Married/online D/s?

Here you go brattyone- this topic has been covered before, but it's something that's often mentioned & I know many of us are in the same boat.

Myself, I'm very happily married to a wonderful sexy woman who I've been with for 18 years- married for 15 of them.

I have my very own girl I've been online with for almost a year now, my sweet lisa. (talking to her as I do this actually)

I've had various online things & plan on meeting 'someone' in a few months for a r/l encounter. A strictly no-sex encounter I might add, & my wife does know- she doesn't know however, that I'll be packing some ropes....

Curious myself to hear of anyone's experiences- please let's not let this be spoilt by 'r/l is better' comments. I think that's what stops many people on forums talking about online relationships.

Is your marriage a happy one? Why do you do it? Would you leave your spouse for your D/s partner? Would you meet them in r/l? Is is cheating?
When does it become cheating?

Tojo

Tojo,

I know there are other married souls here, searching and hoping to find a way to fill this missing puzzle piece into their life. For whatever reason, the spouse cannot/will not participate and some of us do not share our exploration with them. Some of us even have personal ads posted here. *cough

Is it cheating? Yep. The question remains, ...~when~.. does it become cheating? Generally the legal definition of sexual intercourse must include penetration. But honestly, perhaps cheating begins as soon as one begins a relationship with a partner that includes private, intimate moments without the complete knowledge of the spouse.

The question remains, how does one intergrate D/s play into their life and still maintain a good marriage, especially if the spouse does not know?

Sigh...

from one imperfect being....

My husband and I had a long talk about this, more than one, actually. We established some pretty firm limits for me, specifically because it's so hard to determine where that line lies.

It's very easy to get caught up in things around here. It takes a lot of willpower, at times, to stay true to my limits. I think I've been pretty good about it, though. There are times when it'd be very easy to cross them, knowing the chances are good my husband would never know. But too many secrets, too many slip-ups . . . It all adds up over time.

Do I wish I could do more? Sometimes. But I have been married nearly 15 years and he's stuck by me this far. I'm not going to do anything to risk that.

I've been married for less than a year, but been with my husband for 5 years as a couple, and known him for 18 years now. (I realize i'm only 24. we met in first grade...) My husband knows about my O/L Master and vice versa.

I cannot honestly say where the future will take my relationship with either men. For now I am living in the moment. My husband takes care of me and loves me. My Master takes care of me and loves me. Both are very important men in my life at this point, they just do different things. Do I wish they were the same? yes. In the long run it will save someone from being hurt. Either way I know I will wind up hurt. I'll lose one or the other. Yet it is a choice i freely make out of need for a part of my life that is not filled.

I believe that we can love more than one person in life. We could even live out our lives happily with one person without ever realizing that there's a "more perfect" person out there, or we may find that we love another person but are already with that "perfect" person.

wow - this is one thread i will definitely have to come back too - not enough time to read and properly respond right now but i WILL be back!

Is your marriage a happy one? No marriage is happy all the time.
Why do you do it?
Would you leave your spouse for your D/s partner? I wouldn't leave my husband for ANYONE.
Would you meet them in r/l? no
Is is cheating? FOR ME, yes it is cheating. You can cheat with your heart just as much as you can cheat with your body parts. However, this is my personal belief...I'm not saying that all of you out there are cheaters. It is not my place to judge and everyone has different opinons and different defintions of what cheating is.
When does it become cheating? AGAIN..personal belief...when you give your heart to someone else that isn't your spouse...

Hmmmn interesting thread. When does cheating become cheating. Cheating becomes cheating as soon as your conscience tells you you are. We as a species are adept at telling ourselves what's ok and what's not. We could convince ourselves white was black if need be.

I think the bottom line is would you mind if your partner found out about the things you have said, done etc. online or in real life. And would they mind if they found out. What would be their reaction.

It's a line I walk everyday. I am in an online relationship and in R/L my wife doesn't share my penchant for BDSM. She is aware of my online activities but I certainly don't think she would necessarily like or approve of what I say or do. And may even consider it cheating although she has said that if there is emotional investment, that's when it becomes cheating. I don't agree with her on that but I think that is the difference between guys and girls. Can we love more than one person at a time? I think you can. Do I believe in poly relationships? Absolutely.

I think I'm am more in touch with what I want and who I am than I have ever been at any time in my life. I have made it clear to her that I have to follow my heart when it comes to that. If we expressed our hearts desire in the first place and followed that desire there would be no need to cheat, lie or do any of those things. I think we have a long way to go when it comes to being true to ourselves.

My woman whom I've been getting extremely serious with online is married. But I've got something he doesn't, access to the real her. I don't feel the least bit bad about it, to be honest. And neither does she. I won't go into public detail about someone else's marriage but as a generalization, I think peopel try and romanticize marriage into the be-all, end-all where you find one person who fulfills each and every single need you could possibly have.

I'm sorry, that's one in a million fairly tale stuff. Do some people find it? Yes, they do. But not all marriages are that way, nor should they realistically be expected to be.

The only cheating as far as I'm concerned would have been if she'd continued to leave herself in a position where she had to cheat herself out of being who she really is.

Can you love more than one person at once? Of course you can. Anyone who has more than one child can answer that question (I should hope). Do I feel like we've done anything wrong? Not in the least. If that makes me the bad guy in some people's eyes, so be it.

I dont have anything to contribute with to this thread, really. But I wanted to tell you all that I think you all are so brave and strong and I love that you share this topic with the rest of us. It cant be easy, not one thing or the other.
Good luck to you all. Big hugs and lots of thoughts.

:rose:

What Timberwolf said.

My very first d/s online (and very first ever) relationship was with a married man. (I am single but have been married) We discussed this often - he did not consider it cheating UNTIL he got caught. How can "playing" or just talking be cheating? But as time goes on, how can you not be handing someone your heart along with your orgasms!?

Losing this relationship was hard but knowing I was the "other woman" was even more devastating - and kind of icky. Although I wouldn't take away the experience it has definitely changed me. I realize it was my choice to be involved in this situation but that brick wall around my heart is stronger than ever.

My question to those with spouses/partners who are unaware of this situation is: how would you feel if you knew your partner were doing the same things you are doing here or in IM?

I hope I don't sound judgemental because I really am not. Every situation is different. I'm here because the people in this forum are an open-minded bunch...hopefully me included!

I have read that some of you have tried to approach your partner to incorporate this in to your real life. These desires are strong. Some of us believe we can love more than one person in life. Do we share our heart, body, mind with more than one person? And how would I feel if I knew my partner were sharing a part of himself with someone else that was so important, so intimate?

Sighs. It's an interesting question and I envy those who have clear-cut opinions either way. Trust is an essential part of any relationship r/l or online and it's certainly something that is earned. Done rambling....will continue listening since it's so very interesting to hear all sides.

My husband and I have been together for seven years. Only in the last year have we developed a level of comfort in which we've been able to discuss BDSM, and have been learning and discovering more and more about each others pleasures and interests. In that, we are both very fortunate to be able to fulfill each others needs and desires both physically and emotionally.

On another note, however, he also shares an O/L relationship with someone he met in chat several months ago. They have become very close friends and share everything from day to day activities to their most intimate "bedtime stories". He also has had several "flings" with others he has met in chat.

Is it cheating? IMO, it would only be cheating if he were trying to deceive me, and keep it secret. I feel that to cheat, there has to be a level of deceit or dishonesty on ones part. He has made all of his O/L activity aware to me, so I feel no level of threat to our relationship.

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Originally Posted by pixie_dust

On another note, however, he also shares an O/L relationship with someone he met in chat several months ago. They have become very close friends and share everything from day to day activities to their most intimate "bedtime stories". He also has had several "flings" with others he has met in chat.

Is it cheating? IMO, it would only be cheating if he were trying to deceive me, and keep it secret. I feel that to cheat, there has to be a level of deceit or dishonesty on ones part. He has made all of his O/L activity aware to me, so I feel no level of threat to our relationship.

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thanks for sharing that pixie_dust - it is so interesting to know how r/l couples integrate on-line into real life. again - thanks....

I am very, very lucky that my husband shares my interests in BDSM. Of course, that makes me think that I should be happy enough with what I have and not feel tempted to play online. But he has discovered, to his delight, that the longer I hang around here, the more creative we get and the more I initiate play.

Is your marriage a happy one?
i like to think so. no one has the perfect marriage, but yes, we are happy and love each other dearly. he knows about everything i do online and he's always been fine with it. we've been together for nearly 10 years now and have 2 children. i know he even comes online sometimes to talk with women. it doesn't bother me one bit. as long as we are honest with each other, that is all that matters. :)
Why do you do it?
he knows i need BDSM in my life. we'd divorced at one point and i had a couple of BDSM relationships. after those ended, i tried to go back to my vanilla life with my hubby. i realized it was impossible for me to do. the more i tried to forget about my submissiveness, the more i dwelled on it and the more i craved it. i swear it's like a drug...the more you get...the more you want, and when you don't get it at all, boy do the withdrawals suck! luckily we were able to open up to each other this time around and have talked countless hours on the topic. i now consider him to be vanilla with a lil kinky side ~grins~ he's really not into the whole deal, but every now and then he'll fancy himself a Dominant. you'll never find me complaining!
Would you leave your spouse for your D/s partner?
never. without a question. when i am online, i don't lie to anyone about being married. i am very upfront with that knowledge. just as i wouldn't want to lie to my husband, i wouldn't want to mislead anyone i met online.
Would you meet them in r/l?
no, i would not.
Is is cheating?
as someone else pointed out, i think it was Gregsta, it becomes cheating when your conscience tells you so. how can it be cheating if both spouses know and talk about the other's online activities?
When does it become cheating?
the cheating begins when you try to hide things from your spouse. but that is just my opinion. there are different levels of cheating. i know some people would say cheating is cheating and that's final. but if i were a clueless spouse and found out my husband was exchanging erotic emails with another woman online...as opposed to him actually going out and screwing another woman....yeah...i'd be a little less upset!

hellish one & maddie - thanks for sharing. to see r/l couples being honest & open & trying to make it fit is great & oh-so refreshing...it really gives me a new perspective. :32:

wow, there have been some excellent answers here so far and i think it just goes to show that in this, as in all things, we will all differ...

Is your marriage a happy one?

most of the time it is, yes but not always. i don't think that any marriage will be 100% happy, 100% of the time.

Why do you do it?

i don't have an online Master / significant other but i do participate in a fun RP with Oz and have recently joined the Academy and will be taking part in tasks there so i suppose that counts. my Master waivers in this lifestyle while i do not. these activities keep it real for me in His down times. it is difficult for me when He turns himself on and off as my Master, though i continue to treat Him the same all the time. these activities help keep me grounded in my true self. that's why i do them.


Would you leave your spouse for your D/s partner? Would you meet them in r/l?

to be honest, i don't know. it would depend on the other person and the situation as a whole. i love my Master with all my heart - we have been together for 14 years, married for 10 and most of the time, our relationship fulfills me...the key here is the words most of the time. the other part of the time is an ugly time of readjustment, failed expectations, etc. if i was to find someone who i felt could keep me fulfilled all the time, and thus i would live a happier life overall, i would probably consider it. i realize that sounds harsh but i wanted to be honest. of course, i like to think that my Master and i are soulmates, meant to be together forever with nothing that can come between us but the simple fact of the matter is that i don't think anyone can answer that question until they are in that situation.

Is is cheating?

i don't consider my current activities cheating, no. my Master is aware of what i am doing though not necessarily every word that is spoken, every feeling that lives within me during that time. i have not given my heart to another. yes, i have allowed another to instruct me to perform an act that involved sexual currents but my Master was aware of the task, had read it and was right there when i performed it.

When does it become cheating?

for me, it becomes cheating when either one of is hiding something...obviously it is being hidden because we have strong feelings that it would not be appreciated by the other party. there is so much more to this than meets the eye - these are difficult questions to answer. i dont think they can be answered simply.

just my 2 cents
respectfully,
orchid

Good to know I'm doing my part!! :cool:

If I may make an observation, everyone that has responded to this thread has made it clear that their partners are aware of their online activities. This says to me that there is a healthy communication going on between the spouses concerned and at the end of the day, being in a relationship is about communication.

Being open and honest about our needs, wants and expectations is as I said in my previous post, is paramount to getting them met in one way or the other. Someone once said "you have not because you ask not..." and how are our spouses/partners to know if we don't ask or talk to them about it.

On the upside since my wife has been reading my stories, she has taken to calling me Master occasionally and is even a little more willing to go places she hasn't been in the past.

In a way this place has taught me to be true to myself and what I want and need. Peoples willingness to share in an open and honest way has opened my eyes to many possibilities I would not have normally considered and my marriage would likely be a pile of ash by now.

So thank you to all who have shared in this thread and many others. And Tojo a very timely topic to choose and post on. Onya mate.

On a totally unrelated topic "Go West Coast" for the grand final and St George for the Rugby!

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Is your marriage a happy one? Why do you do it? Would you leave your spouse for your D/s partner? Would you meet them in r/l? Is is cheating?
When does it become cheating?

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I was married for 18 years. Over the years problems within the marriage took their toll until I was very unhappy and wanting out. I didn't know how to get out however. I had no education, no money, and a child to consider. So I stayed and prayed.

I met my Joe online and fell crazy in love with him. We talked online for 10 months. During that time we made plans to be together. We each went through divorces and once they were final Joe came for me. We had never met face to face until the day he came to take me to the home he set up for us.

Yes, I cheated on my husband by talking to and falling in love with another man. For me it became cheating when my heart said yes to my Joe.

Would I do it again? Yes, I have guilt about the way it happened. But, I have never been happier than I am with this man.

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Originally Posted by His_pita

I was married for 18 years. Over the years problems within the marriage took their toll until I was very unhappy and wanting out. I didn't know how to get out however. I had no education, no money, and a child to consider. So I stayed and prayed.

I met my Joe online and fell crazy in love with him. We talked online for 10 months. During that time we made plans to be together. We each went through divorces and once they were final Joe came for me. We had never met face to face until the day he came to take me to the home he set up for us.

Yes, I cheated on my husband by talking to and falling in love with another man. For me it became cheating when my heart said yes to my Joe.

Would I do it again? Yes, I have guilt about the way it happened. But, I have never been happier than I am with this man.

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Well I was not going to comment on this ---but it seems a lot of people feel online relationshops are cheating on their spouse ---

My feeling toward this as long as it is online only ---it is a fantasy ---no more than watching a move and having a fantasy about being the one that love is being made to --by the actor

or a man seeing a sexy woman walking down the street and wondering in his mind what she would be like in the sack.

Fantasy has always been a great escape for those who are unhappy in a relationship ---like reading romance novels -----

In the past I had this same problem ---a sub of mine ---got to feeling guilty that she was cheating on her husband ---and we had never met face to face.

there is nothing to feel guilty about ----adultry or cheating is physical ---just because you think about something does not make you guilty of it ---or I would be in prison for thinking about killing a lot of assholes ---lol

I am glad you met Joe and things worked out for you ---and you have nothing to ever feel guilty about----

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Originally Posted by Rabbit1

Well I was not going to comment on this ---but it seems a lot of people feel online relationshops are cheating on their spouse ---

My feeling toward this as long as it is online only ---it is a fantasy ---no more than watching a move and having a fantasy about being the one that love is being made to --by the actor

or a man seeing a sexy woman walking down the street and wondering in his mind what she would be like in the sack.

Fantasy has always been a great escape for those who are unhappy in a relationship ---like reading romance novels -----

In the past I had this same problem ---a sub of mine ---got to feeling guilty that she was cheating on her husband ---and we had never met face to face.

there is nothing to feel guilty about ----adultry or cheating is physical ---just because you think about something does not make you guilty of it ---or I would be in prison for thinking about killing a lot of assholes ---lol

I am glad you met Joe and things worked out for you ---and you have nothing to ever feel guilty about----

---

And for some, not even then. It depends on what a couple has agreed upon in advance.

Is your marriage a happy one?
Happy no, long yes, 25 years.

Why do you do it? The kids started college and my homeschool career was done. I had an angry sullen husband who refused my advances, and told me I rejected him in the same sentence. I felt alone and ugly. I wrote to be alive. I wanted to practice my sex writing and then wanted to post it. Here fit, the Academy called, I joined and met a man who swept me off my feet.

Would you leave your spouse for your D/s partner? I would have said no a year ago. Now I’m not so sure. I don’t want to leave. I want to be happily married but I don’t know what to do. More and more I fantasize about selling books so I have money. I have none. Have not worked outside the home since my son was 3. Gave my life to my family, was a stay at home mom. I know that if hubby would just try I would be able to go back to that life, but I see no interest.

Would you meet them in r/l? No, unless I get a divorce I will not be meeting. That is why my first Master left me.

Is is cheating? Yes, it’s cold and cruel but I know I’m hiding, I’m emotionally involved with another man. Do I feel evil, No. Every time I go to him and he refuses me, “I’ve got a headache,” (seriously) I feel a tension in my that only pain can relieve or the arms of a cyber lover.

When does it become cheating? When you know inside that it’s cheating. I knew it from the first task I performed. I remember feeling a gratitude in me that filled me and made me smile.

Ok I didn’t mean for this to be a sob story. I laugh more now than I ever have. Every giggle I type represents two that I actually had explode from my body. This place gives me a joy that is just not in my real life. I know I’m doing wrong but sometime you just have to go with what makes your life bearable. Here my opinion counts and no one tells me to be quiet. I make people laugh, smile and get horny. What more could a girl ask for. I’ve even learned to Dom a bit. Giggle.

So I guess what I want to say is I just want to have fun, and I’m so thankful that I’m not judged here. The only time I get angry here is when I feel someone is being held to a silly rule of society. I want to be free here. I think that is why most of us are here.

Well I sure don't feel as if I'm cheating- my wife knows I talk to women in r/l & online- I always have.

She may not know every word of what I say, nor would she want to.

I imagine she'd be shocked by some of the things I say, perhaps she'd be hurt, but here's the thing: she knows I love her.

I've told her a million times I flirt with women, she's had them come up to her & tell her how much they admire me, or that I'd make a great father for their kids.

She's secure enough to know that I'm not going to have sex with anyone, never have, never will. She knows that I always come home to her.

She knows she's my #1. While I may have loved other women, I never one time thought of leaving her for them, nor did I promise to do so, or even hint that I would.

My wife also knows that if I never spoke to anyone but her, I'd be a dead boring husband- just like the other ones who go to the pub, watch TV & grunt at their wives.

I'm alive, thanks to my 'girls' I thank those of you who are on this forum every day.

Tojo

"Well I was not going to comment on this ---but it seems a lot of people feel online relationshops are cheating on their spouse ---

My feeling toward this as long as it is online only ---it is a fantasy ---no more than watching a move and having a fantasy about being the one that love is being made to --by the actor"

I'm sorry, sharing the most intimate details of your existance with another human being is not a fantasy. Regardless of the format it's done in. And those details are a hell of a lot more important than any sexual act could ever hope to be.

I wish I did not agree with you Timberwolf.

cariad

We are but mere carbon based life forms albeit with the ability to reason.....in other words......human.

We need,
we feel,
we yearn to be touched,
whether it be physically, mentally or spiritually.

We strive for that 'belly to belly', either in r/l or through the usage of those wonderful 26 little letters that march across our screen.

Never feel quilty by the presence of this need.

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Originally Posted by Timberwolf

I'm sorry, sharing the most intimate details of your existance with another human being is not a fantasy. Regardless of the format it's done in. And those details are a hell of a lot more important than any sexual act could ever hope to be.

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I agree with you Timberwolf.

Rabbit, I can agree with you that it might not have been cheating if it was kept strictly on a superficial fantasy type basis. I had those kind of online relationships before my Joe and didn't think I was cheating on my husband. The cheating came when I gave my heart to Joe. When he became the center of my life and when I filed for divorce to be with Joe. My husband was clueless to my actions at this time so I was both a liar and a cheat. I don't believe in making excuses for my behaviour. I did it and I own up to it. Just saying. :)

So now that I have posted my introduction (not fully), I am goinig to respond to this thread, which is what prompted me to post my introduction in the first place.
Yes i have an online D's relationship and yes it is strictly fantasy. However, considering my current relationship which has been very long term and without sex for quite awhile, I would consider meeting r/l. But I know I will not because yes I consider that cheating, and yes what I do now is considered cheating. All I can say is that I have a need that I want met, I do not want to beg for it, unless it involved the lifestyle which it does not.

I so understand the begging.
It sounds like we might be in the same boat. Want a paddle. Giggle.
Begging is only fun when it's in context.
Sbbe

i just want to add that i think there can easily be just as much real emotion attached to online relationships, phone relationships etc as there can be in real life ones

i think that it is a delicate balance that will be different for each person / couple

It is a delicate balance. It's very hard, sometimes, to know where the line is and it's easy to drift past it without noticing, even with the best of intentions.

This topic certainly strikes home for me. I struggle with it everyday. I am currently engaged to a wonderful man, who unfortunately does not share in my interest to the lifestyle. I have found myself more and more intrigued over the months, and having an increasing desire to learn more. I tell my fiance about everything, and even incorporate much of my play here into our bedroom in the form of stories. I am lucky in the sense that he is quite open minded and willing to experiment. However, I am a very open person and find myself becoming closer and closer to some people on this site. I always have in the back of my head, a concern that my fiance would not approve. I frequently ask him if he is still comfortable and do my best to keep everything open. At best, it's a very complicated situation!! Just thought I'd share :)

Curiousin....

Better to find out now just how appealing the lifestyle is to you... and how much he can commit to joining you in it... than to get married and be disappointed and feel stuck in a marriage you don't find fulfilling.

Just what I was thinking Oz, that saves me trying to work out how to say it.

Be sure curious- be very sure. Marriage is not something to play around with.

That much I do know- I was married at 23, with the gut feeling that it wasn't going to work. It didn't & the scars are still there.




Tojo

When does it become cheating...for certain, it has nothing to do with physical penetration. Rape is not cheating, but there is sex. The emotional aspect, therefore, is the true essence of the thing; but betrayal likewise cannot happen when permitted, so those same feelings or actions, with the knowledge and approval of a spouse, are not illicit.

So to me, betrayal occurs when you act on an emotional connection that is in conflict with your relationship to your spouse.

Ultimately, however, everyone must settle their own accounts and decide what type of person they are, and what they need out of life, and find a way to reconcile those.

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Originally Posted by ElectricBadger

When does it become cheating...for certain, it has nothing to do with physical penetration. Rape is not cheating, but there is sex. The emotional aspect, therefore, is the true essence of the thing; but betrayal likewise cannot happen when permitted, so those same feelings or actions, with the knowledge and approval of a spouse, are not illicit.

So to me, betrayal occurs when you act on an emotional connection that is in conflict with your relationship to your spouse.

Ultimately, however, everyone must settle their own accounts and decide what type of person they are, and what they need out of life, and find a way to reconcile those.

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I'm real strong in my agreement with that statement.

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Originally Posted by Ozme52

I'm real strong in my agreement with that statement.

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+1

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Originally Posted by Tojo

Curious myself to hear of anyone's experiences- please let's not let this be spoilt by 'r/l is better' comments. I think that's what stops many people on forums talking about online relationships.

Is your marriage a happy one? Why do you do it? Would you leave your spouse for your D/s partner? Would you meet them in r/l? Is is cheating?
When does it become cheating?

Tojo

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Originally Posted by cookiecat

My question to those with spouses/partners who are unaware of this situation is: how would you feel if you knew your partner were doing the same things you are doing here or in IM?

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Is my marriage a happy one. Yes.

Why do I do it? Because though my wife is a sexy and sensual woman she is not at all interested in anything kinky and I have been for some time now only never admitted it.

Would you leave your spouse for your D/s partner? I could not do that. There are too many other lives it would affect and devastate.

Would you meet them in r/l? In a heart beat. I dream of meeting Aussiegirl all the time but that is all it will ever be, just a dream.

Is is cheating? Technically I guess it is but it isn't hurting a thing even if my wife were to find out about it. It would be embarrassing yes but not earth shattering.

When does it become cheating? I guess at the time I would actually see her I would then know I was going to cheat because I know I would not be able to control my feelings for her if I could actually reach out and touch her.

question to those with spouses/partners who are unaware of this situation is: how would you feel if you knew your partner were doing the same things you are doing here or in IM? I would probably feel hurt but at the same time I would ask the question why was she looking else where. If at all possible I would remedy the situation. My wife on the other hand has had many opportunities to participate in BDSM activities but doesn't want to. I really think if she knew about this site she would have no problem with it. Even if she knew about Aussiegirl and knowing I would never be able to actually meet her, I think she would not be overly upset. Actually I have wanted to tell her for a long time but never got the courage and probably never will, to be perfectly honest.

In any case I do not intend to stop any of my activities here in this forum. I could never give Aussiegirl up even if I wanted to and I know I never will want that. I didn't set out to love her but I can't reverse that now. So if it is wrong, so be it. I am the one who will have to answer for any wrongs I commit and I can't see my love for her as being wrong in any way.

Warbaby, your honesty really touches me, thank you.

I don't have a partner to have to consider, so that does tend to make things easier for me. However, I am very aware of the married status of both Tojo and Warbaby. In Tojo's case, I would not have even considered meeting him if his wife did not know about it.

Warbaby has explained his situation very well in the post above.

What I like, is the way that I see that they both still love and care for their wives very much. In fact, it only seems to make them happier people and I am sure that only makes their wives happy too.