Equality?

[Kendal]

It is not the job of the "education system" to impart morale and self esteem
Education is preparing children to be good adults. The good english school converts dirty uncouth boys into educated gentlemen. As Sadistic pointed our, better morale equates to better learning.

In previous Kendal message you espoused charity. Now you appear to forsake charity. Which is it?Government should proved the basics, charity the extras. Feed the orphans from government funds, send them to Disneyland with charity donations.

I am sorry but you are going to have to support that claim.
USA is the top foreign aid donor nation by volume http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/ec...d-donor#source This is no surprise given the size of the country. If you go per capita then it is at or on the bottom of the rankings. I cannot quickly find the OECD donor ranking table but going from the above CIA factbook source USA donated 23 billion compared to UK 12bn. The USA population is 5 times that of UK but donates only twice as much. American media likes to tell how generous the USA is but OECD stats show a different story - especially when you consider much of the aid ends up going US companies in Aid for Trade deals.

Poverty in the US is not the same as poverty in Botswana!. Nor is poverty the same in Luxembourg as in the US, Their per capita income is twice the US
In terms of food calories (for example) it is the same everywhere. The cost differs but not the need.

But you choose to only consider your views just because they are your views.
Not at all. I understand your point. You want to reduce government spending and taxation and you think that if forced the lazy man will work. I have a different view. No matter how much at fault a person may be for their misfortune, it does not affect my moral obligation to help him. And if his misfortune is in part due to a failure on my part then my obligation is greater.

But they learn no such thing from schools. In fact in majority they learn that the world OWES them. A living, a life, anything they desire.
Not a good testimonial for the US education system is it. Perhaps this ties in with your previous comment abouti it not being a school's job to teach self esteem.

we were discussing education and the (bad) influence of the teacher unions is appropo.
I was discussing Equality. Have I mistead the thread subject title.

That is silly! You are proposing communes.
I was not proposing, This was an accomodation for those who seek to minimize government spending. A man needs shelter and it must be provided. Put him in shared accomodation or a hostel if you must but not on the street without a roof over his head. Silly is better than cruel.

If you were quoting somebody you should have done that rather than make them your words.
Are you telling me how I should or should not compose posts. I built the words and concept into my own sentence in order to make it more applicable and understandable for you than the original. This is common practice in the US, especially with politicians. When Martin Luther King talked about jobs in his famous I have a Dream speech did he quote Shakespeares Richard III when he said "this sweltering summer of the Negro's legitimate discontent will not pass until there is an invigorating autumn..."

[Thorne]

No matter how much at fault a person may be for their misfortune, it does not affect my moral obligation to help him. And if his misfortune is in part due to a failure on my part then my obligation is greater.

While I can agree with some of your points, and I can understand your desire to help people, this statement is something I cannot agree with. I've been arguing against this kind of thing for years here, and it still goes on.

Using a strict interpretation of your comment, if I should come home to find someone ransacking my home because he has no money, I should not only allow him to continue, I should help him by pointing out the more valuable items in my home, or the location of any money I have stashed away. And if he should stumble over a carelessly placed box and hurt himself, I should contact the rescue services and have him taken to the hospital for treatment at my expense, of course.

Now I know you will say that this is a rather extreme interpretation, but how is it any different from that same man being given goods and services, paid for with my tax dollars, while he sits at home watching Oprah or Judge Judy or any of the half-dozen premium channels he subscribes to,on his wide-screen, high-definition, plasma TV? All while contacting his friends on his high-end cell phone to tell them about the latest government give-away program they should get into.

Are there truly poor people in this country? Absolutely. Despite two hundred plus years of effort, there are still poor Americans. Despite more than ten thousand years of effort around the world, there are still poor people. There will always be poor people. Many, even most, may be poor through no fault of their own. I feel sorry for them. I don't, however, feel responsible for them. I don't feel any 'moral' imperative to help them. The only 'moral' responsibility I have is to help myself, and my family, to keep our heads above water without dragging someone else down with us.

[steelish]

USA is the top foreign aid donor nation by volume http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/ec...d-donor#source This is no surprise given the size of the country.

What might surprise you though is that most US foreign aid donations come from private citizens rather than the government.

[Canyon]

What might surprise you though is that most US foreign aid donations come from private citizens rather than the government.

I wonder if they count the costs of our other expences which benefit others. Our huge support of the UN, and those countries which lie under our defence umbrella and thus benefit. I'm sure there is more but I cannot think of them now.

[steelish]

It is not the job of the "education system" to impart morale and self esteem
Education is preparing children to be good adults. The good english school converts dirty uncouth boys into educated gentlemen. As Sadistic pointed our, better morale equates to better learning.

And how much influence are the parents and other family members to have in their morale and self esteem?

[Canyon]

[QUOTE=Kendal;865276]Government should proved the basics, charity the extras. Feed the orphans from government funds, send them to Disneyland with charity donations.[QUOTE]

Just found this today. Could not believe it. Disneyland is a right!!!

How many of those 12 dollar hot dogs will the taxpayers have to buy.

I imagine its only a matter of time before someone demands this in America. It's easy to be silly with the money others have earned.

Hey, I'm a crabby old man, would that count as "difficult personal circumstances."

[steelish]

It's easy to be silly with the money others have earned.

It also seems to be easy (for some) to demand what others have earned.