For the record, in terms of whether the USA should be in Iraq or not is a very long since moot point: you're already there, and at this point it is really a debate with no purposeful outcome to be had. The only question is what to do now. I don't see pulling out any time soon as a realistic option. Your government chose to go in, how you've got to finish what you started. The fact that it turns out (as every new generation seems to forget) that war isn't as romantic as they make it in the movies, and that it happens to have got hard, is no excuse to pull out now. The job that was started now has to be finished. You want to breed a new generation of hate? Pull out, and watch the consequences.

There's still a very good chance that Iraq is going to degrade into a civil war. That could get very ugly if another foreign power decides to back one of the groups the Americans view as "extremists", and the Americans would almost certainly back the Shiites. Of course then the Americans will say "stay out of the war" to the new foreign power, which would look about as credible as Pee Wee Herman as the King of England.

However, an American millitary pull out at this point, and I'd mortgage my house and bet on that war. The factions in Iraq qould decend into chaos within 24 months. With them in, yes it will be long, it will be ugly, but at least there's a chance for a democracy. Some of America's big enemies like Iran and North Korea talk big but know they can't win if they actually get into a firefight. Whether it's a legitimate democracy or another puppet democracy in the South American vein, only time will tell.

Tom says:
"Terrorism never pays. It's not why people do it. I'm sure muslims become terrorists for the same reasons young white boys become nazi skinnheads. Losers desperate to matter in the world. Desperate for anybody giving a shit about their seemingly worthles existance. That's what we need to adress. How do we get young boys having trouble in school a chance to do something worthwhile in their lives instead of turning to this shit. That's how we combat terrorism.

Islam is intrinsically oposed to suicide bombings. It says in the Koran that people who commit suicide go to hell. These are just total fuck-ups confused in life.

Just nuking the shit out of any Palestinian doing anything naughty and driving the country deeper into poverty by blocking their ports, I'm not sure was such a bright move. My guess is that it breeds terrorists rather than combating it.

I think it's better to focus on preventing more people to become terrorists than to hunt down the known ones. The ones who are wanted for it can't do anything else but to stay in hiding anyway. They're not doing any damage doing that are they? And we save money. I'm sure all this focus on terrorism is just making it more attractive for the lost young souls in the world."

There's more sense in these paragraphs than I care to restate so I'll just nod and leave it at that. I do disagree partially with the last point he makes though. Let's not forget that Osama Bin Laden does remain a criminal mastermind who has more than his share of crimes to answer for. No reason to give up the hunt for justice because it happens to be difficult. Aside from that though, a lot of stuff I agree with.