Is Obama a Socialist?

[MMI]

Free market capitalism relies upon the fellow man. You get by on your merits and quality of your goods in a free market capitalist society.

You get by if you have capital and you fail if you don't. Merit? Quality? Don't make me laugh.

And Michael Martine's activities mark him out as a capitalist, not as an "unbiased political scientist".

[steelish]

You get by if you have capital and you fail if you don't. Merit? Quality? Don't make me laugh.

And Michael Martine's activities mark him out as a capitalist, not as an "unbiased political scientist".

For your first statement - do you really think a little privately owned restaurant (a mom-and-pop establishment) that makes poor quality dishes, is dirty, people get sick from eating there, etc. will stay in business in America?

As to the second statement - he wrote positive notes on both systems, as well as negative ones. He was unbiased, no matter what you want to call him.

[MMI]

For your first statement - do you really think a little privately owned restaurant (a mom-and-pop establishment) that makes poor quality dishes, is dirty, people get sick from eating there, etc. will stay in business in America?

As to the second statement - he wrote positive notes on both systems, as well as negative ones. He was unbiased, no matter what you want to call him.

1. McDonalds?

2. I can say balanced things about capitalism, and sometimes I do. It doesn't stop me being biased in favour of social democracy, whatever you want to call me. Martine is openly and unapologetically conservative, and drives the point home with a patronising page addressed to Liberals, by which he seems to mean anyone to the left of his position. He was biased, certes

[steelish]

1. McDonalds?

That is a corporation. Not a little mom and pop business, which is btw, the bread and butter backbone of the US. I am speaking of a small store/establishment owned and run by an individual

2. I can say balanced things about capitalism, and sometimes I do. It doesn't stop me being biased in favour of social democracy, whatever you want to call me. Martine is openly and unapologetically conservative, and drives the point home with a patronising page addressed to Liberals, by which he seems to mean anyone to the left of his position. He was biased, certes

That may very well be. But he wasn't on that particuiar article. And that is the only one I am referring to.

[TantricSoul]

That is a corporation. Not a little mom and pop business, which is btw, the bread and butter backbone of the US. I am speaking of a small store/establishment owned and run by an individual

McDonalds Corporation only actually operates 25% of their locations. The other 75% are franchise owned and operated.

[steelish]

McDonalds Corporation only actually operates 25% of their locations. The other 75% are franchise owned and operated.

Ah, but an owned and operated FRANCHISE with corporate backing is hardly the same thing as a small sole proprietorship.

[TantricSoul]

Ah, but an owned and operated FRANCHISE with corporate backing is hardly the same thing as a small sole proprietorship.

Oh I agree its obviously not exactly the same, yet in many facets a franchise location is undeniably more closely related to a mom and pop store than a corporately operated location. Franchisees are typically considered small business owners, and have many of the same issues/obstacles unless they are area or territory licensees.

While bound by legal agreements and receiving "support" from the franchising corporation, the truth is once a franchisee is in a location it can be near impossible to get them out. Therefor there are huge variances in aspects such a cleanliness, quality, customer service, pricing and even selection when comparing one franchise location to another or a corporate location.

I worked for a global franchise corporation for over 20 years as a field consultant / operations expert and corporate trainer. I have seen far too many locations/operations that should have been run out of business, or had their stores taken back by the franchisor due to bad (often dangerous) or ridiculous practices or policies and yet they remained in business. Several of these franchisees that I personally know only operate these businesses as a tax shelter, and honestly don't care if they lose money or not.

To MMIs point, at least from my "half a career lifetime" experience in retail, success in capitalism is far less often the result of quality and merit as it is about doing whatever it takes to maximize profits. Its about the bottom line not about merit or people.

The average American consumer is far less sophisticated, knowledgeable or discriminatory than you might think. Which is where regulation comes into play. Were success truly based upon merit, quality, putting customers first, then we probably wouldn't need industry regulation. However time and time and time again that has not proven to be the case.

Respectfully,
Tantric

[MMI]

That is a corporation. Not a little mom and pop business, which is btw, the bread and butter backbone of the US. I am speaking of a small store/establishment owned and run by an individual



That may very well be. But he wasn't on that particuiar article. And that is the only one I am referring to.

McDonald's was started by two brothers. Not a dear little old lady and her husband, but I thought it was close enough. The fact that they turned themselves into a huge worldwide corporation answers your question.

[Thorne]

McDonald's was started by two brothers. Not a dear little old lady and her husband, but I thought it was close enough. The fact that they turned themselves into a huge worldwide corporation answers your question.

But they did so by providing quality food (each to his own opinion, of course) in a clean environment at a reasonable price. If their first restaurant had been a dingy, dreary dump with roaches crawling all over the counters and poor quality food they wouldn't have gotten anywhere.

[MMI]

But they did so by providing quality food (each to his own opinion, of course) in a clean environment at a reasonable price. If their first restaurant had been a dingy, dreary dump with roaches crawling all over the counters and poor quality food they wouldn't have gotten anywhere.

To be honest, I don't know what the first outlet was like, but they set a pattern.

Have you never met anyone who suffered stomach upset after eating at McDonalds? I have


Have you never been in a dirty McDonalds? I have

The food might seem to be cheap, but hamburgers are not known for their healthy qualities; nor are chips. Who does not attribute much of the blame for nationwide obesity to McDonalds and the like?