Self esteem and self confidence

[emi herself]

I am a 24/7 Sub,but I have horrible Self esteem and confidence. Which I belive stems from my many years of bad relationships and troubled childhood. Sometimes its so bad I dont want to leave our house or even work, because I dont want anyone looking at me. I become a hermit of sorts.

To clear up how bad it is :
I think im ugly
stupid
fat
good for nothing
waste of time
I think everyone is better than me
horrible girl,mother,sister,friend,wife to be
I wont let friends over
I even become suicidal...


My Master/husband to be is wonderful and tells me all the time how wonderful and beautiful I am. That its all in my head. That he loves me more than anything, he also has me look things up online and read into it as much as possible to help me out. But it doesnt seem to be enough and I really rather not see a shrink.Which I might just have to.

So I was wondering if any subs (and or Masters)on here have the same problem. If so how do/did you deal with it? What helped and didnt help?
What can my Master do to help me through bad days?

Im just ready to be happy with myself.

[l1zzy]

If you figure it out, please let me now. I'd give you a major organ. Or my soul. Whichever's to your fancy.

Depending on your opinions, it can be fixed by thought modification forms of therapy. Personally, I've had absolutely no luck with that and prefer to completely repress the whole shebang. Probably not completely healthy, but it's my opinion that thought modification is more than a little useless when being bombarded constantly by the rest of society with messages that reassert your negative worth. Whenever I actually manage to feel cute/sexy/intelligent/worthwhile for more than 5 minutes, some form of validated and supported society simply slams all my inadequacies back into my face.

I concentrate on the things I like about myself and try to completely ignore everything else. I like the freckles on the back of my hands...I like that people think I have a "phone sex" voice...I like that no matter how much weight I gain my calves stay pure muscle (Hubby's got a thing for legs). If I concentrate on those things I can live with the fact that I'm heinously overweight, certifiably insane, hideously scarred, and more than a little retarded sometimes.

I'm currently working real hard on the "if you project sexy/capable/intelligent, you ARE sexy/capable/intelligent" theory. My cousin is a big girl too...but she's gorgeous. Just plain stunning. She oozes confidence and charm and flirtatious energy. I'm related to her and I just might do her. My sister isn't much into book smarts...but when she talks people sit up and listen. Doesn't matter that she's young or rough around the edges or sometimes has to backtrack because her words get all tripped up. When you're around her, you're almost sure she could take on anyone and do anything...because she thinks she can and just makes you FEEL it when you're around her. Whereas I tend to skulk and blend in as "one of the guys" and be timid with my opinions and thoughts. It's become the group consensus that if I would act like I value myself, then people would act like I'm someone of value in return and that would eventually allow me to truly believe I was worth something. Just a different form of thought mod but I'm hoping it's slightly more effective than the "think happy thoughts" version of thought mod I'm used to.

I think whatever point I was supposed to be making got lost somewhere in that rambling but part of my new "plan" thingy includes not obsessively analyzing things before I type/say them so, oh well. You're not alone though. Maybe we should start a club for women who can't tell mainstream media and society to shove their plastic impossible standards up their asses.

[thrall]

*hugs and kisses*

yes i understand fully.........i shead the same tears over your childhood.....

Dont let the shadows of past,.....

poision your present or future!!!

You are among friends here, be yourself, and we will all love you for who you are........


You are NOT......

ugly
stupid
fat
good for nothig
a wast of time
less that others
or horrible

and as to friends, you are among freinds here, and you dont even need to leave the house....

Thrall

[John56{vg}]

Honey,

I am a dom and I am 50, soon to be 51. I have had a rich, full life, accomplished many things, been with some very attractive, intelligent, vivacious women, travelled extensively. I have even been a fairly successful actor and comedian and dated an actress from an Academy Award winning film. I have, in the past, lived well, had many friends and socialized extensively.

I have also felt that I was all the things that you feel about yourself. I KNOW that to you all those things are very real. I just hate that you are feeling them, becaue they are a sham, a hateful expression of all the people and incidents that told you you were not enough. Your inner judge renders a verdit and a harsh harsh sentence that sometimes is a death warrant. I know I have attempted suicide a few times. Got so bad I ended up in the hospital for seven days.

The first part of the good news for you is that you have a loving wonderful man in your life that sees through that sham and judge and will tell you about it.

The only thing shameful or wrong or "ugly" about you is that inner voice that is telling you those hateful things about yourself. Sooooo, don't listen to that voice. Listen to your man, your master. He is telling you the truth, You are telling yourself lies.

Second, (and more good news about the beautiful person you are), you posted here. These people at the Library are golden. They are supportive, informative and they have experienced a lot, good and bad, in their lives.

I was a hermit until I found this place. I was lost till I found this place. So become part of our family, talk to subs and doms that have experienced what you have. And I think that will help you.

And last (and maybe most importantly) seek professional help. It was a Godsend to me. I got meds that saved me and talked to therapists that watched over me. So start now and go get help.

We are pulling for you and good luck.

I wanted to add this, I didn't know you were davidnhisgirl till just now. You are the very opposite of ugly hon. You are very beautiful.

John

[Rhabbi]

Self esteem issues are in all of us. Just keep reminding yourself that all those people out there are just like you. Insecure and lonely. You can make it, we all have.

[tanis]

Self esteem issues are in all of us. Just keep reminding yourself that all those people out there are just like you. Insecure and lonely. You can make it, we all have.

I agree. Been there, worked at it for years (all my life) and only a little while ago did I start to believe the nice things my loved ones said about me. It still gets in my head...but I think this:

If you were my submissive I would find that statement highly insulting. In fact, let me ask you do you think your master has such horrible taste and sense that he would pick someone who is in fact:

ugly
stupid
fat
good for nothing
and a waste of his time?

finally got into my head by a loved one and one day stuck. That was just the beginning. It is a waste of time to stew in our flaws and weaknesses.

[TomOfSweden]

Self esteem issues are in all of us. Just keep reminding yourself that all those people out there are just like you. Insecure and lonely. You can make it, we all have.

I think you hit the nail on the head here, Rhabbi. Most, (if not all) of us have insecurity issues. And with "us" I don't mean people into BDSM, but all humans. Chances are you are just normal. I think blaming your background is just a way for you to explain or justify it, but I think you might be wrong. Possibly you are holding yourself down and using your background to keep yourself down. The human mind is all but rational and logical.

It might be as simple as telling yourself you're great and beautiful. Write it with a marker on the mirror you use every morning. Beat that into your head instead.

[gloombunny]

One thing I've found can help, and that hasn't already been mentioned, is simply doing something that you're good at. The best way is to have a useful, productive job that you do well, but that's not always feasible to arrange. If it's not, you might think about taking up some sort of hobby or craft that interests you and spending enough time on it to do it well.

Being good at something is a surprisingly effective way to not feel good for nothing.

[gagged_Louise]

One thing I've found can help, and that hasn't already been mentioned, is simply doing something that you're good at. The best way is to have a useful, productive job that you do well, but that's not always feasible to arrange. If it's not, you might think about taking up some sort of hobby or craft that interests you and spending enough time on it to do it well.

Being good at something is a surprisingly effective way to not feel good for nothing.

I totally agree, Natalie. Having to fit to others' ideas (parents, schoolmates, authorities, a too narrow-minded church, bureaucrats) of what you should be and what works to do is a surefire way to grinding down your self-esteem, especially when you're actually trying to bring something into the world that hasn't been made a hundred times before. Of course that's not just an "interior" thing, it can be damn much built on making money, getting an education or being able to move to another part of the country and in doing so, being in a position to tell some of those other leeches to keep at a safe distance. But just like Natalie put it, one way of creating that inner space of self-esteem and stability is to pick up something you enjoy doing and which you may not have to see in pro terms if you don't want to. It may be more or less closely wired to your long-term goals, the thing that matters is that you don't have to defend it to others or follow others' rules.

Unfortunately, we live in an age that forces many people to walk around hunching for idiotic reasons.

[retsam6]

I have never known a ugly person in 53 year. Whatever shape or face that we were giving is not our choice. But what we do with it is our choice. You have found a place where everyone is equal and the only thing that is judged is the way we treat our fellow member with kindness, respect and the eagerness to know about our chosen lifestyle and how we fit into it. I wish you the best in exploring it with us.

[Phantom]

I have never known a ugly person in 53 year. Whatever shape or face that we were giving is not our choice. But what we do with it is our choice. You have found a place where everyone is equal and the only thing that is judged is the way we treat our fellow member with kindness, respect and the eagerness to know about our chosen lifestyle and how we fit into it. I wish you the best in exploring it with us.

Well said sir.

emi, know this: If your husband finds you beautiful you are beautiful. His opinion is the one that truly matters. If it helps though, I also think you are beautiful.

[margaret]

*hugs* You're in a bad place mentally, and it's no fun.

I would strongly suggest seeing your doctor and asking for a referral to a therapist and a psychiatrist. There are drugs that, if the doctors decide to use them, might help you more than you realize.

I used affirmations - constant repetitions of phrases like "I am beautiful," "I am strong," "I am caring," "I am smart," etc. When you say it often enough, you begin to believe it. http://www.coping.org/growth/affirm.htm has an explanation of the principle and how to put it in action. People who tell you things to the opposite are not your friends and their opinion doesn't matter. Regardless of who they are, if they tell you that you are bad or unworthy, they are not your friends and you should not listen to them.

Join a support group. If you'd like, I know of a few forums dedicated to mental health issues - and what you're describing is not limited to submissives, it's something that anyone can experience. PM me and I'll give you the web address for a forum with very nice people who have been there, done that, and are more than willing to lend an ear and a shoulder.

As to what your Dom can do ... he should be understanding. He should not order you to "stop thinking that way" - it's impossible to just stop thinking that way, it requires a lot of work, and when you fail to stop thinking that way it increases the depression. "It's all in your head" is bad for me to hear, because it implies fault in my mental processes and minimizes the feelings that are, at that moment, very real, and if it makes you feel worse you should tell him that. Another thing that is bad for me when I'm in that state is play involving a lot of humiliation and name-calling, though my experience is not yours and your reaction may be different. It sounds to me like he's doing the best he can.

You mentioned that you get suicidal. Please, if that happens, call the number at http://www.suicidepreventionlifeline.org/ or some similar number. You shouldn't have to deal with that (and your Dom shouldn't leave you alone if he can help it). Those people are very caring and non-judgmental, and are available 24-7 to people in need.

I'm off the drugs now, and tea and chocolate are sufficient for taking away the blues when they come back. Your life can get better, and I hope you find something that works.

[emi herself]

I want to thank you all for your lovely words and thoughts! It means words to me. David is very loving and helps in everyway possible I couldn't ask for a better man in my life.

You all have helped me understand myself a bit more I can not thank you all enough. I cant wait to see what others might say to help. Please keep posting. I belive this will not only help me but many others like me!

Thank you again.

[thrall]

Hi

so i assume that this is you.................

you are a beautiful person..........i see it in the eyes............

~hugs~

[Ozme52]

I am a 24/7 Sub,but I have horrible Self esteem and confidence. Which I belive stems from my many years of bad relationships and troubled childhood. Sometimes its so bad I dont want to leave our house or even work, because I dont want anyone looking at me. I become a hermit of sorts.

To clear up how bad it is :
I think im ugly
stupid
fat
good for nothing
waste of time
I think everyone is better than me
horrible girl,mother,sister,friend,wife to be
I wont let friends over
I even become suicidal...


My Master/husband to be is wonderful and tells me all the time how wonderful and beautiful I am. That its all in my head. That he loves me more than anything, he also has me look things up online and read into it as much as possible to help me out. But it doesnt seem to be enough and I really rather not see a shrink.Which I might just have to.

So I was wondering if any subs (and or Masters)on here have the same problem. If so how do/did you deal with it? What helped and didnt help?
What can my Master do to help me through bad days?

Im just ready to be happy with myself.

There are a lot of things that can be said... most of which I'm sure you've heard in one form or another... all trying to bolster the sagging self image of yourself. Whether brought on by parents, prior partners, or just a series of circumstances that over the years have torn your self respect apart, it's all irrelevent.

I'm going to answer this from the sole perspective of a dom.

Consider what I highlighted in red. If you were my submissive I would find that statement highly insulting. In fact, let me ask you do you think your master has such horrible taste and sense that he would pick someone who is in fact:

ugly
stupid
fat
good for nothing
and a waste of his time?

And why would you want to be with someone who has so little sense?

The point which I'm making is that once you look at the flip side (and stop insulting your master's good taste) you will suddenly see yourself as the cherished prize he no doubt considers you to be.

You just have to trust him in this matter as you do when you submit to him in other matters.

[emi herself]

Wow Ozme52 I never thought of it in that way. Your right I am being rude and selfish. My Master has VERY good taste *wink*. Thank you for putting it that way. It helps me understand better.

[Ozme52]

Wow Ozme52 I never thought of it in that way. Your right I am being rude and selfish. My Master has VERY good taste *wink*. Thank you for putting it that way. It helps me understand better.

You're welcome emi.

[thrall]

Listen to everyone Emi...........

~hugs~

[Sir_Russell]

emi,

Most sub understand your feelings and it seems the best ones have them, I call it subbie disease. The problem is when your picture of yourself is set by the media or Madison Avenue that you are in real trouble. Why do you think that the models super or otherwise are so screwed up. My self I don't like skinny women, yet that is what we are lead to believe is sexy.

Be yourself, work to do what is right at all times and you will be better then 98% of the population.

[BorderCollie]

emi & thrall,
I feel I gotta step in here!
I ask you this, with reference to the fat, stooopid, ugly remarks....

You both have doms that must love & cherish you both, you must have jobs etc thus you are neither stooopid or ugly.

My sub, used to have these kind of issues and I asked her this question.

1) Do you really beleive in your heart not your head that your partners wouldn't be with you if they thought the same way???

Again none of your deep down issues are very real.

2) I also asked my sub, who else do you really have to impress???

I feel that you both really show some deep down courage to bring it to a forum like this, and I dip my hat to you both.

Look at it this way, things are really not as bad as you think.

If you can look up, you can get up! I personally am super proud of you both and I don't even know you!

[emi herself]

I just want to add that this is something I have had an issue with all my life. I understand that my Dom loves me and would NEVER think those things of me. Actually everyone around me says the opposite of what I think. Yet some how in my head I belive the negitive things. After reading all these and mostly Ozme52 I realise that everything will be ok.

Having said that. Low self confidence and esteem is NOTHING to shake a stick at and is usally something that is deep rooted and is not easy to fix. No matter how much praise someone get it will still be there mocking you.

I know now that I just have to keep my head up and keep trying.

[Aussiegirl1]

emi,

I know it is not easy to change the way you think about yourself, but with time it can happen! It has to begin with you seeing yourself as others see you. Why not get them to write down all the great things they think about you and then read this when you need that all important self-esteem boost.

I know having my Master tell me everyday that I am a beautiful, sexy woman has made me believe it, even though I did not think this way a year ago!

Good luck and take things one day , one moment at a time.

[Beswitchingly Positive]

emi,

I know it is not easy to change the way you think about yourself, but with time it can happen! It has to begin with you seeing yourself as others see you. Why not get them to write down all the great things they think about you and then read this when you need that all important self-esteem boost.

I know having my Master tell me everyday that I am a beautiful, sexy woman has made me believe it, even though I did not think this way a year ago!

Good luck and take things one day , one moment at a time.

There are endless way to boost self esteem.

I think you are right on aussiegirl! After you see how your friends see you, perhaps the big leap to feeling really good is believing that you are all good, not just believing that you are all good in other people's view.

That is when the light in you will shine for you.

I tried sincerely to kill myself once, I went to hang and was not good enough with knots...well, not versed enough with binding to achieve the result, somehow (thank goodness) I started to swing and black out and realized, like a electric shock, I wanted to live! I fought and tore myself from the blackness of suicide...it is not so easy to do...

Now I have a full, very happy life. I am happy with my man, but this is new. I was happy alone when I met him. Life is not always smooth, but I like me. If I do not like something I am doing I change it. All I own are my choices and my self identity. These are the two things that cannot be taken from me...a Blackfoot saying, the only things a man truly owns are his choices and his name (I interpret this as self identity) These can never be lost or stolen...

I have been consciously working on this for years.

Consciously, this is key.

Focus you mind on really liking yourself, overcome this dark demon, and you will find help and inspiration coming from many directions. Then things get really fucking fun...the energy of life will course though you and you will feel more...boundless...figuratively speaking.

Beswitchingly Positive

[tessa]

I've read through the posts and seen all the responses. ~sighs happily~ This is the BEST place! You people are wonderful!

emi, as you can see from the responses, you are worth the time. You matter. That you are ready to try to see you as we do, as your David does, will help you along your way.

All the very best to you!

tessa

[Slave Kitty Sivesh]

I agree, I think alot of subs can relate to this, myself being one of them. And like Aussiegirl, having my master telling me that she thinks I'm cute and letting me know she loves me really does wonders. It's also a good reminder... as long as the person I love and care about above all other feels the same about me, I don't need to care what others think ^_^

[thezigg]

A self confidence issue is a hard thing to get over. What makes you feel good about yourself? Everyone in the world can tell you that your hot, smart and funny but if you dont feel it then what they say doesnt matter. The worst thing is to sit and do nothing about it. Get out there and get active in something you enjoy.

[Eponine]

Hey emi...

You have gotten a lot of responses here, which is awesome.
I also am one who suffers and has suffered from similar feelings.
I find they sort of wax and wane for me, depending on my situation- in other words, when I was in my dream fairy tale world with the master I just had, I felt perfect and beautiful _all_ the time, whether I was with him or not. However, now, being alone and not with him, I am down on myself again to some extent.

One point I did not really see in anyone's posts is that of finding the true root cause of your feelings- is it chemical or genetic? or is it more behavioral? Some therapists have told me that one can cause the other, or enhance the other.

But, anyway, for me, it helped in the past to really dig into _why_ I have the self-esteem and perfectionist issues I do- that helped me to let go of the past's hold on me.

Proof that therapy was helping was friends I hadn't talked to in awhile commented on how different (in a good way) I was- and they did not know I was in therapy.

I also used some of the "if you act confident, you will become confident" medicine- this also worked for me. I felt like I was constantly faking it, but after awhile some ways of thinking became so second-nature to me, I stopped so much of the self-criticism. I was then open to the idea that I deserve just the same as anyone else in this fucked-up world.

I think that's something to remember too- our world is not ideal, so bad shit's going to happen, and sometimes it happens a lot to the same person repeatedly- but it's not a reflection on you. I used to go through that too- oh why me, it must be because I deserve it, I'm this, I'm that, I'm defective, etc... But it's just our world- realizing that helped me overcome blaming and criticizing myself again.

And all these are things that take time of course. And as I said, I still suffer sometimes.. but it's nowhere near as bad as ... ten or fifteen years ago.

Well, I rambled... didn't mean to... started out with the best intent not to... but sorry, couldn't think of more concise ways to share...

Good luck to you, emi... you just have to keep at it- whatever it is you do to help yourself, you have to keep at it. And you are very lucky to have someone loving you so deeply. Many do not. Do not waste the precious time you have in a good relationship on pointless energy- you may regret it at some time.

-mary

[jeanne]

Do not waste the precious time you have in a good relationship on pointless energy- you may regret it at some time.

-mary

Yes, you will regret it. I regret the time I wasted and am profoundly grateful that the relationship still exists and I have a chance to make it everything it should have been all along.

[jeanne]

After a conversation last night, and rereading this thread, I realized that I have more to say about this subject.

Extreme low self-esteem, extreme lack of self-confidence = extreme selfishness. The submissive with these issues makes it "all about her", instead of as it should be - all about Him. I would think that at some point, a Dom would find this exhausting and irritating and insulting (as Oz pointed out above) and then you get exactly the result you fear - He loses interest. The best advice for anyone, vanilla or not - deal with it! However you need to, deal with it. As soon as possible. Otherwise, you are setting yourself up for disappointment and failure. Is that any way to live? Unhappy? Is that the submissive you want to be? Pathetic and needing constant validation? Not me. Absolutely not me.

Emotionally healthy and damn proud of it - it was hard work,
jeanne

[Rhabbi]

After a conversation last night, and rereading this thread, I realized that I have more to say about this subject.

Extreme low self-esteem, extreme lack of self-confidence = extreme selfishness. The submissive with these issues makes it "all about her", instead of as it should be - all about Him. I would think that at some point, a Dom would find this exhausting and irritating and insulting (as Oz pointed out above) and then you get exactly the result you fear - He loses interest. The best advice for anyone, vanilla or not - deal with it! However you need to, deal with it. As soon as possible. Otherwise, you are setting yourself up for disappointment and failure. Is that any way to live? Unhappy? Is that the submissive you want to be? Pathetic and needing constant validation? Not me. Absolutely not me.

Emotionally healthy and damn proud of it - it was hard work,
jeanne

Well said jeanne. Emotional health is as important to a D/s relationship as anything else.