has a couple small nicks annd a few brusies to show for it. This scene was far more intense in every sense. yet she orgasmed in it or came very very close she says she did not eveyone else says she did. Then becasue she enjoyed it so much and had a achieved a happy spot she fell asleep.....,..

the lines between pleasure and pain are easily blurred but part of benig able to enjoy that edge and walking it. is finidng a dominant that is willing to exp[lore you and your need and is willing to hhelp you navigate it. takes trust on all sides. trust on the part of the dominant to konw when is enough and to bacvk off. Trust with the submissive to be willing to say somehting is not write here physically or mentally we need to make an adjustment. Soon as i knew my wife had been on a bad trip the scene stopped. Several people came to our aid. with warm blankeyt cuddling and juice to amke her feel safe and secure and to konw that everything was ok.

reading back am not sure how much this answers the orignal question. however i think it gives a different slant on it. in short what you enjoys is what is right for you and if people wish to be narrow minded and jusge you based on that. That is their won damn fault. Who konws bby doing so they may miss out on what could be a very kinky relationship.

[Kaori-san]

I agree with you greatly Jean and Friede.

Pain should be used as punishment for me, not as something that is just given out randomly. I can take a lot of pain, but it is not something I would do for a Dom if they just suddenly took out a paddle and began a beating for no reason.

Fine, if I have been badly behaved then by all means punish me, however if I have done nothing wrong I would end up not a very happy sub if a Dom 'punished' me.

Like Ruby said though, pain can be pleasurable too, adding a bit of spice, let say being slapped during sex etc. A bit of light pain is fun and fine for me then.

Also, I think lets say having nipple clamps on then being sexually stimulated is ok too, but not just outright pain because a Dom feels like giving out pain for no real reason. A good spanking gets me wet, but it would lose /all/ fun if it was given often and become dull. However as a punishment it means you can not only enjoy it a little, but you are also getting pain.

[Ruby]

Looking at the last few posts, its easy to see that the old saying is true, "different strokes for different folks".

Heck, I love a good spanking, there's no reason for me to be punished to enjoy it. However, I don't like or enjoy a hard spanking. That's just me.

"What you enjoy is right for you," said master_kyrk1.

Agreed. So while I may enjoy a nice spanking and want to use it as part of play, Kaori-san may only want a spanking during a punishment.

"But to afflict pain just for the heck of it..." said Bald_J_and_F.

I think that "afflicting pain just for the heck of it" isn't about mutual pleasure. It's more about being selfish.

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Side note -- Advice not requested

"This scene was far more intense in every sense. yet she orgasmed in it or came very very close she says she did not eveyone else says she did. Then becasue she enjoyed it so much and had a achieved a happy spot she fell asleep..."

Side with your woman. If she says she didn't, then she didn't. She's the only one who really knows for sure.

[Bald_J_and_F]

I think that "afflicting pain just for the heck of it" isn't about mutual pleasure. It's more about being selfish.

That's what we wanted to express.

[Ruby]

That's what we wanted to express.

Thanks. I liked your warning about those types of dom/mes. Dangerous? Very. Unreliable? Perhaps a much more polite word than I would use.

[fwss]

I'm a little puzzled by your last comment, Ruby. Many - surely most - dominants are sadists, right? They get off on inflicting pain and/or other suffering. Masochists get off on taking it. Slaves get off on fulfilling their owner's needs.

I therefore cannot see any way in which a dominant inflicting pain 'for the hell of it' should be described as 'dangerous', as long as they are doing it to a consenting partner.

[Bald_J_and_F]

I'm a little puzzled by your last comment, Ruby. Many - surely most - dominants are sadists, right? They get off on inflicting pain and/or other suffering. Masochists get off on taking it. Slaves get off on fulfilling their owner's needs.

I therefore cannot see any way in which a dominant inflicting pain 'for the hell of it' should be described as 'dangerous', as long as they are doing it to a consenting partner.

A dominant person should have a sense of responsibility. Afflicting pain just for the heck of it is NOT responsible at all. We described the scenarios in which we think the affliction of pain makes sense to us, and we think that should leave room enough for the affliction of pain. It is the context that is important. If we are given a difficult task and fail to do it or misbehave in any way (and there are lots of possibilities for that), then we certainly deserve our punishment. But that's a big difference to just arbitrarily dealing out pain. Arbitrarily dealing out pain is like moving a knight in a game of chess like a rook - against the rules.

[Ruby]

I'm a little puzzled by your last comment, Ruby. Many - surely most - dominants are sadists, right? They get off on inflicting pain and/or other suffering. Masochists get off on taking it. Slaves get off on fulfilling their owner's needs.

I therefore cannot see any way in which a dominant inflicting pain 'for the hell of it' should be described as 'dangerous', as long as they are doing it to a consenting partner.

Hi fwss,

Whether or not most dominats are sadists is probably a topic for another thread. If you look beyond the highly publicized S&M aspects of a D/S relationship, you will find there is an art to sensual domming and serving.

I think Jean and Friede answered your question.

Even consenting partners have needs, desires, wants and limits. Just because a sub is a masochist, doesn't mean they want pain all the time or that they don't want it within a particular set of guidelines.

I have friends who have survived some brutal relationships, where the dom would beat them, just because he could. Not for their mutual pleasure, but for the dom's pleasure. When safe words are not recognized, boundaries are not respected, when the rules are constantly changing and the sub is kept off balance or living in fear, then we move into the realm of selfishness and abuse.

If its consensual pain/pleasure, that's a different animal altogether.

What is the place of pain in a BDSM relationship?

a. it doesn't belong at all
b. it belongs under certain guidelines
c. it belongs if both people are having their needs met and are satisfied with the results/outcome
d. all of the above.

I'll go with d and add, it always depends on the individual relationship. BDSM is a huge umbrella, there is no right or wrong fetish, yet there is safe, sane and consensual play. Or if you're into risk aware consensual kink and that works for your relationship, that's okay, too. However, consensual is the key word.

Hope this helps explain my earlier comment,

Ruby