Moral defects?

[SilentMelody]

Thanks for your replies!
The thing is though, what is also argued, is that it fuels sexism. Is it in any of your experience that Doms also see women outside of the scene as inferior? Does pornography that displays violence against women effect all women, even though they do not themselves participate, in that they are then treated differently by men who watch it?

[Ozme52]

Thanks for your replies!
The thing is though, what is also argued, is that it fuels sexism. Is it in any of your experience that Doms also see women outside of the scene as inferior? Does pornography that displays violence against women effect all women, even though they do not themselves participate, in that they are then treated differently by men who watch it?

In my opinion, the imagery makes no difference. Those who hold others inferior, do so because of what their parents, and perhaps their peers (who got it from their own parents,) taught them early in life. Those who don't prejudge, who don't believe being different constitutes inferiority, will use imagery, be it art or porn, for what it is, entertainment, and don't alter their perceptions because of what they see.

These modern day philosophers who decry porn as abusive sexism miss the real point, that people are mostly ill-educated in the first place. Take away the porn and nothing would change...

[thir]

Thanks for your replies!
The thing is though, what is also argued, is that it fuels sexism.

As you pointed out yourself, it goes both ways, there are male subs as well.
Can it be sexism if it goes both ways??

I do realize that if you know nothing about it, bdsm porn (I do so dislike the term 'violent' porn because it smells of non-consensuality) can be upsetting - or very upsetting. You have to understand the background, and you have to understand the difference between fantasy and reality, as is said several times. And there is a lot more women sub porn that male sub porn.

I myself often find vanilla porn more upsetting, because the attitudes you see there are often not at all for fun! Same with violence in films.

However, you do not hear anyone complaining about that, which is the puritanical (is that a word?) aspect of it. At its basis it is about not liking sex. For the radicals, I mean.

But although I do find many of these porns and films upsetting, I would not go for censorship, but I would like to see some much better quality films and porn. And I would definitly also like to see a lot more male porn - Let's have some equality here :-)

Is it in any of your experience that Doms also see women outside of the scene as inferior?

It is not my experience that Doms normally see women as inferior, either outside or inside the scene. My scene have been DK and UK, that is all I know about.

[quote}
Does pornography that displays violence against women effect all women, even though they do not themselves participate, in that they are then treated differently by men who watch it?[/QUOTE]

LOL Let them try!

I do not think it works that way. If the contempt is there, it is there. I do not think bdsm porn creates it. If it fuels it, so would a lot of films.

[leo9]

Thanks for your replies!
The thing is though, what is also argued, is that it fuels sexism. Is it in any of your experience that Doms also see women outside of the scene as inferior? Does pornography that displays violence against women effect all women, even though they do not themselves participate, in that they are then treated differently by men who watch it?

There is pornography based on violence against women, and porn based on violence against men. The fact that one is considered normal and displayed in mass media, and the other considered weird and kinky, is a product of society's attitudes. If the existence of porn created those attitudes, both or neither of them would be widely displayed.

Take an example that nobody considers "porn": you can make a whole archive of Hollywood films where a woman gets spanked by a man. (These days, you can find such lists on BDSM sites.) But to find scenes where a woman spanks a man you have to go to explicitly "kinky" productions. Society created that distinction, the films didn't create it.

But of course these things work both ways, and once created, the films reinforce the attitudes that created them.

The fact that dominatrix images are becoming more common in the mainstream - even if usually used jokingly - I see as a healthy sign of the gradual retreat of male-dominated sexism.

And as Snark said, anyone can blame their crimes on pornography. People have blamed comic books, video nasties and the Internet for their crimes, anything to avoid taking responsibility. Some people also blame their crimes on the Bible, but nobody takes that as proof it shoudl be banned.