Women Shall Submit

[hopperboo]

To me (Yes I am a hard core angry atheist) Being a submissive to man (or woman) is allot better, and grants more freedom then being a submissive to god or the bible, If your a submissive out of fear you have a problem and really shouldn't be doing it (because in the end Its not submission its being abused) The end line of all the people who fail to convert me is Well aren't you afraid that God will condemn you to hell? I chose to serve my master out of love, not fear, I except punishment because I like it, not because I am forced. I will not be cajoled, begged or pleaded to be a slave to a god or man that expects me to fear him/it.

If I choose tomorrow to walk away from this life, no one can stop me, or threaten me with damnation, which is allot more freedom then the bible gave me.

I do not believe the Bible preaches fear as the basis to being submissive to God. Especially in the New Testament. It's about accepting responsibility as a human and serving the One who loves us. Fearing to a point? Yes. Even in a D/s a person as fear of the Dominant. It's respecting that power and knowing what can happen if you don't act accordingly.

Back to the topic: I agree with the first post here, that D/s is a natural beginning and yes, I believe the Bible supports that. However, I don't think it's the point of the male being always in "control," I think it's that men and women balance each other out differently in a healthy way. (i.e. God took bone from Adam's rib to symbolize an equal relationship...if he had taken bone from Adam's toe it would have symbolized the female always being submissive, likewise if bone had been taken from Adam's toe which would have symbolized female superiority).

[Virulent]

I do not believe the Bible preaches fear as the basis to being submissive to God. Especially in the New Testament.

Have you read the Bible or New Testament?

"Should you not fear me?" declares the Lord. "Should you not tremble in my presence?"

Since, then, we know what it is to fear the Lord, we try to persuade men...

Come, my children, listen to me; I will teach you the fear of the Lord.

In the council of the holy ones God is greatly feared.

You [O God] are resplendent with light... You alone are to be feared.

...Do not fear what they fear, and do not dread it. The Lord Almighty is the one you are to regard as holy, he is the one you are to fear, he is the one you are to dread.

"Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in hell."

"To you my friends I say: Do not be afraid of those who kill the body and after that can do no more. I will tell you whom to fear; fear him who, after he has killed, has the power to cast into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him."

My personal favorite:

It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

That's fun to shout at cunts who went to Catholic school as you're flogging them.

I'm pretty sure that all denominations and sects of the JCI family of religions use the fear of their God's wrath as the primary motivator in most things. Don't you even try and sugar-coat this: the primary argument for the JCI faith is that if you do not believe in and worship Him, you're going to be brutally tortured for all eternity.

Further, I think those of us on this forum are uniquely equipped to understand how it can be possible to be a wrathful, terrifying presence, who is simultaneously the definition of Love, to paraphrase Thomas Aquinas. Put another way; the JCI god is a mean fucking dom.

[hopperboo]

Further, I think those of us on this forum are uniquely equipped to understand how it can be possible to be a wrathful, terrifying presence, who is simultaneously the definition of Love

Which is partly what I was trying to get across.

Would you like to go through and look up a whole God loves us.

I said fear wasn't the entire basis of being submissive to God. And it's not. But I suppose each can take it their own way. If one wants to read and apply only the brimstone and fire to their lives and choose that for the reason to follow Christianity so be it. I choose to keep the upper part of my mind how much God loves us, with a healthy does of respect (yes, fear too) in the background.