as convincing an argument proponents here on this site (of both sides of this issue) are making i think it shall perhaps not be resolved any time soon, our government seems to be just as deadlocked on the legality of it and or its effectivness, and its clearly a non-partisan debate, no one party wholehaertedly supports eaither side of the argument, sure the president is for it, but the man representing his party in the next election is adamantly against it, of course he (McCain) is a former pow, no wonder he dislikes the very idea of we americans commiting acts of torture