hmmmm

[Ozme52]

right..got all that, Tom....love you.......great big hugs!

but the question is....... why dont the men post pics....any pics...of themselves???

Why? LOL, because someone wouldn't approve my attachment.

Part of the effort to keep the server from crashing I suspect.

[TomOfSweden]

Why? LOL, because someone wouldn't approve my attachment.

Part of the effort to keep the server from crashing I suspect.

Yeah... quite a number of my pics have been kicked out. I used to be a kinky party organizer, (up to just a few months ago). I owned the rights of the watermarked pics. They were still nuked every time no matter what I said. Really annoying. Anyhoo... this was long ago now. And this place is under new management.

[gemmy]

Why? LOL, because someone wouldn't approve my attachment.

Part of the effort to keep the server from crashing I suspect.

lol Oz - ok checked your profile, tis not there either - there are many places you can put it you know *giggles* (hmmm note to self: talk to Amber...)

*whistles innocently*

[Ozme52]

lol Oz - ok checked your profile, tis not there either - there are many places you can put it you know *giggles* (hmmm note to self: talk to Amber...)

*whistles innocently*

Perhaps I shall when I return home.

[Ozme52]

lol Oz - ok checked your profile, tis not there either - there are many places you can put it you know *giggles* (hmmm note to self: talk to Amber...)

*whistles innocently*

Look for it quickly or it may disappear on you...

[gemmy]

What could you possibly lose by posting a non nude passport style photo here? Anything?

We're not talking nude pictures here. I'm not showing my penis in any of my pics, am I? This is really not a big deal. Everybody has a digital camera. So you can't blame it on the effort. If you have issues about posting your picture here you are hiding something. It could be shame about your perceived ugliness, shyness or something similar. Are you afraid somebody in the real world you know might share your interest, (otherwise they wouldn't be here)? Well, good!

But for fucks sake, don't pretend like it isn't! Like it's some kind of honourable statement or something someone of your astute character wouldn't stoop to. It's just offensive to me that anyone would even remotely consider the possibility that I could fall for such a stupid excuse. I mean..."much more excitement in allowing ones own mind to create the imagery"... wow!!! Rampant self-deceit if I ever saw it. No, that's not what it is about at all. It's just a photo!

It's not a question of being obsessed by seeing an image. It's a nice thing. I don't really care that much if I get to see a picture of anybody here. It's your mind I'm interested in. But a photo is always nice.

So you think you look bad in photos? Welcome to the human race. We all think we look worse in photos than in "reality". Get over it.

Do you think you're too over-weight to be liked? Even if it were true that somebody you like aren't attracted to some cushioning, its good to get that out of the way as early as possible, isn't it? What would you prefer being rejected by a guy you've got something serious going with or somebody you simply fancy.

It really isn't a big deal.

*applauds*

Thank you Tom!

I know many have talked about having their images stolen - for what?? and who cares? You're the only one who owns the face that belongs to the photos.

For me personally, the only person's opinion that I care about is my daughter's and since I'm completely open and honest with her, I have nothing to hide from anyone.

[blythe spirit]

It really isn't a big deal.

Perhaps not to you, but to some it is a big deal. This is freedom of choice, no? I had a mental image of you, Tom, from your posts, then I saw your pics.

[QUOTE=mastersgem;678592For me personally, the only person's opinion that I care about is my daughter's and since I'm completely open and honest with her, I have nothing to hide from anyone.[/QUOTE]

I think it's wonderful that you have an open and honest relationship with your daughter. And I'm sure she's proud of your most recent photo shoot. The pics are amazing and so are you; however, not all of us are as free and open with relatives, friends, co-workers. It's not that they might be browsing this site, but someone they know might be and... "hey is this your mom, aunt, friend, teacher, mayor, etc?" Again, not posting a pic is freedom of choice.

Still, I'm off topic, as usual. hehe Yeah, I agree with Tom and gemmy - you Doms start posting some pics. We submissives want to know what we're getting into. lol

p.s. guess I'll never get that multi-quote thing right. lol

[TomOfSweden]

Perhaps not to you, but to some it is a big deal. This is freedom of choice, no? I had a mental image of you, Tom, from your posts, then I saw your pics.

I think it's wonderful that you have an open and honest relationship with your daughter. And I'm sure she's proud of your most recent photo shoot. The pics are amazing and so are you; however, not all of us are as free and open with relatives, friends, co-workers. It's not that they might be browsing this site, but someone they know might be and... "hey is this your mom, aunt, friend, teacher, mayor, etc?" Again, not posting a pic is freedom of choice.

Which was exactly my point. I wrote this: "If you have issues about posting your picture here you are hiding something. It could be shame about your perceived ugliness, shyness or something similar."

You just said it yourself. You fear any repercussions you might experience from it getting out where you live that you're into hanky panky sex. Fine. I wasn't reacting to that. If I was a hot submissive chick in Afghanistan I wouldn't post my picture on-line no matter how much my Master commanded it. I mean... it's dangerous.

What I reacted to was those pretending like it wasn't. As if not seeing someone's picture was better somehow. I strongly doubt that anybody living in a western country could suffer any repercussions from posting pics here... but what do I know? I've never been to the Bible belt. For all I know the Christian Talebans might be as bad as their Afghani counterparts!?! If the wrong person accuses you of having posted your picture here.... just deny it. They could have found that picture anywhere. There's no extra brownie points for being truthful to morons. Again... this is assuming its an innocent picture.

...and your kids will always think you're silly and your sons friends will always think you're super hot, (if you're a lady). Who cares? At worst it'll be educational for them. But maybe I'm being overly modern now again? What seven year old today isn't already bored with seeing pictures of Japanese school girls spraying diarrhoea in each other's mouths? These are modern times. If you think any pics of you, (not specifically you) would be news worthy enough to be spread over the net, I think you're overestimating yourself.

Anyway.... you have to own up to the fact that the reason you don't post your pics is largely down to irrational fear. Nothing wrong with that. I've got an irrational fear of loads of things. But don't pretend like it isn't. We're all adults here. If you're not comfortable about something... don't do it. It's as simple as that. You don't have to make up some stupid cover story to hide behind. We all know the truth anyway.

[blythe spirit]

Which was exactly my point. I wrote this: "If you have issues about posting your picture here you are hiding something. It could be shame about your perceived ugliness, shyness or something similar."

Yes, indeedy, that's what you wrote but that's hardly the same, in my opinon, as fearing the loss of job and family.

What I reacted to was those pretending like it wasn't. As if not seeing someone's picture was better somehow.

And yet somehow it is at times. (bites tongue) Maybe not to you, but there are some of us out there that truly want to know someone from the inside out.

Sorry for interrupting this scheduled program. Back on topic. Some day, I promise to get this quote thing right. hehe

[gemmy]

Perhaps not to you, but to some it is a big deal. This is freedom of choice, no? I had a mental image of you, Tom, from your posts, then I saw your pics.



I think it's wonderful that you have an open and honest relationship with your daughter. And I'm sure she's proud of your most recent photo shoot. The pics are amazing and so are you; however, not all of us are as free and open with relatives, friends, co-workers. It's not that they might be browsing this site, but someone they know might be and... "hey is this your mom, aunt, friend, teacher, mayor, etc?" Again, not posting a pic is freedom of choice.

Still, I'm off topic, as usual. hehe Yeah, I agree with Tom and gemmy - you Doms start posting some pics. We submissives want to know what we're getting into. lol

p.s. guess I'll never get that multi-quote thing right. lol

lol hunnie

Agreed - it is a choice freely made or not. To each his/her own for sure.

I really originally started the thread because of guys like bradley who say "you will give me a photo or post a photo because I am Dom and you do whatever I say but I may or may not give you mine in return" bullshit. I was hoping some more of the real, honest Dom's would give some input as well.

We all post or don't post for our own reasons and we are all entitled to those reasons, but hiding behind them thinking you (not you personally hun) are more superior than anyone else is another matter entirely and I applauded Tom for being bold enough to put it out there

[fetishdj]

Miss Elizabeth: If you have a decent webcam they sometimes have 'still photo buttons' on them which you can use to take a quick shot of you. Quality is not the best sometimes but it does for posting avatars.

Do you not have a mobile phone with a camera? Most of them have one these days and they are not bad quality wise now. Some of them even have multiexposure and time delay settings (which are useful when photographing yourself or for action shots such as whipping a sub )

If you were anywhere close I'd offer to come and photograph you using my camera.

[Logic1]

<--- There is Me. It has been there for a long time now.
I got better pics of me that I have shown some of you here but I dont really feel the need to show myself either.
On another point. Tom. I am willing to bet that you would be one interesting guy to have around for a long dinner and some wine.
I truely appreciate your long posts and thoughts!

[TomOfSweden]

<--- There is Me. It has been there for a long time now.
I got better pics of me that I have shown some of you here but I dont really feel the need to show myself either.
On another point. Tom. I am willing to bet that you would be one interesting guy to have around for a long dinner and some wine.
I truely appreciate your long posts and thoughts!

Come up to Stockholm and you'll find out for yourself. I'll show you the limited kinky scene we have going here.

[Logic1]

Come up to Stockholm and you'll find out for yourself. I'll show you the limited kinky scene we have going here.

I might take you up on that when me and my girl are passing through Stockholm later on this summer.
thanks for the invite

[thepast]

You can stick pictures in your profile--as your profile pic, avatar, or make a photo album.

You can stick pictures in any of the pictures threads in the Pictures area--though if they are of you, they go into Self Portraits.

There isn't a lack of places to put them, there's a lack of places to put them inside other forums *smiles* when they don't pertain to the thread topic enough for them to be approved (see my post about 3-5 days ago in this thread about that).

As for watermarked pics... if you can show legal proof to the site ownership that they are yours, you will probably be allowed to post them. Mods & Admins are on standing orders to delete all marked pictures (see Copyright blog located in Comments & Suggestions, inside the lonnnng thread about IP) for Copyright reasons. The site takes seriously any possible copyright infringments.

You can also post your pics in your messanger services, or on your own webpage, or on facebooks/myspace, etc.

There isn't a shortage of places to post your pics, there's just an excessive concentration gradient of excuses & whining...

[Ozme52]

There isn't a shortage of places to post your pics, there's just an excessive concentration gradient of excuses & whining...

LOL, Not whining so much as teasing. weg

[cadence]

LOL, Not whining so much as teasing. weg

Freakin tease!!

[Ozme52]

Freakin tease!!

[gemmy]

LOL, Not whining so much as teasing. weg

Yup - totally knew that's what you were doing

[AdrianaAurora]

I don't like it when people think they know me or make judgments about and on me without knowing the real me, all of me, as such I would rather get to know someone fully, and have them reciprocate this.

it is a really irritates me when people start to think they know me, as a result of their limited contact and their impressions of me based upon how I look. Ask and I will tell all!

It is impossible to set out and fully get to know every person we meet, our brains would overload so we prioritize and discard to the best of our abilities. It isn't right, just or politically correct - its a survival mechanism. I do agree with you that its irritating and frustrating.

But we're all weak. All of us. First off it doesn't take many minutes of studying biology, astronomy or physics to figure out that there's not a hell of a lot keeping us alive, and there's plenty out there that "wants" to kill us.

Secondly, the perception of weakness is built into our species. That's what it means to be a social species. We're instinctually guided toward believing that we're better off solving problems together than alone.

It takes an insane amount of self delusion to believe that you're a one man/woman army capable of tolerating any rejection. But nobody outside of an insane assylum believes that of themselves. Not really. But that's not the issue really.The issue is whether or not we think that other people really are and really feel strong. That's a question of insecurity.

I wasn’t really talking about biology.

Salman Rushdie once said that each of us is three persons in one - how we perceive ourselves, how other people perceive us and how we really are.

We live in a society where perception is everything and people buy into it. You said it yourself that its more socially acceptable to come out as a Dom than as a submissive. Why?
If you told people who know me that I am into BDSM, 70% of them would bet their lives that I am a Domme. If we are talking just about my work place, that percentage rises to 98-99%.
Because, if, hypothetically speaking, one morning during daily briefing session I blurted out “oh, btw, I am submissive” some would think its funny, some wouldn’t believe it, while I wouldn’t get fired my boss might start to think I am not ambitious, driven or capable enough to be in charge, some would have misplaced concern that I am being abused and most importantly my subordinates, 95% of them male, sexist and some of whom still have a hard time stomaching the fact they have to take orders from a petit girl half their age would think that they now get to boss me around, that I am a pushover. In my family and professional life, when things fall apart I am the one who stays in control, the one everyone leans on, I am not inclined to burst their bubble. This is just a part of whom I am, it’s not the whole of me, and I don’t want everything I am to be judged through the prism of it.
I also like the connection and intimacy bubble it creates, it’s our thing.
Don’t get me wrong, we don’t keep it a secret, but those (outside of bdsm circle) to whom we have told, people who know me well, still took time to relax and grasp their mind around the fact that this is what I want and He is not abusing me. He on the other hand usually gets a clap on the back and a “lucky bastard” grins.
Frankly I am way too lazy and can’t be bothered to explain it to everyone I know, ad nauseam, until they get it. Some just don’t.

That's a question of insecurity. We can know things without feeling it in our heart.

You nailed it with this quote. I freely admit that. I even have a similar definition of it, though yours is better. I may intellectually know I look good, but I lack self awareness of it. What I find frustrating is when people think thats my defining trait or that it also means I lack self-esteem to stand up to them when they cross the line. I honestly don't care what other people think about who I am or how I look, regardless of whether that opinion is positive or negative, I am pretty immune to the whole mass mentality thing. The only person about whose opinion I occasionally obsess about is the person/Dom to whom I am attracted to.

[gemmy]

"....If you told people who know me that I am into BDSM, 70% of them would bet their lives that I am a Domme. If we are talking just about my work place, that percentage rises to 98-99%.
Because, if, hypothetically speaking, one morning during daily briefing session I blurted out “oh, btw, I am submissive” some would think its funny, some wouldn’t believe it, while I wouldn’t get fired my boss might start to think I am not ambitious, driven or capable enough to be in charge, some would have misplaced concern that I am being abused and most importantly my subordinates, 95% of them male, sexist and some of whom still have a hard time stomaching the fact they have to take orders from a petit girl half their age would think that they now get to boss me around, that I am a pushover. In my family and professional life, when things fall apart I am the one who stays in control, the one everyone leans on, I am not inclined to burst their bubble. This is just a part of whom I am, it’s not the whole of me...."

God, that is so me as well lol - even some Doms (and I use the term loosely) say I Must be switch since I'm the boss at work and always have held positions of authority lol *rme*

[craven]

95% of them male, sexist and some of whom still have a hard time stomaching the fact they have to take orders from a petit girl half their age would think that they now get to boss me around, that I am a pushover. In my family and professional life, when things fall apart I am the one who stays in control, the one everyone leans on, I am not inclined to burst their bubbler me*

it is indeed a shame that this type of attitude still exists, and I am not going to defend or deny it for I know and appreciate that it does, and it is totally indefensible.

I am glad to consider myself one of the 5%, although I feel the figures may be a little less than accurate, I am sure it varies from industry to industry and then company to company.

My work life it totally separated from my home and private lives, I am able to compartmentlise my life.

I could never imagine being in a situation whereby a female colleague or boss ( my company has a good mix of male and female senior personnel) was to state in pubic that she was a submissive, however if she did, or as is more likely confide this to me it would in no way alter our professional working relationship.

Nor would it I hasten to add if the statement was that she was a domme!

I would certainly never look at anyone and make a snap decision or judgment, based on any appearances, whether these be sex, age, colour, height or what ever.

I think we are getting back to what we first discussed in that it is not sensible, if not dangerous even, to make decisions based upon an individuals looks.

Get to know people, maybe, just maybe this is why doms do not feel the need or wish to post pictures of themselves on their profile pages !

We are looking to connect and develop relationships on a deeper and more established level.

if any sub out there wishes to see a picture of a dom I am sure that he would be only to happy to acquiesce to correctly worded and respectful requests.

Once a suitable rapport and understanding has been established of course.

[gemmy]

it is indeed a shame that this type of attitude still exists, and I am not going to defend or deny it for I know and appreciate that it does, and it is totally indefensible.

I am glad to consider myself one of the 5%, although I feel the figures may be a little less than accurate, I am sure it varies from industry to industry and then company to company.

My work life it totally separated from my home and private lives, I am able to compartmentlise my life.

I could never imagine being in a situation whereby a female colleague or boss ( my company has a good mix of male and female senior personnel) was to state in pubic that she was a submissive, however if she did, or as is more likely confide this to me it would in no way alter our professional working relationship.

Nor would it I hasten to add if the statement was that she was a domme!

I would certainly never look at anyone and make a snap decision or judgment, based on any appearances, whether these be sex, age, colour, height or what ever.

I think we are getting back to what we first discussed in that it is not sensible, if not dangerous even, to make decisions based upon an individuals looks.

Get to know people, maybe, just maybe this is why doms do not feel the need or wish to post pictures of themselves on their profile pages !

We are looking to connect and develop relationships on a deeper and more established level.

if any sub out there wishes to see a picture of a dom I am sure that he would be only to happy to acquiesce to correctly worded and respectful requests.

Once a suitable rapport and understanding has been established of course.

Firstly hun, I wasn't the original quoter on that piece, AdrianaAurora was

Secondly, on that bit about respectful requests - why is it assumed that just because someone has titled themselves "Dom" "Lord" or "Master" must it be assumed that All subs should grant them respect? or have to 'correctly word' anything?? I am not saying we should never be polite because I always am but that has no reference to whom I'm speaking with, sub, Dom, Domme, switch. I just feel it courtesy to be polite with people unless they otherwise give me a reason not to be but to automatically Have to 'correctly word or respectfully request', I don't think so!

Same can be said for all those 'doms' (again, I use the term Very loosely lol) who come at me with "you will address me correctly by calling me Sir, Master (appropriate self given dominant title here). That one makes me want to fall out of my chair laughing every single time! If you have to 'force' people to call you by a Title; you aren't worthy of said Title imo .

[craven]

Firstly hun, I wasn't the original quoter on that piece, AdrianaAurora was

Secondly, on that bit about respectful requests - why is it assumed that just because someone has titled themselves "Dom" "Lord" or "Master" must it be assumed that All subs should grant them respect? or have to 'correctly word' anything?? I am not saying we should never be polite because I always am but that has no reference to whom I'm speaking with, sub, Dom, Domme, switch. I just feel it courtesy to be polite with people unless they otherwise give me a reason not to be but to automatically Have to 'correctly word or respectfully request', I don't think so!

Same can be said for all those 'doms' (again, I use the term Very loosely lol) who come at me with "you will address me correctly by calling me Sir, Master (appropriate self given dominant title here). That one makes me want to fall out of my chair laughing every single time! If you have to 'force' people to call you by a Title; you aren't worthy of said Title imo .

Thank you Mastersgem for your thoughts, I have enjoyed reading the debate, which has progressed greatly from its original starting point I feel.

I agree totally with you in regard to doms who seek to be addressed in a specific manner, I would never request anyone to do this and indeed would be uncomfortable with being addressed in any way other than Cravan, as this is my online name, I am no ones master, sir or lord or any such title other than my submissives, it would not be right or fitting for anyone else to address me so.

I also would like to stress that I do not require or instruct my submissive to address me as such, it is for them to ask to do so, I am a firm believer that such things cannot be taken, they can only be given, this is the bond and relationship between submissive ( I do not personally like the word sub) and dom.

I was being somewhat tongue in cheek with my statement in relation to polite requests, however flippancy removed, irrespective of the nature of the culture of BDSM common courtesy should be the norm and not the exception, as such, yes if some one requests something from me I would expect a degree of politeness to accompany any said request. I know that I would ask in a similar manner, irrespective of the status of the person that I was speaking with

[Edm_Trainer]

My work life it totally separated from my home and private lives, I am able to compartmentlise my life.

I would certainly never look at anyone and make a snap decision or judgment, based on any appearances, whether these be sex, age, colour, height or what ever.

Get to know people, maybe, just maybe this is why doms do not feel the need or wish to post pictures of themselves on their profile pages !

We are looking to connect and develop relationships on a deeper and more established level.

If any sub out there wishes to see a picture of a dom I am sure that he would be only to happy to acquiesce to correctly worded and respectful requests.

Once a suitable rapport and understanding has been established of course.

Edited for brevity, and yet the words continue to outline the truth.
I speak for myself only, but simply put... there is no "fear of repercussion", there is no "shyness or fear" of anyone's pro or con reaction, there isn't even any deeper psychological debate to be had other than my singular choice.

I have pics, I simply choose not to share - until I choose to share.

And having met a couple of people from here, it can be validated that I really have no fear about meeting someone face to face.

Thus, maybe the question becomes "what is there to be gained from showing one's pic, that others could not glean from taking the time to know you better as a person?"

Just a random thought, topical or no...

[blythe spirit]

Well, here I am again and seeing as this thread goes in and out of topic, guess I'll have my Tom reBUTTal. *giggles*


TOM wrote: But nobody ever has, and you won't? Has this happened to anybody? Ever? How isn't this just pure paranoia? But I don't think it's paranoia. I think you're just being shy but not admitting it to yourself. There's nothing wrong with being shy. I think it is very cute in moderate doses. We've all been in a situation where we've been shy and had to over-come it. We can all empathise. Just admit it! You won't lose anything.

So you've got nothing fear, have you? Embrace your shyness. It's useless to deny it. It's not like anybody is going to think anything else are they? Either people will think that you're bullshitting or a little bit cute. What do you think will play to your advantage in the long run?

Truly, Tom, I have no idea how it is in Sweden, but in America there's always some scandal on the news about people getting "caught" on the internet. With me, it most likely is paranoia, because the girl ain't shy - with words or actions. lol

And even though I find what you say extremely patronizing, I still have to shake my head and laugh out loud, because the way your mind works is sooooooo "cute." But even more humorous to me is that you know you're right. hehe

A thought just occurred to me, I wonder if men feel that they don't have to post pics, because there are, in comparison, fewer men than women? The reasoning behind this is that women often times "settle" for less than their ideal due to the shortage. Maybe that's why women post their pics more. I don't know - hehe- it made sense in my brain whilst I was thinking it. rofl.

Well, I'm taking my cute little butt and my opinon off the soap box now.

[TomOfSweden]

Truly, Tom, I have no idea how it is in Sweden, but in America there's always some scandal on the news about people getting "caught" on the internet. With me, it most likely is paranoia, because the girl ain't shy - with words or actions. lol

At no point have I been talking about naked pictures. I'm just talking about regular holiday-type shots. Pictures like that couldn't offend the most easily aroused amateur-porn-surfing Bible thumper.

No, I'm not patronising. When groups of people agree on a comfortable lie and pat each others backs ensuring each other it is true, I feel it needs to be crushed before it spreads. Because I actually like seeing other peoples pictures here. If somebody who wasn't shy wants to post their pic here and hear and believe your opinion that you think it's better not to see their photo, we won't see the pic. And that I think is bad. This is a very obvious comfortable lie. The less of these the better IMHO.

Its not a question of goading anybody to post pics. If you don't want to post your picture on-line I'll respect that. I don't look down on anybody who doesn't. Just don't make up stories to make yourself feel better about not wanting to post it. That's all I ask.

[claire]

Nice try peeps, but none of the character slurs seem to have goaded anyone in to posting pictures.

[craven]

Claire you want a picture ask nicely and I will let you have one, LOL

[claire]

Claire you want a picture ask nicely and I will let you have one, LOL

Thanks craven, but I actually kind of like the fantasy created by the AVs.