Imigration

[MMI]

Perhaps you're forgetting the war of 1812? The one that ended in 1814?

That's the war I suggested you speak to a Canadian about, to find out who won.

As between US and Great Britain, if you count territorial gains, the 1812 war was a no-score draw (a soccer term), if you count dead bodies, the US lost. If you count individual battles ... I'll let someone else work that out.

"In the end we ask who won and who lost the War of 1812. The clear loser in this conflict without any doubt is the Native People of North America. In the summer of 1815, the United States signed fifteen treaties with the tribes, guaranteeing their status as of 1811. But it did not return an acre of land. The dream of the Indian state never came true.

If any one could claim victory it was Canada. The United States declared war on Great Britain and set out to make Canada states in the union. Ten American armies crossed into Canada and all were driven out."

http://www.warof1812.ca/summary.html

Shortly before the British got their butts handed to them at New Orleans? They even wrote a song about it!

OK, you won a battle. Good for you. I know it was so important for America, but, frankly, it was a minor skirmish for us. Did you ever hear of Napoleon ... the French guy? That's who we were really worried about at the time.

I know the song ... I could even sing it while strumming a guitar (Lonnie Donegan's version). I also enjoyed singing "Yankee Doodle".

Only until the British surrendered.

It was always treachery. You have chosen to raise these men to the status of heros, and to eulogise about their exploits, but they were far from noble in reality.

It was just because they won. If they'd lost they would have been hanged as traitors. And that would have been just, too.

Might is always right huh? In that case Stalin was an angel and the Taliban should be running Afghanistan.

So are you implying that the illegal immigrants should unite and form a rebellion? Wouldn't that be a land-grab by poor criminals? Wouldn't that make them traitors?

No, that is a completely incorrect inference to draw. I am saying that it isn't a bad thing to ignore that particular law. If might be a land grab, but I see it more like trespass by tortfeasors.

It certainly doesn't make them traitors: they aren't Americans, are they?

Or perhaps you are just saying that any 'bad' law can be ignored, sidestepped if you will. But then, who decides what's a bad law? If I believe that the laws against murder are 'bad' laws, does that mean I can ignore them? I could just head on down to the border and open fire indiscriminately. Because the law against that is a 'bad' law!

No, I don't think that would work. We must have laws, or we'll all suffer. And if we don't like a law we must change it, not ignore it. The law can be changed from within, legally, through due process, or it can be changed illegally, from without, through rebellion. But if you go that route you must be prepared to set up your own government, with your own laws. And I can guarantee that those laws will provide for some kind of defense against cross-border incursions by foreign nationals. After all, you wouldn't want some lazy johnny-come-latelys to take back all that you stole in the first place, would you?

Any law that denies or suppresses a human right is a bad law. And anyone who regards illegal immigrants as "lazy johnny-come-latelys" should really take a long hard look at himself.