Humilation Debate

[Timberwolf]

It does seem that this is one of the big differences between male and female subs, in terms of how much this tool gets used. Now, I have to asterisk pretty much everything that follows with the statement that overall, I don't get into many different kinds of humiliation play as a regular thing.

Having said *that*, I am the guy who started a sexual fantasy thread once on women making fun of a man's cock size. So now that I've gone and made the water clear as mud...

For me, the best way to sum up my view on this from either the sub or Dom role is I'm willing to look at it, but I need to rally get inside someon'e head first and know them. I think if one's going to go with this you've got to have a lot of trust there so that it doesn't range from "humiliation play" into genine emotional abuse, which is a gray line granted, but an important line to draw all the same. In my view I'd need a clearly defined set of "okay" topics to delve into for something like this. And I think communication before and after scenes invovling this is definitley very important.

I don't consider myslef a sub male who's really that much into the humilation play, though there are certain areas I'd explore given the right conditions. I stumbled across a FemDom paysite (the link of which I can't provide, though it's preview pages would make for interesting material on the current subject) that deals pretty much exclusivly with this activity. I found it... somewhat interesting, though not something that really turned my personal crank. I think a lot of this depends on what you find humiliating. Some guys seem to want to get "feminized" and put in dresses and makeup (that's one of the sects that's not my thing, though I don't have any problem with it either). Some want to get called names. Some seem to really enjoy the fantasy of being with a woman who makes it clear that one man just isn't enough for her and that she has no intention of sticking with just one male - that also goes off and intermingles with cuckolding. Some guys like to be giggled at in sexual moments. I'm sure there's other stuff too that either slipped my mind or I'm just not aware of.

The common element between these things seems to be a couple themes. One, women who put men, as a whole, down pretty openly. This for me is a big part of why I don't get into it more. I don't need to hear the line "men are pigs" as part of my sex play, thanks very much. I prefer to view FemDom as a tool to elevate women, not lower men. I think for me that's a big difference there. Though clearly there are plenty who get into the idea, and deal with it just fine for themselves. Two, many of these different themes deal with women being more agressive and assertive, and men who like to see that kind of (for women) unorthodox behaviour expressed openly. That part I think I understand better, to a degree. I tend to be drawn to confident women, regardless of D/s role. This kind of play for some can certainly "exagerate" that kind of attitude in a way they find appealing.

It's kind of odd. Women are, as a generalization, better at dealing with feelings. Men are, as a generalization, better at coping with physical pain. Yet you can find as many female subs as you like who are masochists, and plenty of sub men into being humiliated. I'm not sure what the message in that is, I never really thought about it before.

There's a lot going on with this topic. I don't know what else to say on it, yet. Hopefully there will be more input to follow.

[annie]

It's kind of odd. Women are, as a generalization, better at dealing with feelings. Men are, as a generalization, better at coping with physical pain. Yet you can find as many female subs as you like who are masochists, and plenty of sub men into being humiliated. I'm not sure what the message in that is, I never really thought about it before.

*Looking REALLY hard to find something else in Tw's post....

Actually, after rereading the entire thing, the above paragraph stuck out still. But, this time not so much for the men/pain reference *snickers.*

The part that stuck this time was the "Yet you can find as many female subs as you like who are masochists, and plenty of sub men into being humiliated."

Perhaps that entire sentence is the key (or at least a portion of it.) Women are more emotional... therefore what a female sub may experience that is "defined" as humiliation is processed mentally to help them overcome/deal with the feeling of humiliation, at times being processed into the emotion of love, devotion, pleasure, anger, etc. That way women are better able to protect their mental states without letting the emotion of "humiliation" take over. But, i do think, on some levels it is an automatic response and is just how women are programmed.

In the same process women who are masochists *raises my hand* perhaps enjoy that aspect of it due to the fact that it is a straight forward, somewhat simple emotion to deal with (for the most part) and doesn't confuse/muddle up things when they finally slip to that edge. But... this thread is not about pain... so moving on!

Men on the other hand tend to shy away from emotions. So when some men ask (beg) for humiliation are they really searching for the true emotion or for the physical reaction that is evoked of a stronger/Dominate female figure? Is their desire for humiliation accurate or is it viewed by them as part of the foreplay.

There is a thread on here from Silke about a humiliation task she had done in the Academy (which i can't find at the moment...grrrrr) and the affects after it until she was able to speak to her Master and the TM that assigned it. That is just one example of how the emotions, etc. continued to play out in the sub after the task. What i now wonder though is, had it been a male sub (which the task is not designed for), what would the after emotions have been? Would they have had the need for reassurance or assuming the top analogy is somewhat accurate, would the after effects of the assignment been more sexually/arousal based?

*Disclaimer ~ i am not trying to generalize all women and men on the emotional aspects... just wondering out loud!*